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What and how much do you tow with your crd?
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Author:  NapaBavarian [ Sun Jul 03, 2016 8:07 pm ]
Post subject:  What and how much do you tow with your crd?
I'm curious, I know the power is there and I saw references to 5000# and 6500# trailers, no doubt the power is there but that little short wheelbase makes me wonder, you gotta stop that thing too!
Author:  jws84_02 [ Sun Jul 03, 2016 8:32 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: What and how much do you tow with your crd?
I pull anything and everything with mine. Most I've pulled is 5 ton of rock but with that I didn't go above 40mph. There is plenty of power but like you mention the harder part is stopping and stability. I have no problem going down the interstate with 4K or so. I've pulled multiple liberty's home with mine
Author:  Rixram [ Mon Jul 04, 2016 2:30 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: What and how much do you tow with your crd?
jws84_02 wrote:
I pull anything and everything with mine. Most I've pulled is 5 ton of rock but with that I didn't go above 40mph. There is plenty of power but like you mention the harder part is stopping and stability. I have no problem going down the interstate with 4K or so. I've pulled multiple liberty's home with mine


I had a 1987 Searay Seville 210 mid-cabin that I towed. Fully fueled and with all gear, it came in at 5k lbs.
Jeep did great. I made sure to use a marine weight distributing hitch, though.
Many folks lack the understanding of how necessary a WD hitch is.
Author:  geordi [ Mon Jul 04, 2016 8:53 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: What and how much do you tow with your crd?
Bullcrap. I've never used a WD hitch and I've never needed one either. Just because something is heavy, you don't need a weight distributing hitch unless you are a numpty and have loaded the trailer wrong.

The whole point of a WD hitch is to try and transfer force forward of the rear axle and aft of the trailer ball (ideally, onto or past the trailer axle) to level the frames of the two vehicles when the tongue is overloaded.

If you have so much tongue weight that your rear suspension is being crushed - REPACK YOUR LOAD. You don't need "precisely 10%" of the trailer weight on the ball, that is just the maximum based on trailer weight and something that is short enough that the lawyers approved to be printed on a sticker on the bar.

What is correct? Weight on the ball that is sufficient to keep downward force while stopping, so that the trailer doesn't fishtail or "push" upwards on the rear while you are braking. 50-100 lbs is usually sufficient. If you can easily bounce the trailer tongue up and down and hear the hitch bar banging - that is too light. But you don't need to be carving ruts in the road with the ball either. If the frames of both the tractor and the trailer are level and parallel with the road, and you can't bounce the tongue up and down to hear it rattle... You are in a good place and should have plenty of tongue weight. It takes practice and experience.

FYI: I have pulled all manner of things with my CRD as well as with other vehicles. Just about everything I own with a motor has a trailer hitch on it - including my (former) motorcycle! The largest things I have pulled with my CRD has been either a giant 75kw generator and 500 feet of 4/0 cable (about 8500 lbs all together) or a 7.5x20 enclosed box trailer (7,000 fully loaded) or even my 30' long 6 ton MOTORHOME that I used the CRD to drag it out of a mud puddle that it got stuck in.

Ok, that last one was only at 2mph, but it still counts. I didn't go over 60mph with the big box trailer - that was more wind resistance than anything else, but that trailer also is VERY poorly designed, at 7000 lbs, which is its designed weight, it was putting down 1200 lbs of tongue weight! This was even after I had intentionally loaded it poorly to try and fix this imbalance - with my 500 lb motorcycle completely behind the axles, and two giant cabinets of tools at the back door.
Author:  Sarge48 [ Mon Jul 04, 2016 9:20 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: What and how much do you tow with your crd?
I pull my R-Pod all over with my 06 CRD. It does fine.
Author:  Rixram [ Tue Jul 05, 2016 7:58 am ]
Post subject:  Re: What and how much do you tow with your crd?
geordi wrote:
Bullcrap. I've never used a WD hitch and I've never needed one either. Just because something is heavy, you don't need a weight distributing hitch unless you are a numpty and have loaded the trailer wrong.

The whole point of a WD hitch is to try and transfer force forward of the rear axle and aft of the trailer ball (ideally, onto or past the trailer axle) to level the frames of the two vehicles when the tongue is overloaded.

If you have so much tongue weight that your rear suspension is being crushed - REPACK YOUR LOAD. You don't need "precisely 10%" of the trailer weight on the ball, that is just the maximum based on trailer weight and something that is short enough that the lawyers approved to be printed on a sticker on the bar.

What is correct? Weight on the ball that is sufficient to keep downward force while stopping, so that the trailer doesn't fishtail or "push" upwards on the rear while you are braking. 50-100 lbs is usually sufficient. If you can easily bounce the trailer tongue up and down and hear the hitch bar banging - that is too light. But you don't need to be carving ruts in the road with the ball either. If the frames of both the tractor and the trailer are level and parallel with the road, and you can't bounce the tongue up and down to hear it rattle... You are in a good place and should have plenty of tongue weight. It takes practice and experience.

