overheat

dr5chrome · **Posted:** Sat Aug 15, 2015 11:26 pm

Hello again all.... I am finally putting my rig to use as I intended. Today I am getting on the road.

I have done many things to this crd: green tune, belt, radiator clean and a new clutch fan.

I am pulling a small 14 ft trailer.

I'm totally disillusioned by the mileage, 20 mag at best, without the trailer.

Today, though it was hot today, my rig, not even on hills, got very hot. How do I keep my rig from overheating? ?

Help is greatly appreciated, dw

LMWatBullRun · **Posted:** Sun Aug 16, 2015 9:27 am

dr5chrome wrote:

Hello again all.... I am finally putting my rig to use as I intended. Today I am getting on the road.

I have done many things to this crd: green tune, belt, radiator clean and a new clutch fan.

I am pulling a small 14 ft trailer.

I'm totally disillusioned by the mileage, 20 mag at best, without the trailer.

Today, though it was hot today, my rig, not even on hills, got very hot. How do I keep my rig from overheating? ?

Help is greatly appreciated, dw

A few questions:

How hot did the gauge get?

Check the right hand reservoir on the coolant tank. Any liquid there?

Is there any pressure in the radiator or bubbling right after you start from a cold engine?

Have you been adding coolant? If so, what sort?

Poor mileage can be the result of lots of things; what problems/service has this CRD had that you know of? Mileage of your CRD?

dr5chrome · **Posted:** Sun Aug 16, 2015 3:38 pm

Lmw... thanks for the reply.

The Gauge went as high as just before the Red line. This crd the overdrive must be off or it will overheat pulling a load. Yet, even with the ac off, any kind of grade would send the gauge soaring. Even though this crd acts like the little engine that could. The power is there, but the heat gauge soars.

The coolant tank is full, and has the recommended Mopar coolant. The thermostat is also new, along with a system flush. From a dead cold start, running 1 minute, there's no pressure on the radiator cap. I see no bubbles coming up in the tank. The only cap I see is the one on the coolant tank.

The electric fan seems to be working properly.

I have to slow down to 40-45 mph, then I start to see the gauge show cooling down.

Could the green - tune be causing the over heating? ?
The mileage didn't improve after the tune.

I have done all the maintenance I can do on this jeep. It has now 100k miles, and runs good otherwise. .

Thanks, dw

papaindigo · **Posted:** Sun Aug 16, 2015 4:04 pm

It's possible you have a incorrectly calibrated temp gauge see http://www.greendieselengineering.com/j ... st/19.page and TSB 08-043-05. It's also possible you have a bad temp sender (mounted on back side of tstat housing). I'd suggest you invest in an infrared thermometer (under $20 at Amazon) and get some actual temp readings off the tstat housing when the temp gauge says the engine is hot.

If you have an incorrectly calibrated temp gauge any decent DCJ dealer can fix it. However, they may get stuffy about just doing the calibration, which takes all of 10 minutes or so, right up front. When I took my 05 in I had to get rather pushy with the idiot ticket writer who wanted lots of diagnostic time before running the calibration. I basically said do what I say or bring out the service manager. What I said was plug in the tool, check the calibration, if it's off fix it under the TSB if it's not off I'll pay for 15 minutes of shop time and do my own diagnostics. Bottom line my gauge was off and fixed at no charge.

If you need a copy of the TSB shot me an email not a PM

dr5chrome · **Posted:** Sun Aug 16, 2015 5:02 pm

Terrific, thanks. Wood2@dr5chrome.com

papaindigo wrote:

It's possible you have a incorrectly calibrated temp gauge see http://www.greendieselengineering.com/j ... st/19.page and TSB 08-043-05. It's also possible you have a bad temp sender (mounted on back side of tstat housing). I'd suggest you invest in an infrared thermometer (under $20 at Amazon) and get some actual temp readings off the tstat housing when the temp gauge says the engine is hot.

If you have an incorrectly calibrated temp gauge any decent DCJ dealer can fix it. However, they may get stuffy about just doing the calibration, which takes all of 10 minutes or so, right up front. When I took my 05 in I had to get rather pushy with the idiot ticket writer who wanted lots of diagnostic time before running the calibration. I basically said do what I say or bring out the service manager. What I said was plug in the tool, check the calibration, if it's off fix it under the TSB if it's not off I'll pay for 15 minutes of shop time and do my own diagnostics. Bottom line my gauge was off and fixed at no charge.

If you need a copy of the TSB shot me an email not a PM

dr5chrome · **Posted:** Sun Aug 16, 2015 7:48 pm

Papa... the flash for the gauge, is it important to have this done? What would be the consequences of leaving it be? I will not have opportunity to do this for at least 3 months.

