Looking for Another Diesel

retmil46 · **Posted:** Thu May 04, 2006 4:22 am

This may not entirely be in keeping with LOST, but from what I've seen of other forums the intelligence level is head and shoulders above the rest, and I would trust the opinions and feedback from this forum more than I would any other, and there are quite a number of current/former TDI owners here, so here goes.

Last week while I was at work, one of my maternal uncles came to visit my parents. He asked my mother if I'd be willing to part with my old '87 Subaru wagon, and how much I'd want for it. At first I only gave it passing consideration, but then the wheels started turning (not to mention the smoke coming out of the ears). I'd been wanting to get a TDI for a few years, for high mileage commuting, and now that I'd cut my diesel teeth on the CRD, this seems like a good opportunity.

Decided that I wanted to go with a '03 or earlier, as according to fueleconomy.gov the '04 models and later the MPG ratings have been gradually going downhill.

On autotrader, going out 100 miles from my zip code, there were only 10 listings for an '03 or older TDI with a 5 speed stick, 23 with an automatic. While I wouldn't mind trying out one of the Tiptronic autos, the listings weren't clear if this was on any of the ones listed and I had no clue on what models they were offered on, I decided to stick with the 5 speed listings.

Below are the three 5 speed listings that look most promising. I'd appreciate any opinions, especially as to whether or not the price is within reason.

'03 Jetta GL sedan, 72K miles, private seller, photos inside and out, looks immaculate, white w/ beige cloth, asking $13K.

'03 Golf GL 2 door hatchback, 51K miles, silver, dealer, outside photo only, supposedly passed VW 112 inspection, asking $14900.

'03 Jetta GLS sedan, 47K miles, dealer, photos inside and out, looks good, green w/ beige cloth, price unlisted (sent dealer an e-mail, said either quote me ballpark or I'm not driving 50 miles one way).

And then there's the lowball option. Gent at work has an '81 VW pickup, says he has a line on another with a new engine and solid body but is in need of some paint. I told him paint doesn't have anything to do with MPG, and might be the perfect vehicle for playing around with an SVO setup if I get the urge.

oldnavy · **Posted:** Thu May 04, 2006 6:26 am

My choice would be the Golf, it is same in front seat as Jetta as for as room, but the back end is like a staton wagon. I tried to get the wife to buy a Golf, but she insisted on a Jetta sedan, but no wagon. Otherwise we would have traded the Magnum in for the Jeep and had two diesels now.

BLake · **Posted:** Thu May 04, 2006 10:32 am

My family has owned numerous VWs since the 1960s. I still have a Corrado that I bought new in 1990. I counted 13 VWs in the driveway at a family gathering a few years back. It's safe to say that my family and I like VWs.

Repeat after me: I will NEVER buy a VW with an automatic transmission. Say this 3 times and proceed with your shopping. Trust me on this one. Manual transmission-good, auto-bad.

BLake · **Posted:** Thu May 04, 2006 10:48 am

I looked at a few Jettas last year that I found in auto trader. One ad looked good so I drove 30 miles to check it out. The kid that owned it showed up in a Lexus or something. I said no, I'm here to look at your Jetta. He ran off to get it. The whole thing was starting to look real shady. I asked him if it was his personal car. He said it was but he had no maintenance records and only one key for the car. The right wheel well had extensive damage as if the wheel had been pushed back into the wheel well whole turning. Odd, the damage didn't show up on a Carfax report and he claimed he never wrecked it. It was fresh damage with overspay on top of dirt.

Long story short, he was brokering cars. Borderline illegal because he didn't have a dealer license. VW diesels are hot again and the junk is on the market because some idiot will buy it. I gave up on a Jetta because eveyrthing for sale had issues. Don't buy anything until you look at it in person.

That pickup would be real interesting. 50mpg, if tuned right. Could you give me a shout if you don't want it? My brother is real good at fixing these.

IndyCRD · **Posted:** Thu May 04, 2006 11:17 am

I had an '03 Golf TDI and LOVED that car. I wish I hadn't gotten rid of it....traded it in on a Honda....couldn't stand it and got the Jeep.

The Golf looks very small, but for your reference: one time I had to go buy a new dishwasher for my house. The dishwasher (box and all) slid right in the back when the seats were folded down. I also carried 8' 2x4s in it by sliding them over the back seat and down into the passenger from footwell. It was a great car.

