CRD Head Gasket - What's the Prognosis?

kafingerlos · **Posted:** Mon Mar 30, 2015 12:57 pm

How was the ERG cooler leak diagnosed? I've been wondering about that and it's the one "external" cause that nobody has talked about in conjunction with my issues.

Thanks!

funnyman06 · **Joined:** Sun Jul 06, 2014 7:46 pm **Posts:** 180

Through my testing I could not be 100% sure that thats what the issue was. While diagnosing the jeep I bypassed the EGR cooler coolant lines, and still found I had issues. But i believe that when they took the head off they found the head gasket was in good condition, leaving only 1 possible entry for coolant into the combustion chamber. I already have the weeks elbow installed and the EGR system is pretty much all removed from the jeep. Im hoping the manifold plug will be ready soon so i can cap that off and clean everything up. Also I have the GDE Eco tune

geordi · **Posted:** Mon Mar 30, 2015 3:55 pm

Funnyman: Who had your CRD and told you that the head gasket "was fine" yet the head and all four liners were supposedly cracked? This doesn't compute.

First of all, the head gasket has a coating on it and that is the primary reason why you shouldn't re-use the gasket. But I'm also concerned about their claims that the liners were cracked - did you have water in the oil? Oil in the water? Or was it just a water leak? The liners are extremely strong hardened steel, MUCH stronger than the head (aluminum) or the rest of the block (cast iron) and they need to be, to withstand the 2500+ psi of combustion pressures and temperatures.

I hope they actually showed you the damaged parts, and that you weren't taken for a ride by some dealer or fraudulent shop. Unfortunately, it has happened before.

kafingerlos · **Posted:** Sat Apr 04, 2015 8:00 pm

So an interesting twist in my ongoing story today. I had borrowed a cooling system pressure tester last week and pumped up the system to about 25psi, and let it set for a couple 3 days. A couple things happened during this test - 1.) the system did not hold the full pressure I'd put on it, in fact it'd lost about 10psi in about 12 hours. The second was that the coolant level dropped, dropped, and dropped. At the conclusion of the test there was no coolant left in the tank. Now the engine was dead cold, so no chance that it had "evaporated" a quart+ of coolant, and no puddles under the car. ...um.. ok, it has to have gone somewhere. Pulled the dipstick and the oil level is proper (as in not overflowing, and no evidence of coolant at the bottom). Conclusion - if it's not on the ground, and it's not in the oil, then it has to be inside the engine somewhere.

Pulled the intake elbow to gain access to the glowplugs today - thinking about Geordi's suggested test - during this procedure I jacked up the drivers front tire so I could get under that corner with a loooonng extension and try to get one of the bolts to the intake manifold. While I was down there with the front end elevated I noticed coolant pouring from the front of the muffler. Seems there is a pinhole on the front just below the inlet. Raising the front end allowed the coolant to move from wherever it had pool (in the catalytic converter maybe?) down to the muffler and out this hole. Made a nice big puddle about mid-way back on the passenger side of the jeep.

My intent at this point is to repeat the test - filling the coolant reservoir first; but after I've pulled all 4 glow plugs. Then procede with Geordi's suggestion of turning the motor over with no plug and the injectors disconnected to verify that the coolant is not entering the cylinders. Just gotta figure out how one gets the electrical connection off the end of the glow plug.

I'm also wondering how hard it would be to bypass the EGR and cooler (short of a "weeks" kit) to see if I can verify that it is or is not the problem.

flash7210 · **Posted:** Sat Apr 04, 2015 9:39 pm

Sounds familiar.
That's almost the exact same test I performed six weeks ago.
Except I only let it sit under pressure for 30 min. That was enough to fill up cylinder #2 with water.

You definitely have either a head gasket leak or a EGR cooler leak.
At this point you will probably have a difficult time telling the difference because you likely already filled one of the cylinders with water.

With mine. I was convinced that is was the head gasket (and still am) but after removing the head and all the EGR parts I did a quick test of the EGR cooler. Sure enough, it was leaking.

geordi · **Posted:** Sat Apr 04, 2015 9:56 pm

I'm concerned about one (or several) of the cylinders being filled with water, they really don't like marinating like that, so *please* get those glow plugs out and get the cylinders drained.

As far as bypassing the EGR cooler, that is fairly easy.

The water line that exits the head on the driver's side between #2 and #3 should be disconnected, and a fresh section of hose (and clamps) used to bring that water connection across the top of the engine and to the Y connection by the thermostat. The metal hard pipe and the short section of rubber hose at the Y pipe are the other end - just remove the metal hose from the Y and put your fresh hose in place.

