It is currently Fri Mar 29, 2024 7:01 am

All times are UTC - 5 hours [ DST ]




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 112 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6  Next
Author Message
 Post subject: Re: Ball Bearing CRD turbo
PostPosted: Sat Apr 16, 2016 1:03 pm 
Offline
LOST Addict
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jun 04, 2013 1:21 pm
Posts: 2137
Location: Utah
thermorex wrote:
diesel_guy86 wrote:
thermorex wrote:
FYI guys, gde said the ram ecodiesel turbo is very restrictive at low psi. Regarding exhaust brake, gde made one for ram, maybe they didn't do a jeep crd because it's not possible/worth? I'd ask Keith or Matt.


maybe they figured it would take more programming than what it was worth.

I wouldnt want to drive with the exhaust brake "on" all the time. I would rather only have it come on when tow/haul is on, and the torque converter is locked up at 0% throttle. Not sure how well this would work on the factory vanes, the newer vanes are curved and close up alot tighter.

I ordered everything i need to build my "hybrid" turbo and parts should be here next week, i have some light machine work to do and then itll be ready to be balanced and installed for testing of the new vanes and turbine wheel.

On the ram I believe it kicks in at 26-27 hundred rpm, the higher rpm the more efficient it is.

I one think that closing the vanes on no acceleration and rpm over a specific value is possible, maybe gde didn't do this for crd since most people won't need it. Still, I'd ask them. Maybe you already have the answer, vane geometry?


I swear GDE just put out a feeler about interest in getting an exhaust brake done a few months ago. That and the high rpm idle when cold.

Plus it seems pretty universal that people think that the GDE tunes coast better than the factory tune which must be something to do with the turbo. What else could they change that would effect this. I guess maybe the FCV.

_________________
2006 CRD - GTB2056 turbo by Dieselguy86, Eco Trans Tune, Lift Pump, Week's, HDS Tstat, Racor Filter, ARP's, OME 790's+Top Plate, JBA 2.5", JBA UCA, Moab's+265/75R16, ARB Bull Bar, 4.10's, TrueTracs


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Ball Bearing CRD turbo
PostPosted: Sat Apr 16, 2016 8:27 pm 
Offline
LOST Addict
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jun 04, 2013 1:21 pm
Posts: 2137
Location: Utah
Take a look at my first attempt at an engine brake mod:

http://www.lostjeeps.com/forum/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?p=890516#p890516

2nd gear felt a lot stronger engine braking but third felt roughly the same.

_________________
2006 CRD - GTB2056 turbo by Dieselguy86, Eco Trans Tune, Lift Pump, Week's, HDS Tstat, Racor Filter, ARP's, OME 790's+Top Plate, JBA 2.5", JBA UCA, Moab's+265/75R16, ARB Bull Bar, 4.10's, TrueTracs


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Ball Bearing CRD turbo
PostPosted: Sun Apr 17, 2016 10:09 am 
Offline
LOST Junkie

Joined: Thu Dec 12, 2013 9:17 pm
Posts: 571
Location: Republic, Oh
Thats encouraging, will be interesting to see what can be achieved. Theres a stop screw to keep the vanes from closing all the way. This may need to be adjusted to get desired braking power. When i took my stock turbo apart it looked like the vanes move very little out of there available travel.

_________________
05 Liberty Limited CRD, converted to KPA 2863 ball bearing and billet turbo, 50hp injectorsl, complete egr delete, cooling fan delete, weeks intake kit, cummins in tank lift pump, ARP studs, 3" turbo back exhaust, samcos, etecno plugs, GDE trans tune, custom GDE engine tune.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Ball Bearing CRD turbo
PostPosted: Mon Apr 18, 2016 8:59 am 
Offline
LOST Addict

Joined: Fri Apr 02, 2010 3:14 pm
Posts: 2294
Location: Sumter, SC
mass-hole wrote:
thermorex wrote:
diesel_guy86 wrote:
[quote="thermorex"]FYI guys, gde said the ram ecodiesel turbo is very restrictive at low psi. Regarding exhaust brake, gde made one for ram, maybe they didn't do a jeep crd because it's not possible/worth? I'd ask Keith or Matt.


maybe they figured it would take more programming than what it was worth.