I agree, you will be much more happy with a manual transmission.

vtdog · **Joined:** Fri Sep 30, 2005 11:27 am **Posts:** 640

I had a '78 Rabbit diesel that I drove for almost 200k miles when I had to get rid of it because it would not pass inspection anymore. The floor pans had rusted out and there was only carpeting on the floor. In addition, the rust was so bad at the rear, the wire coat hangers I was using could no longer hold up the bumper. All in all, it was a great car, got 52+ mpg in the summer, started in bitter cold and needed very little care. I sold it to someone who pulled the engine to put in a vw rabbit pickup. It could still be running today for all I know.

Guest · **Posted:** Thu May 04, 2006 2:57 pm

BLake wrote:

Repeat after me: I will NEVER buy a VW with an automatic transmission. Say this 3 times and proceed with your shopping. Trust me on this one. Manual transmission-good, auto-bad.

That was the attitude in my family until we got an '05 TDI Golf with the Tiptronic auto-stick transmission. Awesone, just awesome.

TDICRD58 · **Joined:** Sun Apr 30, 2006 5:29 pm **Posts:** 21

I have a 2001 Jetta TDI with 60K miles. It is NOT for sale. I bought it new and the whole family fights over it.

1- real world gas mileage 40 city, 60 highway (A/C off) at 70 MPH. The TDI LOVES high speed highway - think Autoban!
2- the overall fuel average is 43 and it is as consistent as it is German - YA YA
3- These vehicles do not rust or die - 10 year warranty - 100,000 mile engine warranty on '01 models.
4- only issues have been nit picky electrical stuff - a bad glow plug triggers the check engine (MILF) light - the secret is to buy your own OBDII code reader and a Haynes manual. You can fix 90% of it in the driveway
5- TDICLUB.com & DIESELGEEK.com are great resources. Also a honest fair dealer is extremely important.
6- the engines take 20K to fully break-in, dealers will tell you not to change the engine oil between 10K and 20K and to thrash it as hard as humanly possible to seat the rings - the CRD is about to get the same punishment at 10K - you bought a diesel - they LOVE to work hard!!!
7- Mine is a 5 speed manual and the Germans really know how to make sweet gearboxes - the gear ratio's are different than the gas models and tuned to the torque band of the TDI - Detroit would never understand or spend the money to tune the box or make it shift so sweet
8- The whole family has stories of guys in Suburbans or H2's flagging us down and asking if it's for sale - they are getting there just payback at $3 gallon for driving that oversized boulevard cruiser

To sum it up it is probably the best car I have ever owned and my wife will divorce me if I sell it. We hope the CRD is nearly as good.

NetworkMD · **Joined:** Fri Mar 17, 2006 11:36 pm **Posts:** 25

I have an 03 Jetta gls tdi and completely agree with TDICRD58, I drive mostly hiway 70 mph and get about 60 mpg, I have maintained a spreadsheet since new and averages 56 mpg overall. I love the manual very smooth I can shift it with just a couple of fingers. Keep in mind the timing belt will need to be changed around 100K miles, as this is a interference design.

Good luck

naturist · **Posted:** Thu May 04, 2006 9:48 pm

By the sheerest coincidence, there happen to be 2 luminescent green new Beetle TDIs for sale right here in Lynchburg, VA, not so very far from you after all. One is a 2002, has 55,000 miles on it, and is at Terry VW. The other is a 2001 and is at Wolf Creek Motorworks. Terry may have other models, too.

It is highly unlikely either was listed anywhere on the net. Terry VW's number is 434-239-2601; Wolf Creek's number is 434-237-1007. Terry sells a LOT of TDIs.

KJMedic · **Posted:** Thu May 04, 2006 10:35 pm

There is a New Beetle at Carmax in GSO on auto trader

retmil46 · **Posted:** Fri May 05, 2006 1:48 am

Wow, ask and ye shall receive! Thanks guys!

Turns out the white 72K Jetta is sold, got a reply by e-mail.

No reply by e-mail on the Golf, I'll call in the morning.

Called on the 47K Jetta. Small dealership in Morganton NC, actually got the dealership owners wife on the phone. Car was a local trade-in, one owner, traded in after husband and wife parted ways. :roll:

Quoted 16900 at first but immediately said they might be willing to deal and drop down to 16. Considering the miles and that it's a GLS model, doesn't sound bad. She had no idea that this beast could get upwards of 50 MPG, thought the original owner was BS'ing her. Sounds like perhaps I should get up there and grab it before she does realize what she has. :shock:

If anyone wants to doublecheck what I'm looking at, I was using the advanced search on autotrader. Zip code 28115, 100 miles out, all body styles, VW, all models, 1981 to 2003, any price, diesel fuel, manual trans.