Next - Don't pressurize the system to more than 16PSI, that is the normal holding pressure of a cooling system anyway - anything above that will just be vented at the radiator cap, and if it didn't... Then you are at risk of causing more significant damage from too much pressure.

kafingerlos · **Posted:** Sun Apr 05, 2015 4:43 pm

Ok, I got the glow plugs out. Picture below, plugs are numbered 1-4 left to right. I've had the truck since 45,000 miles, and according to my records only plug #2 has ever been replaced. I'll also note that the last time #2 was replaced they also replaced the glow plug controller.

Does anyone else spot something wrong with this picture?

Going to hook the battery back up so I can crank it over now.

geordi · **Posted:** Sun Apr 05, 2015 6:08 pm

Well THERE's your problem! (one of them at least!)

Obviously the idiots "upgraded" your glow plugs to the 5 volt metal version... They just forgot to either replace the other 3 with the proper lower-voltage plugs... OR they forgot to flash the computer and killed that #2 plug and it is only the metal jacket that has kept it from exploding into your cylinder. Be glad for that, if that is what the idiots did.

Now, about the rest of that picture. It looks like #4 has been working fine (at some point) but also shows signs of coolant burning on the tip. That is unusual, because coolant on a glow plug usually causes it to crack and explode - failure. #1 looks the best, #3 and #1 both look like "normal" diesel combustion to me, but #3 also shows signs of a combustion leaking past the sealing ring at the base of the plug. The barrel shouldn't be that filthy and scorch-y looking. That suggests cylinder #3 will be the wet one, which would be the usual location for the head bolts to fail, and #4 could just be a minor leak as a consequence of the combustion pressure opening up the leaves in the gasket.

I still think the head needs to come off.

kafingerlos · **Posted:** Sun Apr 05, 2015 6:13 pm

Well, judging by the sopping wet paper towels, and the cloud of stuff that smelled strongly of antifreeze that came out of the glow plug holes I have a blown head gasket. Appears to impact at least cylinders two and three. I didn't notice any great amount of "cloud" come from the outside holes, nor did the paper towels pick up more that what appears to be the "standard" dirt off the side of the engine.

I guess now to figure out where the head gasket 'tab' is supposed to be, and what voltage is actually being supplied to the glow plugs.

Kenneth

kafingerlos · **Posted:** Sun Apr 05, 2015 8:14 pm

So on the glow plug voltage topic - I can confirm that my multi-meter shows 3.7-3.8v for a short period of time after the ignition is turned on. Glow plug controller is BOSCH 0 281 003 034 with markings 12V, 905, and 4 Zyl.

Dealer notes refer to it as part number 56044671AC. Also note the installation of PN 68090430AA in Cylinder #2.

kafingerlos · **Posted:** Mon Apr 13, 2015 5:56 pm

For any who are following, slow progress is being made.

Have the turbocharger, exhaust manifold, and thermostat off the exhaust side of the engine. Have the IE elbow, EGR valve and cooler off the intake side. High marks for WD40 Specialist for releasing all the corroded nuts and bolts.

The entire exhaust system on this is wet with coolant. At least I'm assuming it's not normal for the turbo to drip green when you take it off. Thus every hose or pipe drips wet when it comes off.

I guess next up is to tear down the top (fuel rail, injectors) and then I'll tackle the serpentine and timing belts.

flash7210 · **Posted:** Mon Apr 13, 2015 6:19 pm

When I pulled my head to replace the head gasket, there was water in the exhaust manifold and turbo. It's only normal if you have a blown head gasket, leaking EGR cooler, or cracked head.
Hopefully your head is not cracked.

Why did you say dripping green?

Last I checked the proper coolant is not green but a light yellowish orange color.

kafingerlos · **Posted:** Mon Apr 13, 2015 7:03 pm

Dripping green - because the "universal - mix with any color" antifreeze that was used to top it up after it's last time being driven was green. Actually the stuff the dealer filled it with seemed to have a slight reddish color.

Definitely a blown head gasket, leaking EGR cooler, or both. Working towards answering the question of the condition of the head.

geordi · **Posted:** Tue Apr 14, 2015 2:17 am

Your CRD has been inhaling so much coolant, that I will forego the conversation about those "universal" coolants. Just accept that the short version is this: They aren't universal, and don't mix them with a true HOAT coolant like the Zerex G05 or any other good Extended Life Coolant. But that is irrelevant right now.

Congrats on getting the side of the head torn down, the rest at this point should be cake. Just remember to put tags on the wire for the #4 injector, and DO MARK the injectors with 1/2/3/4 (I use a silver sharpie) b/c they are specific to the computer.

