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 Post subject: Glow Plug management .....GOT IT
PostPosted: Sun Oct 25, 2015 6:49 am 
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ok after many test I can say that the management of the GP's is in the ECU in the engine managment , I've tried with my file and glued two map that seem an old revison and in the same condition the voltage change ........EUREKA ,seem the old revison put more voltage and in different mode , now for what I've understand this file have the latest GP's managment

813
812
811
808
526

probably there are another file but this is what is in my hand's and I can compare


pratically if you have this map early the overboost map you have the last programming for the GP's


Image

Image

I' have compared my tune with same people that have the 5v Gp's ..........wihle I have the 7v GP's

identical management .......yes

now for what I have understand if you have the latest management you do not need to change the GCU or reprogram the ECU, no matter what code Chrysler write in the side of the GCU , is the same BOSCH number
said that the question is how is possible to put the 5v GP instead the 7v ?

simply new tecnology in the GP's , there is a second coil that increase resistence when the temp increase for preventing overheating , this coil can manage more voltage , an Bosch do this in the newest 5v GP's for our KJ , if search online you can find a great explanation of the tecnology
never one do this in the 7v .......prehaps Etecno inthe latest revison ..but I'm not sure

now this two map seem react at water temp and air temp , there are other map involved in the managment like a little map after the second posted that seem manage the altitude , but I must understand how to modify that map and any help is appreciated , I need to find the 12v high push and I need to lowering a bit the voltage , because I eat my GP's like a candies in the winter

the second map seem to decide when the GP's must active and the first manage in percentage ......i think ......the time and the voltage with a PWM ....but I need a hand's

thanks for all guys who can contribute

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 Post subject: Re: Glow Plug management .....GOT IT
PostPosted: Thu Oct 29, 2015 10:17 am 
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no one ?

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 Post subject: Re: Glow Plug management .....GOT IT
PostPosted: Thu Oct 29, 2015 2:16 pm 
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Can you provide the Hex values for the locations pictured on the 808 Tune and I will start snooping around to see if I can help?

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 Post subject: Re: Glow Plug management .....GOT IT
PostPosted: Thu Oct 29, 2015 3:38 pm 
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O yesss


one is at 0F5A38 and another is at 0F57E4

I think the second address work on the first in percentage , but I'm not really sure

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 Post subject: Re: Glow Plug management .....GOT IT
PostPosted: Thu Oct 29, 2015 3:55 pm 
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geordi and I spoke about this a bit today. As Yeti put it, there is a balance here between blowing plugs and having a reliable starting car. For those of us in the north the plugs don't have enough duty cycle to start when the temps drop below 20 or so. For those in the south, there is too much duty cycle and the plugs blow even though they are largely unnecessary for starting.

I've spoke with GDE about extending the GP duty cycle and there was certainly concern over the lifetime of the plugs. Understanding this more, it would be nice if we could give people the option to turn up or down their GP cycle depending on their requirement...the OE coding certainly isn't doing a good job of that.

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 Post subject: Re: Glow Plug management .....GOT IT
PostPosted: Thu Oct 29, 2015 4:23 pm 
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Hi cevans I'm a your satisfied Italian customer , and you are right , is nice if we can extend or lowering the time or the voltage in base of our necessity , but for what I have see , the max time the GP's stay on with the water temp sensor unplugged is 19 second , and the next time you cicle the key the voltage do not spike at 12 volt but stay a little bit over the first key on ,
example

1st key on 12v or less ....dependig of the battery healt ...for two second , about 4volt for one second and the rest of time you have 2,3 volt until the end of the cycle

next key on .......early the ECU shut off ....30 second when the key is in off .......you have a 2,44 volt for the entry cycle


I think for increase startability ........and I do it ..........to add a double dose of Power Diesel in White bottle when the temp drop below the -20 c , about 0 F , but here I can't see less than -20 c

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 Post subject: Re: Glow Plug management .....GOT IT
PostPosted: Thu Oct 29, 2015 4:47 pm 
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I'm in illinios and would be in favor of "turning up my glowplugs"

I would be willing to trade lifespan for being to start in 0 degree weather. Plus with the weeks kit, changing glowplugs is about an hour job for me if that

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 Post subject: Re: Glow Plug management .....GOT IT
PostPosted: Thu Oct 29, 2015 8:22 pm 
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jws84_02 wrote:
I'm in illinios and would be in favor of "turning up my glowplugs"

I would be willing to trade lifespan for being to start in 0 degree weather. Plus with the weeks kit, changing glowplugs is about an hour job for me if that

It's a thing of beauty.