Thanks for the lead on the two green NB's, if the Golf or the 47K Jetta don't pan out, I might resort to these. Lime green isn't my favorite color, but at 50 MPG, paint is cheap and diesel isn't. To me, it looks like a giant M & M.

valkraider · **Posted:** Fri May 05, 2006 7:20 pm

We loved our 2002 TDI new Beetle for 60,000 miles. We sold it to a friend as we dropped to one vehicle (we didn't need two).

If I get another car it will most likely be another VW TDI.

retmil46 · **Posted:** Sun May 07, 2006 12:09 am

Darn the bad luck.

The white 72k Jetta private seller I already mentioned was sold.

The Golf, I contacted the dealer, it had been sold a month ago, they just forgot to take their ad off the net. :evil:

The 47K Jetta that was available, I got a voicemail the next day from the dealer, someone from Atlanta called up and dropped a $2K deposit on it and was coming up this weekend to pick it up. :cry:

Sorry, but I'm not going to buy a pig in the poke, drop a deposit on a car I haven't even seen, much less test drove, and risk not geting it back if I decide I don't want the car and the dealer decides to be a jerk. That makes it hard to fight the dealership headhunters, the guys that go around and grab all the decent and in demand used cars as soon as the ad hits the net.

When I checked on fueleconomy.gov, up thru '03 the TDI's were still rated 49 HWY. For '04 and '05, they dropped down to 45 HWY. For '06, it had dropped down to 42 HWY. Any info on what the real life MPG is on the 04-05 and 06 models, just in case I have to go that route?

oldnavy · **Posted:** Sun May 07, 2006 8:03 am

Here's the best place to find out, TDI Forum is the definitive place for the VW TDI.

BLake · **Posted:** Sun May 07, 2006 8:04 pm

Perhaps I was too harsh in my condemnation of the VW automatic trans. I looked at http://autos.msn.com/ and found that reliability of the automatic is not a concern for 2001 to present. I still wouldn't touch an 80s or 90s automatic.

The auto tranny does take a bit of pep out of the engine and nicks the mileage by a few MPGs. I know my brothers Jetta will accelerate briskly UP a Utah mountain highway, to at least 80MPH, with 4 people in the car. I don't think an auto tranny Jetta can do that.

oldnavy · **Posted:** Sun May 07, 2006 8:15 pm

BLake wrote:

Perhaps I was too harsh in my condemnation of the VW automatic trans. I looked at http://autos.msn.com/ and found that reliability of the automatic is not a concern for 2001 to present. I still wouldn't touch an 80s or 90s automatic.

The auto tranny does take a bit of pep out of the engine and nicks the mileage by a few MPGs. I know my brothers Jetta will accelerate briskly UP a Utah mountain highway, to at least 80MPH, with 4 people in the car. I don't think an auto tranny Jetta can do that.

Gear ratios for the 4 spd auto and 5 spd manual are the same, the problem of mpg loss was due to having a torque converter. The really good auto trannys are the Triptronic 5 spd auto and the 6 spd DSG trans in the VW's. DSG are high maintance with 40k mile $$$$ synthetic fluid change, but all the fun of manual tranny only no clutch.

Drewd · **Joined:** Mon Feb 06, 2006 12:24 pm **Posts:** 902

My 04 PD Wagon was getting 49 mpg on summer diesel using 5w-30 and 47 mph using 5w-40

In the winter, I was getting 43-45 mpg regardless of of oil viscosityon winter diesel.

My 06 PD TDI Sedan with 4k miles on it hit 45mpg on the last tank.

My driving is 120 miles of mostly highway with cruise control use. My brother 06 TDI with DSG auto pulled 47mpg last weekend on a 300 mile road trip. I suspect they drove slower.

retmil46 · **Posted:** Mon May 08, 2006 12:47 am

It's good to hear that even though they're not hitting upwards of 60 MPG like the '03's and earlier did, that they're still making a mockery of the EPA ratings. 45 MPG and over is still nothing to sneeze at, and the hybrids are still the only vehicles that can beat them (on paper at least) for MPG.

Looking for Another Diesel

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