I wouldnt want to drive with the exhaust brake "on" all the time. I would rather only have it come on when tow/haul is on, and the torque converter is locked up at 0% throttle. Not sure how well this would work on the factory vanes, the newer vanes are curved and close up alot tighter.

I ordered everything i need to build my "hybrid" turbo and parts should be here next week, i have some light machine work to do and then itll be ready to be balanced and installed for testing of the new vanes and turbine wheel.

On the ram I believe it kicks in at 26-27 hundred rpm, the higher rpm the more efficient it is.

I one think that closing the vanes on no acceleration and rpm over a specific value is possible, maybe gde didn't do this for crd since most people won't need it. Still, I'd ask them. Maybe you already have the answer, vane geometry?


I swear GDE just put out a feeler about interest in getting an exhaust brake done a few months ago. That and the high rpm idle when cold.

Plus it seems pretty universal that people think that the GDE tunes coast better than the factory tune which must be something to do with the turbo. What else could they change that would effect this. I guess maybe the FCV.[/quote]
I remember the elevated idle, but not the exhaust brake... Maybe I missed it.

_________________
2005 kj CRD, samco, suncoast tc, provent, Kennedy lift pump, GDE ECO full torque, 2nd gen filter head, 245/70/16 a/t tires, mopar light bar, fumoto oil valve, OEM Skid Plates, ARB Front bumper and HD OME, tru cool LPD47391 40k GVW tranny cooler (stock cooler delete), FF Dynamics e-fan and shroud, rocker arms replaced, HDS2 190F thermostat.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Ball Bearing CRD turbo
PostPosted: Thu Apr 28, 2016 12:17 am 
Offline
LOST Addict
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jun 04, 2013 1:21 pm
Posts: 2137
Location: Utah
diesel_guy86 wrote:
Thats encouraging, will be interesting to see what can be achieved. Theres a stop screw to keep the vanes from closing all the way. This may need to be adjusted to get desired braking power. When i took my stock turbo apart it looked like the vanes move very little out of there available travel.


I did increase the VNT duty cycle from 61% to ~75% and did achieve a little more boost but not enough to make much of a difference.

How far does the stop screw on the VNT allow the vanes to close. I dont think increasing the boost alone is enough to make a very effective exhaust brake, I think the vanes need to nearly shut to create a tremendous amount of back pressure and I am not sure that is possible. I may try a 90% duty cycle just to see if it pushes things any farther. If I could hit 2200-2400 mbars of boost while coasting then thats about as far as I wanna go.

_________________
2006 CRD - GTB2056 turbo by Dieselguy86, Eco Trans Tune, Lift Pump, Week's, HDS Tstat, Racor Filter, ARP's, OME 790's+Top Plate, JBA 2.5", JBA UCA, Moab's+265/75R16, ARB Bull Bar, 4.10's, TrueTracs


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Ball Bearing CRD turbo
PostPosted: Thu Apr 28, 2016 8:34 am 
Offline
LOST Member
User avatar

Joined: Sun Jul 06, 2014 7:46 pm
Posts: 180
Hopefully as you approach totally closed your boost should crash because you are no longer moving exhaust through the turbine wheel, or severely restricting it enough to create back pressure on the engine.

_________________
05 CRD Sport - GDE EcoTune - Samcos - EGR Delete & Elbow kit - ARP Studs - Airtex E7181M


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Ball Bearing CRD turbo
PostPosted: Fri Apr 29, 2016 4:46 pm 
Offline
LOST Addict
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jun 04, 2013 1:21 pm
Posts: 2137
Location: Utah
funnyman06 wrote:
Hopefully as you approach totally closed your boost should crash because you are no longer moving exhaust through the turbine wheel, or severely restricting it enough to create back pressure on the engine.


I wonder. Or maybe the exhaust would just hit lightspeed trying to get through the vanes and send the turbo through the hood.

I will make a 90% duty cycle tune and report back.