Good news is I thought turning off my AC and slowing was being preventive...

Would the standard factory tune be better in these very hot conditions??

Thanks again, dr

Mountainman · **Posted:** Sun Aug 16, 2015 8:31 pm

dr5chrome wrote:

Papa... the flash for the gauge, is it important to have this done? What would be the consequences of leaving it be? I will not have opportunity to do this for at least 3 months.

Good news is I thought turning off my AC and slowing was being preventive...

Would the standard factory tune be better in these very hot conditions??

Thanks again, dr

Factory tune would create more heat via exhaust gas entering the intake, and I bet via poor efficiency. I've driven major grades with my GDE tuned CRD, and my stock one, and the GDE tune helps a bit with the cooling. I'll have to read all the way back, did you install the Hayden Heavy duty fan clutch? The stock ones are junk.

dr5chrome · **Posted:** Sun Aug 16, 2015 8:53 pm

It is a heavy duty, but not an off brand. The shop that changed it said something about it was some new change part. We had to order it from back east, no dealer had in stock. The mechanic said my old one was shot

dennyb · **Joined:** Wed Aug 13, 2014 4:27 pm **Posts:** 110

If you want to try a very big fan. The chevy pickups in late 90'S have the same clutch mount threads and fan direction. Changed a base plow truck at work from smaller than liberty 5 blade metal to 13 blade plastic from suburban. Suburban fan was slightly larger diameter though.

Mountainman · **Posted:** Mon Aug 17, 2015 12:08 pm

dr5chrome wrote:

It is a heavy duty, but not an off brand. The shop that changed it said something about it was some new change part. We had to order it from back east, no dealer had in stock. The mechanic said my old one was shot

There are a lot of reports online of these fan clutches being faulty upon installation. Can you hear it engaging? Or, better yet, when the guage shows about 2/3's (I wouldn't take it hotter personally), stop real quick, and see if that fan is humming a lot louder than it does when cold. Shouldn't be too hard to get a feel for how fast it spins, or how loud it is at a cold idle (I think), and it should be a significant difference. If the fan isn't engaged, it's probably the sender unit calibration, but could be a bad fan clutch also. You could try the oven test if you think the clutch is bad.

dr5chrome · **Posted:** Mon Aug 17, 2015 4:46 pm

Update. . I don't believe this diesel is having issue with this 14' trailer. It just doesn't make sense. I can't say for sure if the new fan clutch is defective, but everything seems to be working. Wasting another 300 seems pointless. The fan is turning well at all rpm that I can tell. The only thing I can think of is to remove the fan clutch all together. . Don't know if that will make a difference.

I am currently on the road, and at a loss. If I could trade this diesel in for a gas. pulling this small trailer is becoming a real pain.

LMWatBullRun · **Posted:** Tue Aug 18, 2015 7:47 am

dr5chrome wrote:

Update. . I don't believe this diesel is having issue with this 14' trailer. It just doesn't make sense. I can't say for sure if the new fan clutch is defective, but everything seems to be working. Wasting another 300 seems pointless. The fan is turning well at all rpm that I can tell. The only thing I can think of is to remove the fan clutch all together. . Don't know if that will make a difference.

I am currently on the road, and at a loss. If I could trade this diesel in for a gas. pulling this small trailer is becoming a real pain.

Get a cheap IR thermometer and check the thermostat housing temperature. If the stat temp is normal ~190 to 200 degrees F, then the gage needs calibration. I would then drive on with no worries.

The CRD will pull a LOT of load, without overheating, if functioning properly. If you are in fact hot at the Tstat, and the fans are all running as they should then it is possible that your stat has failed closed. Check the radiator temp and see if the radiator is significantly colder than the stat. I installed the Hayden and have had no cooling problems at all even when pulling 4000 pounds up steep mountains on VERY hot days.

papaindigo · **Posted:** Tue Aug 18, 2015 8:34 am

Assuming your issue is temp gauge calibration not fixing it right away is no problem. However, I would not assume the apparent overheating is a gauge issue as real overheating is a problem. Hence my and several other members recommendation to use an IR thermometer to check the actual temp at the thermostat housing when you appear to be overheating. Based on that reading you can determine if a) it's the gauge in which case just drive or b) real overheating which needs to be fixed.