FYI: I have pulled all manner of things with my CRD as well as with other vehicles. Just about everything I own with a motor has a trailer hitch on it - including my (former) motorcycle! The largest things I have pulled with my CRD has been either a giant 75kw generator and 500 feet of 4/0 cable (about 8500 lbs all together) or a 7.5x20 enclosed box trailer (7,000 fully loaded) or even my 30' long 6 ton MOTORHOME that I used the CRD to drag it out of a mud puddle that it got stuck in.

Ok, that last one was only at 2mph, but it still counts. I didn't go over 60mph with the big box trailer - that was more wind resistance than anything else, but that trailer also is VERY poorly designed, at 7000 lbs, which is its designed weight, it was putting down 1200 lbs of tongue weight! This was even after I had intentionally loaded it poorly to try and fix this imbalance - with my 500 lb motorcycle completely behind the axles, and two giant cabinets of tools at the back door.


Since your premise is repack your load, yet a boat cannot be repacked. The tanks are fixed, the motor is fixed, the interior is all firmly in place. Therefore, your argument is invalid.

Then again, you advertise that you tow at speeds approaching 100 mph, so I wouldn't ever take ay towing advice from you, and I'm surprised you're still alive.
Author:  wilco549 [ Tue Jul 05, 2016 11:06 am ]
Post subject:  Re: What and how much do you tow with your crd?
I've towed up to a 26', 4000+ lb RV but don't recommend it. I did have a WD hitch, anti-sway bar and brakes and would not try it without all three! The wheel base is too short and suspension too soft on the liberty to be a serious tractor. The engine is pretty good with a hot tune, even here in the hills of east TN, but because of the constant transmission problems I've bought a much bigger SUV to pull my current TT, 19' AR-One.

The liberty is now only used as a DD and an occasional utility trailer mule.

Regarding the WD hitch. It's purpose is not to make the vehicle tow an improperly loaded vehicle, but to distribute the tongue weight over all 4 wheels for a more balance feel. I 'm sold on them after trying both ways.
Author:  geordi [ Tue Jul 05, 2016 11:32 am ]
Post subject:  Re: What and how much do you tow with your crd?
The position of a boat on a trailer can be adjusted, which will shift the weight. A little goes a long way.
As for that towing at high speed - that was a tiny 4x3 open flat trailer with high speed tires on it, and only an engine and hoist strapped down. It was little more than a cart with a trailer tongue on it, and was so small that it could hide in the wind draft behind the SUV that was pulling it. There were no signs of any instability (I could see it in the mirror) and it wasn't even wiggling back and forth. Rock steady.

Not everything is black and white, there are different abilities for different loads and configurations.
Author:  ChesterCRD [ Tue Jul 05, 2016 11:40 am ]
Post subject:  Re: What and how much do you tow with your crd?
geordi wrote:
Bullcrap. I've never used a WD hitch and I've never needed one either. Just because something is heavy, you don't need a weight distributing hitch unless you are a numpty and have loaded the trailer wrong.


Heh, that's my laugh for the day! I like it.

I generally tow light stuff. I pull around a 1500 lbs frequently. The most I've ever pulled was 4000 lbs. That was a bit much to stop without trailer brakes. My liberty tows better than my Grand Cherokee and Durango did (both 5.2L V8s).
Author:  Rixram [ Tue Jul 05, 2016 12:44 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: What and how much do you tow with your crd?
wilco549 wrote:

Regarding the WD hitch. It's purpose is not to make the vehicle tow an improperly loaded vehicle, but to distribute the tongue weight over all 4 wheels for a more balance feel. I 'm sold on them after trying both ways.


As am I.

I towed a travel trailer, 27', 6,500lbs from San Diego, CA to Rhode Island. The tow vehicle was a Durango with a modded 4.7L. It would have been suicide without the WD hitch. With the wind disruptions from 18-wheelers blowing by and crosswinds from a hurricane (Rita in southern Texas while I was in northern Texas, in case anyone remembers that one). I was darn glad to have that extra margin of control. Nowadays, if anyone is pulling more than half of their max tow cap without one (note: for vehicles with a real tow cap, mind you, not the crappy 2-3K lb ones), I'm baffled as to why not use one. Saving a few dollars doesn't mean anything if you kill yourself in the process.
Author:  WWDiesel [ Tue Jul 05, 2016 3:37 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: What and how much do you tow with your crd?
WD hitches serve a purpose when they are needed due to load and vehicle towing ability! I use one when towing a 10,000 lb. camper behind my Dodge Cummins even though it could handle the load safely without the WD hitch. It just feels more stable with the WD hitch and swaybar at higher speeds.
I have several other smaller trailers and a center console boat that I tow with the Jeep CRD and handling is good without any WD hitch.
Then key is to know the limits of the tow vehicle for both emergency handling and stopping loads attached to it before possibly getting in trouble on the highway as a fishtailing trailer or not being able to stop quick enough can be a very scary or catastrophic event.... :wink:
Author:  NapaBavarian [ Tue Jul 05, 2016 7:09 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: What and how much do you tow with your crd?
I got a couple chuckles, I'm not sure what a "marine grade" weigh distributing hitch is but I used to tow so often I would have trouble backing up without a trailer, in general a properly loaded trailer does not need a weigh distributing hitch, there are a couple exceptions, first one is mandatory, second two are optional.