EDIT: I ran a 90% duty cycle tune and only picked up 30 mbars of boost over the 75% tune so the VNT is closed as far as they will go at 75%.

_________________
2006 CRD - GTB2056 turbo by Dieselguy86, Eco Trans Tune, Lift Pump, Week's, HDS Tstat, Racor Filter, ARP's, OME 790's+Top Plate, JBA 2.5", JBA UCA, Moab's+265/75R16, ARB Bull Bar, 4.10's, TrueTracs


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Ball Bearing CRD turbo
PostPosted: Sat Apr 30, 2016 4:36 pm 
Offline
LOST Junkie

Joined: Thu Dec 12, 2013 9:17 pm
Posts: 571
Location: Republic, Oh
I double checked my center housing, the stop screw is for wide open, not closed. I would try 100% duty cycle. If it doesnt do much, it is probably because of the geometry of the vanes, they arent able to close enough to cause restriction.

_________________
05 Liberty Limited CRD, converted to KPA 2863 ball bearing and billet turbo, 50hp injectorsl, complete egr delete, cooling fan delete, weeks intake kit, cummins in tank lift pump, ARP studs, 3" turbo back exhaust, samcos, etecno plugs, GDE trans tune, custom GDE engine tune.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Ball Bearing CRD turbo
PostPosted: Mon Jun 13, 2016 10:48 am 
Offline
LOST Addict
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jun 04, 2013 1:21 pm
Posts: 2137
Location: Utah
How are things looking? I am getting anxious about a new and improved turbo.

_________________
2006 CRD - GTB2056 turbo by Dieselguy86, Eco Trans Tune, Lift Pump, Week's, HDS Tstat, Racor Filter, ARP's, OME 790's+Top Plate, JBA 2.5", JBA UCA, Moab's+265/75R16, ARB Bull Bar, 4.10's, TrueTracs


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Ball Bearing CRD turbo
PostPosted: Mon Jun 13, 2016 12:23 pm 
Offline
LOST Junkie

Joined: Thu Dec 12, 2013 9:17 pm
Posts: 571
Location: Republic, Oh
mass-hole wrote:
How are things looking? I am getting anxious about a new and improved turbo.


You and a couple other guys that have messaged me too. Its still out of my hands, germany came back and said they had to have a minimum order of 10. I gave them the ok and im still waiting.

The machine shop has been somewhat difficult to work with. Ive been contemplating sending the center section out to get 3D scanned and then hiring an engineer to modify the inside to house my bearings. This may be the route i will go with as i wont have to worry about a machine shop having my ideas on there computer and being at their mercy.

_________________
05 Liberty Limited CRD, converted to KPA 2863 ball bearing and billet turbo, 50hp injectorsl, complete egr delete, cooling fan delete, weeks intake kit, cummins in tank lift pump, ARP studs, 3" turbo back exhaust, samcos, etecno plugs, GDE trans tune, custom GDE engine tune.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Ball Bearing CRD turbo
PostPosted: Thu Jun 16, 2016 1:19 am 
Offline
LOST Addict
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jun 04, 2013 1:21 pm
Posts: 2137
Location: Utah
diesel_guy86 wrote:
mass-hole wrote:
How are things looking? I am getting anxious about a new and improved turbo.


You and a couple other guys that have messaged me too. Its still out of my hands, germany came back and said they had to have a minimum order of 10. I gave them the ok and im still waiting.

The machine shop has been somewhat difficult to work with. Ive been contemplating sending the center section out to get 3D scanned and then hiring an engineer to modify the inside to house my bearings. This may be the route i will go with as i wont have to worry about a machine shop having my ideas on there computer and being at their mercy.

Cool, thanks for your efforts. Just wanted to check in.

