Oil in the coolant reservoir

DannoCRD · **Joined:** Fri Apr 03, 2015 8:25 pm **Posts:** 10

Uhhh-Ohhhhhh,

That is never a good sign :grim:

...but it got a couple thousand knocked off at the dealer

. They would not go much lower, stating that somebody would still snap it up, since they are ultra-rare in CA. Frankly, they are correct in that aspect. I'd see them on the used cars websites, and two days later they were gone.

Sooooo, my son purchased this '06 Liberty CRD with only 70K miles. He INSISTED upon a Liberty CRD. Good man!!

Now, referring to the aforementioned inspection, I noted a thin skim of oil (blackened) floating on the top of the coolant res. Everything is running fine. I am keeping a close eye on the oil level and the coolant res, as well as the TEMP gauge. Since it is BLACK, I doubt that some bozo dumped oil into the res.

My suspicions are that there is a minor rupture in the head-gasket, allowing the higher-pressure oil channel to infiltrate the lower pressure coolant passage. I had this happen in a 4.0L Ford Explorer. I seriously doubt that a cracked block or head is in play (it is minusculey possible), though the stealership would likely tell you otherwise; as they warmly surround you with caring salesmen. These engines (block & head) seem robust and have a pretty good record.

I have also heard about cross-contamination, due to the oil cooler as well. The only way I can picture this, is if the cooler is integrated into the radiator.

I used to be a mechanic 20 years ago and still do most of my own maintenance up to and including R&R'ing cylinder heads. I am handy with tools.

If it is a head-gasket, I would replace the head-bolts likewise since they have been known to stretch. Any thoughts and comments are very welcome. Thanks in advance!!

flash7210 · **Posted:** Fri Apr 03, 2015 9:52 pm

There is a oil cooler on the passenger side of the block.
If it's leaking, oil could get into the coolant.

Not that it couldn't be a head gasket leak but most head gasket problems on this engine result in cylinder pressure leaking into the cooling system and loss of coolant.

DannoCRD · **Joined:** Fri Apr 03, 2015 8:25 pm **Posts:** 10

flash7210 wrote:

There is a oil cooler on the passenger side of the block.
If it's leaking, oil could get into the coolant.

Not that it couldn't be a head gasket leak but most head gasket problems on this engine result in cylinder pressure leaking into the cooling system and loss of coolant.

In my RAM-2500 CTD, I have TWO transmission fluid coolers. One is cooled via airflow. The other is a heat-exchanger with the coolant.

Is the CRD's oil cooler a liquid-cooled heat-exchanger, using the coolant to pull heat from the oil passages?? Had not though of that. Sure be nice if it were, so I would not have to do a tear-down.

Have not noticed any over-pressurization or bubbles in the tank; indicative of a leaking cylinder seal. With a warmed up engine off, the coolant bottles burps just a little, when the lid is removed.

papaindigo · **Posted:** Sat Apr 04, 2015 10:41 am

IIRC the CRD has:
1. a transmission fluid cooler in the bottom of the AC condensor so there should be no possibility of what you are seeing being tranny fluid.
2. an EGR cooler on the right, viewed from the front, rear of the engine but given that it's function is to cool the EGR valve as it lets some exhaust gas into the intake I don't see how oil could get into the coolant there.
3. a oil cooler on the left side, viewed from the front, of the engine below and forward of the turbo. Oil could get into the coolant from here.
Items 2 and 3 are visible in some of the images at viewtopic.php?f=98&t=74594&p=781854#p781854

If you have only a very small amount of oil I'd suggest a complete flush of the coolant system:
1. drain the coolant
2. add a good coolant flush, refill with demineralized water (available at any grocery store), operate the engine as recommended by the flush stuff
3. unfortunately the coolant system "low" point is below the radiator drain so you will need to repeat the fill and drain cycle, no need to add more flush chemical, multiple times to get all the old stuff out. How many - at least 5 based on related experience getting rid of non-spec antifreeze.

