Glow Plug management .....GOT IT

thermorex · **Posted:** Sun Nov 01, 2015 11:24 pm

jws84_02 wrote:

thermorex wrote:

jws84_02 wrote:

I'm in illinios and would be in favor of "turning up my glowplugs"

I would be willing to trade lifespan for being to start in 0 degree weather. Plus with the weeks kit, changing glowplugs is about an hour job for me if that

Get weeks grid heater, it helps a bit when below 0F. But you need a very reliable battery, or a dual battery system. The kit has a glow plug that draws about 30A, plus the glow plugs.

30amp....that's cute. I have an amp the pulls 500 on a burp. With my supercaps supplying it I'm not worried about that part. Lol

But the weeks heater has been on my radar

But if that amp burps too much, you'll run out of power guarantee. The heater uses 30 amps and should stay on minimum 1 minute when below 10F, before you even switch the ignition on. I leave it 2 min on when about 0F. Then crank. Then on about 1-2 min at least. Then off. That's a lot of amp burps. Then it's the glow plugs, you'll drop to about 8-9 V on a very cold day with just a battery that's not pristine. That's probably some peak draw on bass or something and with capacitors, you don't suck the battery at once, like a winch in max load. And with such an amp you may consider 2 batteries anyways. If you have the metallic glow plugs then this heater is a very good addition. You should consider it imo.

Yeti · **Posted:** Mon Nov 02, 2015 7:39 am

next test , I'll try to reduce the lenght of the bit in the map , I think one bit and two bit less like this

and want to see how many voltage less I obtain

jws84_02 · **Posted:** Thu Nov 05, 2015 6:02 pm

I would be willing to trade lifespan for being to start in 0 degree weather. Plus with the weeks kit, changing glowplugs is about an hour job for me if that[/quote]
Get weeks grid heater, it helps a bit when below 0F. But you need a very reliable battery, or a dual battery system. The kit has a glow plug that draws about 30A, plus the glow plugs.[/quote]

30amp....that's cute. I have an amp the pulls 500 on a burp. With my supercaps supplying it I'm not worried about that part. Lol

But the weeks heater has been on my radar[/quote]
But if that amp burps too much, you'll run out of power guarantee. The heater uses 30 amps and should stay on minimum 1 minute when below 10F, before you even switch the ignition on. I leave it 2 min on when about 0F. Then crank. Then on about 1-2 min at least. Then off. That's a lot of amp burps. Then it's the glow plugs, you'll drop to about 8-9 V on a very cold day with just a battery that's not pristine. That's probably some peak draw on bass or something and with capacitors, you don't suck the battery at once, like a winch in max load. And with such an amp you may consider 2 batteries anyways. If you have the metallic glow plugs then this heater is a very good addition. You should consider it imo.[/quote]

I guess it would be something I would just test and see. If my voltage dipped at all I would just throw more caps in for reserve. I keep an abundance of them cuz sometimes I run 18 volts for some classes

Sir Sam · **Posted:** Sun Nov 08, 2015 8:04 pm

I'll have to sit down and think through this for what I want to do. Since I got my CRD back on the road I had been leaving the glow plugs disconnected but it finally got cool enough(and I'm working in North Dakota now)to need the glow plugs. I ended up plugging in my 5V glow plugs with the old 7V control.

Even with this setup I feel like it doesn't want to start as easily as it used to with the ceramics. Once temps drop closer to 0 I'll know more. I'm using the older 603 management so I "should" make some changes to accommodate the 5V GPs.

Yeti · **Posted:** Mon Nov 09, 2015 11:06 am

Sir Sam wrote:

I'll have to sit down and think through this for what I want to do. Since I got my CRD back on the road I had been leaving the glow plugs disconnected but it finally got cool enough(and I'm working in North Dakota now)to need the glow plugs. I ended up plugging in my 5V glow plugs with the old 7V control.

Even with this setup I feel like it doesn't want to start as easily as it used to with the ceramics. Once temps drop closer to 0 I'll know more. I'm using the older 603 management so I "should" make some changes to accommodate the 5V GPs.

ok I have see the 603 file posted in the first page of the DIY ecu flash and if is the same of your , they have the latest GP's management , and you can use the 5v with no problem with your GCU , now the 5v have a problem in cold start , because of their construction technology the second resistance present first the heating resistance is a thermal resistor and can manage more voltage......more heat more resistance and less voltage in the tip , preventing overheating but sucks in cold climate

mass-hole · **Posted:** Tue Nov 10, 2015 1:28 pm

Sir Sam wrote:

I'll have to sit down and think through this for what I want to do. Since I got my CRD back on the road I had been leaving the glow plugs disconnected but it finally got cool enough(and I'm working in North Dakota now)to need the glow plugs. I ended up plugging in my 5V glow plugs with the old 7V control.

Even with this setup I feel like it doesn't want to start as easily as it used to with the ceramics. Once temps drop closer to 0 I'll know more. I'm using the older 603 management so I "should" make some changes to accommodate the 5V GPs.