The position of the ball works like a lever so you may see more weight on the rear axle than on the ball, and reduced weight on the front axle. If this is more than safe or legal weight a distributing hitch is mandatory. You want enough weight on the ball the trailer doesn't wag the dog, if you have ever seen a trailer weaving back and fourth as tow vehicle drives straight in a no wind situation it probably has too little young weight, if you have too much weight on the ball it will lift weight from the front axle causing steering and braking issues.

The other two examples are travel trailers and boats, travel trailers are typically light weight with a broad side so wind will push them around and make that chunk of charcoal you just sat on a diamond, with long heavy boat trailers you typically have a long stretch of single c channel, most other trailers double this channel up. As this flexes it tends to bounce stressing the driver and anything else it is attached too, WD hitch for peace of mind...
Author:  flash7210 [ Tue Jul 05, 2016 7:28 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: What and how much do you tow with your crd?
How much do air bags or load-leveling shocks help with towing?
Author:  Rixram [ Tue Jul 05, 2016 7:49 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: What and how much do you tow with your crd?
Marine grade works with boat trailer surge brakes. No chains on the bars.
Author:  mass-hole [ Tue Jul 05, 2016 10:10 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: What and how much do you tow with your crd?
I pulled a 4500 lb wakeboard boat and it was fine from a stability standpoint but once it was up to 70mph(speed limit on I93 in NH) it was lacking in the horsepower department even with the GDE Hot tune. It was fine on the flats and would pull it in 5th gear but when I got to any hills(nothing very steep) it required nearly full throttle to maintain speed.

Despite what people say, horsepower is what pull trailers uphill and the jeep doesnt have much. Once you hit about 2800 rpm the torque curve takes a dump on this thing and you barely get anymore horsepower running out to redline. Unless you wanna be that guy towing 25mph under the speed limit up a hill then I wouldnt use the CRD for anything particularly heavy, >5000lbs.
Author:  NapaBavarian [ Wed Jul 06, 2016 3:26 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: What and how much do you tow with your crd?
flash7210 wrote:
How much do air bags or load-leveling shocks help with towing?


If a properly loaded trailer compresses the rear end too much they will help, most us vehicles are designed for a comftorable ride when empty, at max load they can be too soft.
Author:  mass-hole [ Wed Jul 06, 2016 6:47 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: What and how much do you tow with your crd?
NapaBavarian wrote:
flash7210 wrote:
How much do air bags or load-leveling shocks help with towing?


If a properly loaded trailer compresses the rear end too much they will help, most us vehicles are designed for a comftorable ride when empty, at max load they can be too soft.


Yep, they made a solid difference on my F150. I dont tow with it but for payload it really helps level the truck and stiffen the rear to better cope with the load. I carried nearly 2500 lbs of crushed stone, 1000 lbs over the payload capacity, and was able to level it with the bags. Same concept with a trailers tongue weigh except that its effect is multiplied since it attaches so far behind the rear tires.

That said, bags dont replace weight distribution. If u put tongue weight on the hitch, it is going to unweight the front tires whether you have airbags or not.
Author:  Bushman5 [ Wed Jul 06, 2016 8:47 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: What and how much do you tow with your crd?
I disagree about HP being needed for towing . I drive a tandem axle ten ton truck at work with a Cummins inline 6 diesel grunter under the hood and a pintle hitch.
I've towed more than 50,000 kg up hill (WAY OVER my GVWR). It's the torque not the HP that makes that possible.

The Cummins torque pulls the loads......not the HP

Sent from my HTC Desire 510 using Tapatalk
Author:  geordi [ Wed Jul 06, 2016 9:15 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: What and how much do you tow with your crd?
Horsepower is how fast you hit the wall.

Torque is how much of the wall you take with you.
Author:  flash7210 [ Wed Jul 06, 2016 9:18 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: What and how much do you tow with your crd?
Torque pulls the load up the mountain.
Horsepower gets it up there quickly.

I wonder how fast a Bugatti Verayon can pull 6000 lbs up a mountain :-)r

"Want to run faster? It's all about horsepower! But if you have more torque, you'll have more horsepower!" - Judson Massingill, School of Automotive Machinists
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