As for the rest, you can tear it down as you see fit, but I usually leave the high pressure lines locked to the injectors and just unlock them from the rail. The fuel return block is plastic and FRAGILE. Don't disconnect the black return line from it (or from the inter-injector lines and PLASTIC tees) and just move the squeeze clip from the fuel rail and push that tube off the rail return. The injector return lines are clipped in with those wire clips (don't lose those) and then a careful pull STRAIGHT UP while gently poking with a thin pry tool will get them to pop out. The plastic is fragile, so take your time.

kafingerlos · **Posted:** Tue May 26, 2015 12:25 am

Just an update and keepting this thread alive as I continue the tear down. 3-day weekend let me catch up with other projects and get a little further with the CRD.

Got the fan and shroud removed - thanks to Sir_Sam's youtube channel - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5o_FJpBEKjk - (Watch all 4 parts, good stuff!)

Getting the crankshaft pulley off (AKA vibration dampener) was a bit of a bugger. Again thanks to Sir_Sam's video I knew how it was supposed to come off. And a post here from GreenDiesel helped assure me that really really it just comes off... so smack it with a hammer a few times.

Got the timing cover off, and aligned the marks with the previous effort (timing belt was replaced ~5000 miles ago). Once again thanks to Sir_Sam I was able to verify the cam timing and flex plate alignment.

So now it's time to figure out (covered in part 4 of the videos) how to take off the timing belt, idlers, and pulleys.

racertracer · **Posted:** Tue May 26, 2015 2:20 am

Just a word to warning.... pressurizing the cooling system above 26lbs blows out the oil cooler, ask me how I know.

Stick to the 15-16lbs.

LMWatBullRun · **Posted:** Sat May 30, 2015 7:35 pm

If you are planning to remove the intake manifold/cam holder and/or the head, marking the sprockets won't help. Opinions vary quite a bit, but I like the factory cam sprocket holder a lot, BTW; you don't have to spring for that tool but you will need one.

kafingerlos wrote:

Just an update and keepting this thread alive as I continue the tear down. 3-day weekend let me catch up with other projects and get a little further with the CRD.

Got the fan and shroud removed - thanks to Sir_Sam's youtube channel - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5o_FJpBEKjk - (Watch all 4 parts, good stuff!)

Getting the crankshaft pulley off (AKA vibration dampener) was a bit of a bugger. Again thanks to Sir_Sam's video I knew how it was supposed to come off. And a post here from GreenDiesel helped assure me that really really it just comes off... so smack it with a hammer a few times.

Got the timing cover off, and aligned the marks with the previous effort (timing belt was replaced ~5000 miles ago). Once again thanks to Sir_Sam I was able to verify the cam timing and flex plate alignment.

So now it's time to figure out (covered in part 4 of the videos) how to take off the timing belt, idlers, and pulleys.

Rixram · **Posted:** Mon Jun 01, 2015 12:10 pm

racertracer wrote:

Just a word to warning.... pressurizing the cooling system above 26lbs blows out the oil cooler, ask me how I know.

Stick to the 15-16lbs.

Oh no. When did this happen?

kafingerlos · **Posted:** Mon Jun 08, 2015 12:30 am

Ok, time for the next installment. Got back to it this weekend, got the timing belt and cam pulleys off. Inside timing cover off. Fuel rail off, injectors pulled. Deep breath. Pulled the valve cover. And pulled the head.

The head gasket sorta separated when I pulled the head - one layer stuck to the block, one to the head, and the middle layer tried to hold onto both. In the end the block side won, and the block retained the gasket.

I've not yet tried to check the head for true since I think I'm either going to have to figure out how to retain or remove the rockers. I'm pretty sure I've read that you have to make sure they go back in the same place if you take them off/out. I'm open to suggestions.

Take a look at the photos below and share your thoughts. Does this look like "just a head gasket failure" or does it look like something more?

Timing belt and inside timing cover removed:

Injectors - 1 to 4 left to right:

Top of the head:

Why we need EGR Deletes on these thing ... intake passages are full of gunk:

Top of the head gasket (one hole):

Top of the block (under the gasket), after a little wipe-down and some mopping of the cylinders:

kafingerlos · **Posted:** Mon Jun 08, 2015 11:04 am

Also looking for suggestions as to how one would go about cleaning the crud out of the intake manifold? I'm guessing similar to cleaning the MAP sensor? Maybe some electrical parts cleaner or something? I'm envisioning feeding a rag through the runners with a string/cord so I can pull it out the intake vent?

CRD Head Gasket - What's the Prognosis?

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