Overheating, need guidance

Ceearedeedriver · **Joined:** Fri May 06, 2016 8:44 pm **Posts:** 177

geordi wrote:

I have to read the thread more closely, but the loss of coolant is most commonly from the back of the coolant bottle due to head gasket leaks. Arp studs will solve that particular problem if the leak is not too bad.

This is probably worth a try once you confirm combustion gasses in your coolant. The nice thing about the ARPs is you will reuse them if you do have to remove the head. Note that the more you drive it in this state the more damage you'll do and you'll find yourself facing a few $K repair bill instead of a few hundred..

I also note #3 GP is out. You really need to make sure it's not an original ceramic if you intend to delay replacing it.

ryanchris · **Posted:** Sun Jul 17, 2016 8:21 pm

I currently am in the process of tearing the jeep down for the tb, and water pump install, so I cant really check for gases in the coolant right now.

I have new glow plugs and going to replace all of them while i have it apart.

I did just replace the thermostat so that might of been where the leak was happening and just collecting on the waterpump. But i didnt feel anything coming from there when i felt under it. The waterpump seemed to be leaking.. But i had not installed a new one.. as far as I know they did that when they did the timing belt like 80k ago... Or it has the original one in it.

There anything i can do to check the head while its apart without taking the head off? Or do i just have to put it all back together and hope it was the waterpump? At this point i really hope thats it or ill have to have the head stuff done by someone else....And after i have done all the timing belt stuff ugh.

flash7210 · **Posted:** Sun Jul 17, 2016 9:20 pm

Quote:

There anything i can do to check the head while its apart without taking the head off?

flash7210 wrote:

Before you start pulling apart the t-belt and water pump, get your hands on a cooling system pressure tester.
Pressurize the cooling system to 16 psi, pull all 4 glow plugs, and pull the ASD fuse.
Then crank the engine and check for water spitting out the glow plug holes.

In this case, it has to be done with the t belt installed so the cams and crank don't fall out of time. You can also turn the crank by hand instead of using the starter.

geordi · **Posted:** Sun Jul 17, 2016 9:23 pm

If the timing belt doesn't get a lot of miles on it, I would not have a problem in reinstalling it, if you have to take it apart again.

Where are you located? I'm the travelling mechanic, so if you want assistance in doing the ARP studs and the intake elbow and solving this leak, just shoot me an email and we can talk.

ryanchris · **Posted:** Sun Jul 17, 2016 9:41 pm

I am in Ky.

Almost to where i can get to the timing belt. Got the front as apart as i want to take it since the arb is heavy as hell i only took it half off to clear the front end stuff so i could remove it and get to the intercooler and ac stuff to check and clean it.

When i get the new timing belt and water pump back in it, ill put it all together other than the egr side elbow and leave the glow plugs out and do your test flash. I guess i just need a cooling system pressure checker and look for the coolant when i crank it with it mostly together??

geordi · **Posted:** Sun Jul 17, 2016 9:58 pm

Ah yes, the factory process... I don't pull apart any of the front stack to do the timing belt, sorry you did all that. It is a lot of work.

Basically you are looking for coolant coming from the glowplug holes when you crank the engine with the cooling system pressurized. If you get water - you have a head gasket leak.

The ARP studs will most likely cure that, but you may also want to consider removing the head entirely and replacing the exhaust valves while you have a chance. I am currently working on developing an upgraded replacement, but even the stock ones that IDparts sells should deliver another 150k miles of performance. The risk is that they break without warning and trash the motor when they do.

ryanchris · **Posted:** Sun Jul 17, 2016 10:26 pm

Yeah I thought about trying the tb with everything still on the front an just removing the rad since I had done that before. But i needed to check the stuff in front of the rad for flow and leaks.

Honestly if i see coolant out of the glow plugs the jeep will not be the only thing overheating. I am already in to this thing over a grand in the past couple of weeks. Stuff I have know i needed to fix / common problems but still....

As a side note I have another engine and trans along with axles pulled from the jeep i look the lift off of if anyone would be interested. It has been sitting just collecting dust for awhile now. It was flooded, I was planning on having the jeep fixed... But the smell in the other body was soooo bad i just scrapped it and kept anything i thought i might need.

geordi · **Posted:** Mon Jul 18, 2016 12:26 am

I don't know about the transmission and the axles, but I might be interested in the motor, these things seem to keep finding me.

ryanchris · **Posted:** Mon Jul 18, 2016 12:36 am

I should probably do something with it, just havent had the time really with so many other projects.

geordi · **Posted:** Mon Jul 18, 2016 1:01 am

I sent you an email about it.

mass-hole · **Posted:** Mon Jul 18, 2016 2:21 pm

Whether or not there is an issue with the HG or water pump, I just don't think the cooling stack on these engine are adequate enough. The fact that the a/c exchanger, cac, and radiator are all in line makes for poor heat transfer. I know that when monitoring my intake air temps, I can see a jump of 10-15C(18-25F) just from turning the a/c on while cruising along on flat ground. Under extended high load I see 80C+ on the cold side of the CAC so the hot side has to be insane. You gotta imagine that by the time the cooling air gets to the Radiator there is not much temperature differential to help pull that heat from the coolant.

I wish there was somewhere to relocate the cac like on the F150 ecoboost. They mount the CAC below the radiator/trans cooler in a totally separate air stream.

Sent from my Nexus 6 using Tapatalk

ryanchris · **Posted:** Mon Jul 18, 2016 9:43 pm

Emailed ya back geordi.