The OEM fan clutch is a known weak point and the typical replacement is a Hayden 2905 which engages a bit earlier than a good OEM fan clutch. It's not clear to me what fan clutch you have and I'm a bit concerned about the comment that you " had to order it from back east" as the Hayden if not in stock at a parts store should be readily available at their warehouse. In any case under normal operating conditions the fan will spin as the clutch is not frictionless so the fact that the fan is spinning does not tell you anything about the fan clutch. If the fan clutch is working properly when it engages the fan will not be "just" spinning rather it will be "howling" (e.g. spinning real fast in time with engine rpms).

dirtmover · **Posted:** Tue Aug 18, 2015 9:23 am

papaindigo wrote:

It's possible you have a incorrectly calibrated temp gauge see http://www.greendieselengineering.com/j ... st/19.page and TSB 08-043-05.

LMWatBullRun wrote:

Get a cheap IR thermometer and check the thermostat housing temperature. If the stat temp is normal ~190 to 200 degrees F, then the gage needs calibration. I would then drive on with no worries.

Is this just a gauge calibration issue? If it was off would the correct temperature be reported to a scanner through the coolant temperature PID.

papaindigo · **Posted:** Tue Aug 18, 2015 11:45 am

dirtmover I have no clue

dirtmover · **Posted:** Tue Aug 18, 2015 1:29 pm

papaindigo wrote:

dirtmover I have no clue

Ah, I think the answer is in the thread you linked to. According to Keith the calibration is in the cluster module which means if you have access to a scan tool, e.g. torque, the ECU will indeed report the correct temperature to it.

dr5chrome · **Posted:** Fri Aug 21, 2015 12:54 am

hmmm.. after my last post, and the next days driving, i noticed this howl, that I had not noticed the days before. at the same time as this, as soon as I left Utah [travel up from SoCal-Utah I15~I80 to Dubuque]. I thought it might had been something kicking in that wasnt before, either the fan-clutch or the electric fan turned faster.. i dont know which.
the fact that the 1st 2 days were brutally hot, 100+ and lots of steep grades. After Utah it was much colder in Wyoming, and not as hot through NE then IA. not once after Utah did the heat gauge move off the center line... even on hills :dizzy:

So IDK if something started working right, or the weather cooled. It shouldnt had heated as it did the 1st days of driving...

papaindigo wrote:

Assuming your issue is temp gauge calibration not fixing it right away is no problem. However, I would not assume the apparent overheating is a gauge issue as real overheating is a problem. Hence my and several other members recommendation to use an IR thermometer to check the actual temp at the thermostat housing when you appear to be overheating. Based on that reading you can determine if a) it's the gauge in which case just drive or b) real overheating which needs to be fixed.

The OEM fan clutch is a known weak point and the typical replacement is a Hayden 2905 which engages a bit earlier than a good OEM fan clutch. It's not clear to me what fan clutch you have and I'm a bit concerned about the comment that you " had to order it from back east" as the Hayden if not in stock at a parts store should be readily available at their warehouse. In any case under normal operating conditions the fan will spin as the clutch is not frictionless so the fact that the fan is spinning does not tell you anything about the fan clutch. If the fan clutch is working properly when it engages the fan will not be "just" spinning rather it will be "howling" (e.g. spinning real fast in time with engine rpms).

Mountainman · **Posted:** Thu Aug 27, 2015 11:20 am

Maybe the fluid in your new clutch found it's way to where it belongs? I know the factory ones are stamped to store with a certain orientation when off the engine. Or, like someone mentioned, maybe you have a stuck stat, and it decided to open... Sounds like the fan is working now anyhow. If that stat is old, and might have stuck, I would get it replaced asap. I'd opt for Turbodieselfreaks stat since in 100k miles you will have probably paid for it without the hassle of the crap OEM ones.

pjigar · **Posted:** Thu Aug 27, 2015 12:18 pm

The stock stat is designed to fail in open position. Mine was failed so I went with inline stant 195F with marine aluminum stat housing. Traditional Stanton well fail stuck closed generally so I drilled 1/8" hole in stat skirt an insurance. My gauge is dead ventricle now. It used to be in 10-11 o'clock piston on highway.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Mountainman · **Posted:** Thu Aug 27, 2015 12:57 pm

pjigar wrote:

The stock stat is designed to fail in open position. Mine was failed so I went with inline stant 195F with marine aluminum stat housing. Traditional Stanton well fail stuck closed generally so I drilled 1/8" hole in stat skirt an insurance. My gauge is dead ventricle now. It used to be in 10-11 o'clock piston on highway.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Yeah, I have that inline clamshell setup with the hole in it, and after a lot of heavy towing, I finally developed a slow head gasket leak. If you don't pull heavy loads, or steep grades in hot weather, the clamshell is probably ok, but that hot fluid has to make it's way down the pipe a ways, meanwhile the coolant temp is still rising in the head...
-I am eager to test if the extra flow of the TDF stat helps for high load applications. Probably next summer...

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