Sent from my Nexus 6 using Tapatalk

_________________
2006 CRD - GTB2056 turbo by Dieselguy86, Eco Trans Tune, Lift Pump, Week's, HDS Tstat, Racor Filter, ARP's, OME 790's+Top Plate, JBA 2.5", JBA UCA, Moab's+265/75R16, ARB Bull Bar, 4.10's, TrueTracs


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Ball Bearing CRD turbo
PostPosted: Fri Jun 17, 2016 3:42 pm 
Offline
LOST Junkie

Joined: Thu Dec 12, 2013 9:17 pm
Posts: 571
Location: Republic, Oh
Some good news,

I just got off the phone with a 3D modeling place, they quoted me roughly $1,400 to 3D scan the housing. I have an engineer lined up to alter the 3D model to use my bearings. After that i can get a quote on getting it 3D printed and from there its just some very simple and light machine work to have the first couple test turbos ready. Depending on the bearings, my goal is to have the first turbos ready for testing by Aug 1st.

_________________
05 Liberty Limited CRD, converted to KPA 2863 ball bearing and billet turbo, 50hp injectorsl, complete egr delete, cooling fan delete, weeks intake kit, cummins in tank lift pump, ARP studs, 3" turbo back exhaust, samcos, etecno plugs, GDE trans tune, custom GDE engine tune.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Ball Bearing CRD turbo
PostPosted: Tue Jun 21, 2016 4:27 pm 
Offline
LOST Junkie

Joined: Thu Dec 12, 2013 9:17 pm
Posts: 571
Location: Republic, Oh
Bearing update:

Got an email from the manufacturer, my bearings are on the schedule to be made in the next day or so, they should be at my doorstep in a couple weeks.

The turbo parts are being sent out this week to be 3D scanned. My friend has a plastic 3D printer that i will print the first design for simple mockup once i have all the parts, then full scale production of a couple turbos for testing.

Not sure if im going to hit my Aug 1st deadline, but they will for sure be done this year. Which is remarkable since this was first brought up just 3 months ago.

_________________
05 Liberty Limited CRD, converted to KPA 2863 ball bearing and billet turbo, 50hp injectorsl, complete egr delete, cooling fan delete, weeks intake kit, cummins in tank lift pump, ARP studs, 3" turbo back exhaust, samcos, etecno plugs, GDE trans tune, custom GDE engine tune.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Ball Bearing CRD turbo
PostPosted: Fri Jul 01, 2016 12:53 pm 
Offline
LOST Addict
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jun 04, 2013 1:21 pm
Posts: 2137
Location: Utah
So I am working to try and change the PWM frequency to allow electronic actuation for this. I ran a scope on the wiring while it was unplugged and got a frequency of 152.6 Hz but am thinking that the ECU gets pissed when its unplugged and may alter things. There was no change in the Duty cycle when it was unplugged and I was stepping on the gas pedal so I am going to try and take the readings while it is still hooked up.

Everything I have read suggests that its just a matter of changing the frequency in the tune which should be pretty easy.

_________________
2006 CRD - GTB2056 turbo by Dieselguy86, Eco Trans Tune, Lift Pump, Week's, HDS Tstat, Racor Filter, ARP's, OME 790's+Top Plate, JBA 2.5", JBA UCA, Moab's+265/75R16, ARB Bull Bar, 4.10's, TrueTracs


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Ball Bearing CRD turbo
PostPosted: Mon Jul 18, 2016 9:00 pm 
Offline
LOST Junkie

Joined: Thu Dec 12, 2013 9:17 pm
Posts: 571
Location: Republic, Oh
BEARINGS ARE HERE!! After MONTHS of waiting, my custom bearings arrived.
Image
They come 100% sealed with silica gel packets to keep moisture out. Might not seem like much but Its little details like that, that show they care about the work they do.

Image
If you look at the bearing closely you'll notice 3 things.

1) the balls are blue/gray, the balls are made of silicon nitride, its extremely hard, durable, and unbelievably round. These are required for the heat and rpms.
2) there are no ball cages, this is also for heat and rpms, as well as decreasing the rolling resistance of the bearing considerably. Earlier spoolup, decreased bearing running temps, and higher heat resistance.
3) the tiny hole you see on the outside of the bearing is the oil feed hole. These bearings get oil fed directly to the balls and races where its needed most. All the other ball bearing turbos squirt oil at the bearing with only a small percentage of that oil actually getting to the balls and races.