Alternatively you can try a Prestone Flush and Fill kit. It "should" work. I've used it on other gas and diesel engines just not this one. Look at viewtopic.php?f=5&t=56486&hilit=citric might try minus he citric acid.

I'd also pull the coolant tank and wash it out. If you do a) the tank engages a metal flange on the bottom so it must be pulled forward before it can the lifted up and b) as you lift it up be sure to unplug the wires that go to the coolant level sensor on the bottom of the tank.

Once the system is completely clean refill with HOAT coolant (Zerex G-05 or equivalent) and demineralized water at a 50/50 concentration. If you fill the coolant tank to about 1" above the midline flange after several drive cycles air will purge and the coolant level should settle to about the midline flange, add coolant if needed.

Monitor coolant level and if any more oil shows up and go from there. FYI checking coolant and oil level should NOT be done with the front of the vehicle on even a slight up slope, like a residential drive, as doing so will, I know, give you false low readings. Take readings only on a flat spot.

flman · **Posted:** Sat Apr 04, 2015 4:58 pm

Not knowing the history, I would do a cooling system flush, you never know if some one used a dirty pan to drain the coolant for a repair like a tstat, and put the dirty coolant back in? Being at a dealer you would think they would have changed the coolant if they saw this? BTW, pull the rad cap off 1st thing tomorrow before you start it and see if there is any pressure in the cooling system, maybe even give the upper rad hose a squeeze first to see if it is hard or soft.

ATXKJ · **Posted:** Mon Apr 06, 2015 2:44 pm

mine blew the oil cooler gasket at about 20k miles

lots of oil in the coolant reservoir - no indication of water in the oil

dealer replaced under warranty and flushed the cooling system 2-3 times

still has a light sheen of oil

olypopper · **Posted:** Mon Apr 06, 2015 5:30 pm

Definitely pull the oil cooler off and pressure check it vs pulling the head......as mentioned before, they usually leak combustion gases into the water jackets when running, not oil into the water jackets.

DannoCRD · **Joined:** Fri Apr 03, 2015 8:25 pm **Posts:** 10

Gave the radiator hose a squeeze while cool. It was NOT pressurized.

I think I will leave the coolant in [for now] and just remove the contents from the reservoir and thoroughly clean it out.

Once back together, I will monitor it closely. It will not surprise me if there are atomized deposits still in the coolant; which float to the top. I just want to see how LONG it takes to re-materialize.

No change in the oil dipstick at all, after 1000 miles.

geordi · **Posted:** Tue Apr 14, 2015 2:21 am

Cleaning the reservoir is a bit of a waste of time unless the rest of the coolant system is drained and also flushed clean. The bottle is an active participant in the coolant loop, it is not just the high point like in other vehicles.

The drain is on the radiator on the passenger side, and a short length of tubing onto that nipple can let you collect everything into a bucket. If the water in the bucket only has a light sheen (if anything) then the rest of the system is probably pretty clean. If you get a layer... Well, then you know what you have - contaminated water and it needs a flushing.

Good luck, I hope it is just the remnants from an old repair.

CRD4U2 · **Posted:** Wed Jun 10, 2015 8:00 am

Should the system have pressure when you check the cap in the morning? I have the same problem but with much more oil and I'm triing to figure out where should I start. I read that it is probably my oil cooler that is leaking oil in the coolant, so I will start with that. If it is leaking, will I need a new one or it is just a gasket? What else will I need? I just don't want to loose the jeep for a couple of week just cause I am waiting for parts.

geordi · **Posted:** Wed Jun 10, 2015 1:56 pm

Well, there are options here. The points on the engine where oil and water are nearby are very limited (thankfully) so the list of things to check is also short.

I would start by buying a 5/8" heater hose connecting elbow (plastic 90 degree elbow) so that you can disconnect the heater lines from the oil cooler and bypass it.