So i just found out I am in this same situation. My jeep has the Red ringed, 5V Bosch plugs but I have been running them at 7V this whole time as that is what my GDE tune is set for.
One just burnt out so now I am trying to figure out what to do. I would prefer to only need to buy one 5V plug instead of a full 7V set. How difficult is it to set this to 5V? It seems a lot more complex than simply changing one value from 7 to 5.

mass-hole · **Posted:** Tue Nov 10, 2015 2:58 pm

Yeti wrote:

O yesss

one is at 0F5A38 and another is at 0F57E4

I think the second address work on the first in percentage , but I'm not really sure

How did you arrive at the fact that these are GP maps? The axis look suspiciously like Injection Quantity and RPM when I view them from WinOLS and they share almost the same axis values as the N75 map at F5CE8

Yeti · **Posted:** Tue Nov 10, 2015 4:23 pm

for many factor , if you overlay the file like 811 and 809 , you see great difference idem with the old 516 -518 and 600 , too much difference for a fuel management with the rest unchanged , than I have received many stock tune that run 5 v .......811 file and see that they had the same map that I have in my 812 .........ok new revison...... I took courage and tried to stick the old Revison and test , puls some information that I have read here , and voltage is changed , now I have the same doubt you have , but for me is for do not burn this GP's ..........HA I have read somewere here thet Etecno do the same with they new 7v and 5v ....basically is the same GP with different product code

ps look at your private message box

Sir Sam · **Posted:** Fri Nov 13, 2015 1:59 pm

Yeti wrote:

Sir Sam wrote:

I'll have to sit down and think through this for what I want to do. Since I got my CRD back on the road I had been leaving the glow plugs disconnected but it finally got cool enough(and I'm working in North Dakota now)to need the glow plugs. I ended up plugging in my 5V glow plugs with the old 7V control.

Even with this setup I feel like it doesn't want to start as easily as it used to with the ceramics. Once temps drop closer to 0 I'll know more. I'm using the older 603 management so I "should" make some changes to accommodate the 5V GPs.

ok I have see the 603 file posted in the first page of the DIY ecu flash and if is the same of your , they have the latest GP's management , and you can use the 5v with no problem with your GCU , now the 5v have a problem in cold start , because of their construction technology the second resistance present first the heating resistance is a thermal resistor and can manage more voltage......more heat more resistance and less voltage in the tip , preventing overheating but sucks in cold climate

Yeti, the 603 file in the DIY flash is from me. My Jeep has also not been touched by a dealer since I purchased it in April of 2007. The 5V glow plugs did not exist at this time.

My Jeep has only had the F23 recall done, which is for ball joints. So as best I can tell my ECU is running the same software as it was when it was built on Feb 9, 2005, at 1300hrs.

It would not make sense to me that my ECU revision would support the 5V glowplugs, I dont see how newer Jeeps seem not to have the 5V management, but mine does.

Yeti · **Posted:** Fri Nov 13, 2015 3:43 pm

its like my 2007 kj , and I can say you that here in Italy ,if you have a 2007 , the dealer put on the 5v without ecu reflash , they only change the GCU and the Glow Plug ,I have do a call and spoke with 11 dealer in different city from North to south and only two have said me that the ecu reflash is needed depending of what revision I have .

my revision is the latest for automatic transmission in Europe and your have the same management

from BERU glow plug

"PROTECTION AGAINST OVERHEATING
Self-regulating glow plugs restrict the current flowing from the battery to the plug with increasing temperature to prevent overheating.
However, when the engine is running, the voltage will increase to a point where glow plugs that do not comply with the newest technology will blow.
Besides, the plugs that are supplied with current are exposed to high combustion temperatures after the start, and are thus heated up from the inside and the outside.
The post-heating BERU glow plugs are functional at full generator voltage. Their temperature increases very quickly, but will then be limited by the new regulating coil to a saturation temperature that is lower than that of non post-heating plugs."

here the complete pdf that explayn well

http://beru.federalmogul.com/sites/defa ... 014_fm.pdf

this tecnology is invented from Bosh and other brand copy that

justinmc · **Posted:** Fri Jan 20, 2017 6:01 pm

Yeti wrote:

its like my 2007 kj , and I can say you that here in Italy ,if you have a 2007 , the dealer put on the 5v without ecu reflash , they only change the GCU and the Glow Plug ,I have do a call and spoke with 11 dealer in different city from North to south and only two have said me that the ecu reflash is needed depending of what revision I have .

Hi there. Can you tell me where can I look in my BIN file to tell if it's set for 5v or 7v glow plugs?

Thanks.

mass-hole · **Posted:** Sat Jan 21, 2017 1:29 pm

I don't think so. As far as I know if hasn't been figured out

justinmc · **Posted:** Sat Jan 21, 2017 1:48 pm

mass-hole wrote:

I don't think so. As far as I know if hasn't been figured out

Okay, thanks for the info.

WWDiesel · **Posted:** Sat Jan 21, 2017 2:47 pm

FYI:
Green Diesel Engineering posted this on another thread!

GreenDieselEngineering wrote:

There are several calibration changes for the 5v GP logic vs. 7v. Keep in mind, companies like GM, FCA, etc. have a dedicated engineer working solely on the glow system for their career, so it is not a trivial task. There are several stages for glow control depending on many factors like coolant temp, ambient temp, altitude, rpm, fuel, battery voltage, etc. There is a pre-glow, intermediate glow, start glow, readiness glow, and post glow. Being a PWM system, the maps correlate to a duty cycle to give a nominal voltage. You need an oscilloscope to properly measure the functionality. Each stage has different duty cycle outputs for the 5 volts, some are single values and others are 3-d maps. There are also conversions for voltage drop that feed into the system as well. I personally would not mess with the settings in the glow system.

The main reason the start ability is hurt with metallic glow plugs is the design of the combustion chamber. The layout has the tip of the glow plug splitting the gap between two orifices of the injector nozzle, so the fuel sprays on each side of the glow plug. This is correct for a ceramic plug where you do not want the spray to impinge in the tip. On a metallic plug, since they are not as hot, it would be better to have a nozzle orifice spraying closer/inline with the glow tip. This requires a new cylinder head design to be optimized and that is just not feasible.

jrsavoie · **Posted:** Sun Jan 22, 2017 11:51 am

Looks like some combining of threads would be a good thing. Maybe

viewtopic.php?f=5&t=86001

viewtopic.php?f=5&t=85977

Glow Plug management .....GOT IT

Who is online