Sent from my Nexus 6 using Tapatalk

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 Post subject: Re: Glow Plug management .....GOT IT
PostPosted: Thu Oct 29, 2015 9:57 pm 
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Yeti wrote:
I' have compared my tune with same people that have the 5v Gp's ..........wihle I have the 7v GP's

identical management .......yes

now for what I have understand if you have the latest management you do not need to change the GCU or reprogram the ECU, no matter what code Chrysler write in the side of the GCU , is the same BOSCH number
said that the question is how is possible to put the 5v GP instead the 7v ?

simply new tecnology in the GP's , there is a second coil that increase resistence when the temp increase for preventing overheating , this coil can manage more voltage , an Bosch do this in the newest 5v GP's for our KJ


Identical management, identical GCU and people paid money for ecu upgrade that isn't there?
There may be a few upset people if you are correct about this.


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 Post subject: Re: Glow Plug management .....GOT IT
PostPosted: Thu Oct 29, 2015 10:02 pm 
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jws84_02 wrote:
I'm in illinios and would be in favor of "turning up my glowplugs"

I would be willing to trade lifespan for being to start in 0 degree weather. Plus with the weeks kit, changing glowplugs is about an hour job for me if that

Get weeks grid heater, it helps a bit when below 0F. But you need a very reliable battery, or a dual battery system. The kit has a glow plug that draws about 30A, plus the glow plugs.

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 Post subject: Re: Glow Plug management .....GOT IT
PostPosted: Fri Oct 30, 2015 10:58 am 
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Squeeto wrote:

Identical management, identical GCU and people paid money for ecu upgrade that isn't there?
There may be a few upset people if you are correct about this.



the ECU reflash has needed only if you do not have the latest revision and I hope the dealer Know this and do not do a reflesh if is not needed , if not , what they do is not a clear operation

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 Post subject: Re: Glow Plug management .....GOT IT
PostPosted: Fri Oct 30, 2015 11:14 am 
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thermorex wrote:
jws84_02 wrote:
I'm in illinios and would be in favor of "turning up my glowplugs"

I would be willing to trade lifespan for being to start in 0 degree weather. Plus with the weeks kit, changing glowplugs is about an hour job for me if that

Get weeks grid heater, it helps a bit when below 0F. But you need a very reliable battery, or a dual battery system. The kit has a glow plug that draws about 30A, plus the glow plugs.


30amp....that's cute. I have an amp the pulls 500 on a burp. With my supercaps supplying it I'm not worried about that part. Lol

But the weeks heater has been on my radar

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 Post subject: Re: Glow Plug management .....GOT IT
PostPosted: Fri Oct 30, 2015 11:41 am 
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Yeti wrote:
Squeeto wrote:

Identical management, identical GCU and people paid money for ecu upgrade that isn't there?
There may be a few upset people if you are correct about this.



the ECU reflash has needed only if you do not have the latest revision and I hope the dealer Know this and do not do a reflesh if is not needed , if not , what they do is not a clear operation


If you need a little more heat, why don't you just put in 5v plugs then?


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 Post subject: Re: Glow Plug management .....GOT IT
PostPosted: Fri Oct 30, 2015 1:59 pm 
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because my problem is not more heat , but lowering the voltage because my jeep eat my gp's , btw the new 5v is probably the solution but i do not want spent any more money in this car

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 Post subject: Re: Glow Plug management .....GOT IT
PostPosted: Fri Oct 30, 2015 3:26 pm 
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Yeti wrote:
I need to lowering a bit the voltage , because I eat my GP's like a candies in the winter

Sorry, missed that.