The engine will be just fine for a bit without this, it is just for testing purposes. Next, I would use some clear tubing from Home Depot or probably Canadian Tire has some, to make a loop from one port on the cooler to the other. You have now closed up the oil cooler entirely. IF it is leaking oil from the inside, you should know it pretty fast. The hose will become dirty or filled with oil, as there shouldn't be ANY flow through the coolant side of the cooler with nothing connected. If there is... You have your leak.

You can still drive the CRD like this, so you haven't lost use of it.

If that doesn't show any results however, then you will need to start considering a head gasket replacement. I'm willing to come up and do the labor, and you will get your CRD back running in the fastest amount of time - about 2 days downtime that could be done over a weekend or whenever it is convenient. The downside is the amount of labor overlaps with much of the other CRD-related upgrades that are strongly suggested, so if you wanted to install everything at the same time (Gasket, ARP studs, elbow kit, glow plugs, timing belt kit) then you would be looking at about $1400 US in parts and a total including travel of just over $3000 US.

But there is a BIG advantage to doing this: EVERYTHING will be done, and barring any non-CRD-specific issues, your Jeep should be perfect for the next 160,000km or 100k miles. It might hurt, but buy once, cry once. The results that everyone has said after they hear their engines run after all this is "Wow, it has never sounded so smooth" and as far as I know, the 40+ CRDs I've worked on are all still working hard. If you want to keep your CRD around for the long term and the oil cooler isn't the problem... This may be the best option.

flash7210 · **Posted:** Wed Jun 10, 2015 2:38 pm

geordi wrote:

I would start by buying a 5/8" heater hose connecting elbow (plastic 90 degree elbow) so that you can disconnect the heater lines from the oil cooler and bypass it.

The engine will be just fine for a bit without this, it is just for testing purposes. Next, I would use some clear tubing from Home Depot or probably Canadian Tire has some, to make a loop from one port on the cooler to the other. You have now closed up the oil cooler entirely. IF it is leaking oil from the inside, you should know it pretty fast. The hose will become dirty or filled with oil, as there shouldn't be ANY flow through the coolant side of the cooler with nothing connected. If there is... You have your leak.

Correct me if I am wrong, but I dont think that will work.
There is only one coolant outlet on the oil cooler. The coolant inlet is from the engine block.

geordi · **Posted:** Wed Jun 10, 2015 2:53 pm

Huh. I could have sworn it was a dual outlet. Now I'm not sure. I guess if it isn't a dual port... Then something else will need to be figured out.

CRD4U2 · **Posted:** Thu Jun 11, 2015 8:26 am

Yesterday, I removed the oil cooler on my spare parts liberty to see how long it would take and it is a pain in the stupid, but it takes around 3 hours to removed it. I will get a new gasket for it and install it in my running CRD and see if this fix the problem. Of course I will flush the system a couple of time and install a clean reservoir. If it doesn't fix the proplem, well I will have to do a head gasket job. I should have to touch anything timing belt related to change the head gasket? I would be installing ARP head stud with rebuilt heads. Thanks for the info geordi, I know it would run better but the timing belt has been done not long ago and money is the problem. The girlfriend will be home soon, so I would have her car to drive if the jeep is down for a longer period. I will keep you guys posted on the progress.

flash7210 · **Posted:** Thu Jun 11, 2015 10:42 am

The timing belt, cam sprockets, and inner timing belt cover all have to be removed be removed before you can remove the valve cover/intake manifold/camshaft holder and then remove the head bolts and head.
So yes, its a complete timing belt job with all its associated special tools and head gasket job.
IDparts has a timing belt parts kit and a head gasket parts kit.
Special tools are available for rent from Sasquatch Motorsports.

And while you are in there, you may want to consider doing a complete EGR delete if you haven't done it already.

CRD4U2 · **Posted:** Thu Jun 11, 2015 12:33 pm

Ok, so it is a big job. I hope it is the oil cooler that it leaking. If it is the head gasket, I will put it in the garage and buy parts when money is available to change everything that needs to be done.

Oil in the coolant reservoir

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