Image
Heres a pic of the bearing roughly centered in the factory turbo center housing. My housing will be designed around these bearings. In case anyone asks, no the factory housing cannot be remachined.

Still waiting on the 3D cad models to start the housing design. Atleast i can say things are moving forward finally. Its nice to have something to hold, even if its something simple like a bearing.

_________________
05 Liberty Limited CRD, converted to KPA 2863 ball bearing and billet turbo, 50hp injectorsl, complete egr delete, cooling fan delete, weeks intake kit, cummins in tank lift pump, ARP studs, 3" turbo back exhaust, samcos, etecno plugs, GDE trans tune, custom GDE engine tune.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Ball Bearing CRD turbo
PostPosted: Tue Jul 19, 2016 3:05 pm 
Offline
LOST Addict
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jun 04, 2013 1:21 pm
Posts: 2137
Location: Utah
Awesome

_________________
2006 CRD - GTB2056 turbo by Dieselguy86, Eco Trans Tune, Lift Pump, Week's, HDS Tstat, Racor Filter, ARP's, OME 790's+Top Plate, JBA 2.5", JBA UCA, Moab's+265/75R16, ARB Bull Bar, 4.10's, TrueTracs


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Ball Bearing CRD turbo
PostPosted: Fri Jul 22, 2016 5:43 pm 
Offline
LOST Junkie

Joined: Thu Dec 12, 2013 9:17 pm
Posts: 571
Location: Republic, Oh
Finally heard back from the 3D scanner guy, CAD models will be in next week, then my engineer will "remodel" the internals for me. From there my friend will 3D print the prototype out of plastic to check for fitment and any problems. Should only be a few more weeks until i have a BB Liberty turbo in my hands.

_________________
05 Liberty Limited CRD, converted to KPA 2863 ball bearing and billet turbo, 50hp injectorsl, complete egr delete, cooling fan delete, weeks intake kit, cummins in tank lift pump, ARP studs, 3" turbo back exhaust, samcos, etecno plugs, GDE trans tune, custom GDE engine tune.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Ball Bearing CRD turbo
PostPosted: Thu Jul 28, 2016 5:06 pm 
Offline
LOST Junkie

Joined: Thu Dec 12, 2013 9:17 pm
Posts: 571
Location: Republic, Oh
Another update, here is the 3D scanned CAD model of the FACTORY housing. From here i will re-engineer it for my bearings.

Image

Image

Remember this is an EXACT COPY of the factory housing. This will make 100% sure every bolt hole and mounting surface is the exact same as the original.

_________________
05 Liberty Limited CRD, converted to KPA 2863 ball bearing and billet turbo, 50hp injectorsl, complete egr delete, cooling fan delete, weeks intake kit, cummins in tank lift pump, ARP studs, 3" turbo back exhaust, samcos, etecno plugs, GDE trans tune, custom GDE engine tune.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Ball Bearing CRD turbo
PostPosted: Thu Jul 28, 2016 11:14 pm 
Offline
LOST Newbie

Joined: Sat Sep 20, 2014 11:51 am
Posts: 13
Location: St. George, Utah
Very Cool! Can't wait to see how this how this progresses. Eagerly awaiting the next episode...

_________________
2005 White/Grey Liberty CRD Limited
Samco Hoses
Weeks Kits Stage I & Stage II, Straight Exhaust
Hayden Heavy Duty Fan Clutch, Nylon Mechanical Fan
OME Lift F/R, Al's A-Arms, 245/75/16 Cooper Discoverer AT3s
Gen 2 Fuel Head, In-Tank Lift Pump


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Ball Bearing CRD turbo
PostPosted: Fri Jul 29, 2016 1:51 am 
Offline
LOST Member

Joined: Thu Jun 06, 2013 3:18 am
Posts: 174
Location: BILOXI MS
:POPCORN:


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 112 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6  Next

All times are UTC - 5 hours [ DST ]


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Majestic-12 [Bot] and 36 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group. Color scheme by ColorizeIt!
Logo by pixeldecals.com