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 Post subject: Re: Glow Plug management .....GOT IT
PostPosted: Fri Oct 30, 2015 5:27 pm 
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ok , I'll try to explain what I think ...............sorry is not simple for me

the second map decide when a voltage must sended at the GCU and the percentage of the voltage

example this map is a 16x16 bit and in a cold morning our battery is near at 12,4 volt , you can see a 15 bit on in the first 3 high push then 12,4 / 16 x 15 = 11,625

is near at my voltage reading

then go in the first map an you find a 12x12 map and I think is a time related

example 2 bit of high push for the 11,62 v = 2 second at 11,62 v and depending of air temp a 1/5 of this volt for 6 o 8 bit , bit is second in this map andwe obtained

2 second at 11,62v
6 second at 2,32v ....1/5 of 11,63

then after the end of this map there is a 120 bit map at 8192

8192 is the 1/5 of the value and dividend for 12 bit map we have 10 second

than we have

2 second at 11,62v
6 second at 2,32v ....1/5 of 11,63
10 second at 2,32v

now if is not too cold we have only the 11,62 v for 2s and 10 second at 1/5

the next key on we have about 2,48 volt for 10 second , 12,4 v ......in cold morning / 5 = 2,48v



what do you think of my tought ?

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 Post subject: Re: Glow Plug management .....GOT IT
PostPosted: Sat Oct 31, 2015 12:46 pm 
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the econd map seem they have the axis rpm/water temp or air temp ? and have the zero value in the rpm axis , this make me think that is the first key on , this map seem to cut the voltage around the 2750 rpm

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 Post subject: Re: Glow Plug management .....GOT IT
PostPosted: Sat Oct 31, 2015 10:18 pm 
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jws84_02 wrote:
thermorex wrote:
jws84_02 wrote:
I'm in illinios and would be in favor of "turning up my glowplugs"

I would be willing to trade lifespan for being to start in 0 degree weather. Plus with the weeks kit, changing glowplugs is about an hour job for me if that

Get weeks grid heater, it helps a bit when below 0F. But you need a very reliable battery, or a dual battery system. The kit has a glow plug that draws about 30A, plus the glow plugs.


30amp....that's cute. I have an amp the pulls 500 on a burp. With my supercaps supplying it I'm not worried about that part. Lol

But the weeks heater has been on my radar



Are you using a boost arrangement with super capacitors? Please do tell. I have been thinking about this for extra cranking speed on cold mornings.


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 Post subject: Re: Glow Plug management .....GOT IT
PostPosted: Sun Nov 01, 2015 6:54 am 
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OK I have do same test this morning , I have put to zero the nine peaks at 57344 in the first map , then the voltage dropped from 2,32 and 2,44 for the second key on at 2,18 and 2,3
this means that this map manage only the preglow in the low voltage phase , because the first two second at 11,65 remain and they work in percentage and I have understand how to mod this map for increase or decrease the low voltage phase .

other test in the second map

first I have shorted the pulse to 15 bit at 13 bit , no result

second test I have lowered the pulse from 57344 less 11% in the first 3 peaks , and the result is a little lower voltage in the preglow low voltage phase , but I'm not satisfied for the result , probably I have do something wrong ,btw this means that this map is rpm/temp resulting in voltage to apply at 1st map and probably to other , now the first two second remaing invariated , and I must find this map , because I want to put a 10 volt and increase the low phase for less stress at the GP's , now I do not understand if the first map do the time selection or not or there is another map btw for me is not useful , probably I have found the cranking phase map at this address 0F666E , but I'm not sure , is only a supposition

in conclusion this is the GP's management but I need more time and test , is wonderful if some one can find the two second high pulse

thanks in advance

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 Post subject: Re: Glow Plug management .....GOT IT
PostPosted: Sun Nov 01, 2015 8:43 am 
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ps :


for who want more heat from their glow plug , can try to increase the pre heat management increasing the 9 peaks at 57344 for one bit at the same value like in this image

Image


but I'm not responsible if you do a damage ,I have not tested it and you must do with the right tricks
and measure the output voltage and increase the value to obtain what you want

remember , more voltage -more heat and greater stress for the GP' and less duration


updating
this revison have the latest GP's management

813
812
811
808
526

this other need a ECU reflash

513-516-518-600-617-809

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