You might be right mass. I got my intercooler and the rest of the front cleared today. Some leafs inbetween the ac and intercooler but mostly at the bottom and not a ton. Pressure tested the intercooler it doesnt leak. IT did have alot of oil in it though.. I kept flushing it kept coming. So it seems an intercooler leak wasnt the source of the underboost.

ryanchris · **Posted:** Tue Jul 19, 2016 10:50 pm

So I am stuck. I got all my stuff in for the timing belt from idparts. (Copper waterpump wheel is pretty cool.) While waiting on the tools, that should be here tomorrow..I am not sure if i should go ahead and change the head bolts to studs and clean the intake while i have it this far apart. I have already spent more money on this thing than i would like in this short amount of time. And not sure how much harder removing the intake would be.... I just dont want to mess anything up more than i might already have... (Ever get something so far apart and you are like man i hope this goes back together!? ) Or spend money and more time now.. If i am just going to have to pay someone to replace the head gasket and whatever else down the the line..(Seems above my skills) I am only doing the water pump and timing belt now since there was a leak that seemed to be coming from there and i am hoping that is my problem.. I guess i should get to a question.. How often is it just the head bolts backing off and studs fix it? Right now I am currently going to just do the timing belt and get it all back together enough with the new pump and belt so i can pressurize the system and try the glow plug removed test.. I guess if it does fail ill need the head studs anyway?? How often does this fix it when one is over heating while towing like mine and putting head studs to reseal it actually work? I was talking to some mech friends and they didnt seem to think that would be a good way to go, unless it is something people often do with these. How much harder is it to remove the intake and do the head studs? Sorry for rambling... I just want this thing to run so i can pull my boat to the lake and not think i am sunk in it more than my boat!!!

geordi · **Posted:** Wed Jul 20, 2016 2:19 am

Ryan, breathe man.

I'm the guy who travels to work on these, and doing the head studs is something that many have paid me for. You don't always need to replace the head gasket, but if you have been getting coolant alarms - that is usually the indication. Unfortunately with an active leak externally, you are probably already having that problem.

The head studs DO cure the coolant leaking issue, and it isn't too much more difficult to get to the rockers / studs. If you wanted help in reassembling, I can give you a list of what needs to come off and in what order, and then I can do the reassembly for you. I've done this on several people's CRDs and given them a break on the cost for the time saved.

Now, the rest of the story... If you are contemplating going to the head gasket or even the studs, I would have to suggest replacing all of the exhaust valves. It isn't too much more in either labor or parts, and we know that the factory valves have given most people about 150-200k miles. But if you don't do it, your CRD could drop a valve without warning, which would invalidate all of this work and trash the motor in an instant. :furious:

I haven't found a suitable upgraded option yet, so it is only the stock stuff that IDparts has - I don't know yet (they are in transit now) if those will be the same as the factory originals, or if there was a design change. I hope they are different now.

Sorry - I probably just gave you lots more to think about, eh?

95Z28A4 · **Joined:** Sun Mar 30, 2014 9:53 am **Posts:** 297

geordi wrote:

I haven't found a suitable upgraded option yet, so it is only the stock stuff that IDparts has - I don't know yet (they are in transit now) if those will be the same as the factory originals, or if there was a design change. I hope they are different now.

Ferrea wasn't able to help? I would have thought their 5000 series valve would work fine for our application. Like Manley, they do have a custom valve order form.

http://www.ferrea.com/custom_valves.php

geordi · **Posted:** Wed Jul 20, 2016 11:10 am

I spoke with them, and they don't have anything off the shelf that could fit.

What they have custom... Would be $60 per valve and potentially have a 160-minimum unit order.

ryanchris · **Posted:** Thu Jul 21, 2016 10:02 am

So I went ahead and took my glow plugs out and a few other thing while waiting on my tools for the tb to come in, they should be here today not sure if I will get started with all that today or tomorrow tho... I am probably going to run the coolant pressure crank test before I take the tb and stuff off tho. So I know whether or not to order all the head gasket stuff. I did just temp reinstall the rad and stuff and found a leak in one of the hoses, it was small and not sure if I did it during removal or replacement or not, since it wasn't in an area that was leaking but I found one non the less.

Back to the glow plugs.. I still had the original factory ceramic ones as far as I could tell. Do I get a prize for possibly being the most miles / oldest one the originals??? I am pretty happy that all the tips looked good / unbroken. One or two were pretty black the others not as black maybe greyish black. I ordered the 5v ones, since I am going to do the DYI tune. Since all the tunes are set for 5v I can use the 5v plugs even tho mine were 7v since it is just in the Computer that sets the stuff for the plugs and the modules / relays are the same correct?

ryanchris · **Posted:** Sun Jul 24, 2016 8:31 pm

Did the glow plug removed crank test, and didnt get any coolant coming out of the glow plug holes... System was at 15 psi I crank it over a for maybe five minutes all together between checking for coolant and looking at the pressure. I havent had time to remove everything and do the tb and waterpump..Plus i figured i would do the glow plug test first.

Thoughts?

Also i asked above just making sure i am ok to use the 5v plugs?

geordi · **Posted:** Sun Jul 24, 2016 9:10 pm

I do not believe that the tunes are "all" set up to deliver 5v to the plugs. Maybe it is just the tunes from Yeti that are that way? From what GDE has told me, tune files only update what they are told to update, everything else is left alone. I don't know how that will translate to the DIY tune files though.

From what Yeti has said elsewhere, he believes that the plugs themselves have been updated and are now able to absorb 7v without damage, perhaps that means that they run hotter than the normal 7v plugs would. All I know is that the metal jacket is supposed to protect the plug from shattering into the cylinder if the ceramic breaks from being overheated / overvolted.

I'd look for clarity from whoever wrote your tune file.

ryanchris · **Posted:** Sun Jul 24, 2016 9:20 pm

Thanks geordi. So does the glow plug test mean it is not my head gasket or is that just one way to rule out one way it might be leaking an there are other leaks it could be instead?

Overheating, need guidance

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