LOST JEEPS :: View topic - Sams cold start thread:

poor fuel quality would be my guess.

If you ran any Biodiesel that wasn't washed good the cold weather helps participate out the glycerin/water. Could have some lodged in your filter causing poor fuel delivery. When it warms up the glycerin softens and allows fuel to flow better thru the filter.

twulf wrote:

I haven't run bio through this jeep since I have had it. Will any of the waxes or other stuff stay plugged on the filter even in summer(90F) weather? Or will they dissolve off and get passed through the fuel system.

It's not a bad thought to replace the filter thought, I have not done it. Filled up at costco yesterday, have not yet added PowerService, temps are up to 45F for startup this morning, the first start was a fail to fire, second was smooth and normal.

I wonder if there are any 12v glow plugs that would match the stock... I remember a conversation about this couple years ago but I can't recall the outcome. I believe earlier non US 2.8 and/or 2.5 had 12v plugs... I think Bill from South Africa said something about this, but I'm really not sure.

Sam, that engine starts like a 300k miles, low compression engine, wonder why, I also have slight starting issues, but not more than 5 seconds, as peteys24 said. I also have etecnos but have a dual battery setup. If I run weeks101 intake heater for 2 minutes when really cold, it helps starting but still about 5 sec of crank.

It takes about the same time cold crank at 10F as it takes at 40F. If I plug in even for 15 minutes (in garage at about 40F), it fires right up. My assumption is that the block heater is right below the cyl head, and the block being warm, the air and fuel will be also warmer. Definitely looks like being a glow plug issue, but man, for a 50K miles engine, thats bad.

I wonder if there are any 12v glow plugs that would match the stock... I remember a conversation about this couple years ago but I can't recall the outcome. I believe earlier non US 2.8 and/or 2.5 had 12v plugs... I think Bill from South Africa said something about this, but I'm really not sure.

I purchased a quart of MMO and dumped half of it in 3/4 guage of fuel, I'm going to go topoff with diesel and add the rest of it and some powerservice. After I have burned down that tank of diesel I will install a new fuel filter incase I send any crap into the filter with the MMO and powerservice.

I like this thread. I think the videos does a good job on showing the cold start and the coolant temp verified the temp of the engine. Here is mine after it's been sitting for 2 days and with no block heater. I have Bosch 5v steel plugs with GDE eco tune for 5V programming. The outside temp was 14F. I have the coolant temp in the video which was -8c or 18F. I have the weeks winter start kit but I didn't activate it for this start. If I use it properly then it usually start up on 1st or 2nd try. I also don't like to crank it for too long to avoid damage to the starter.

https://youtu.be/JxjHVUxp_fE

Author:	Sir Sam [ Sat Jan 14, 2017 2:31 pm ]
Post subject:	Sams cold start thread:
Tons of threads already going. Here is another. Took this video yesterday morning. I will repeat with some others to show what my starts are like. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CTpmQHRlUHQ

Author:	Sir Sam [ Sun Jan 15, 2017 2:45 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Sams cold start thread:
This one is mid 30s for temps, a little easier than the previous since its 10 degrees warmer. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8gH24cVd4bY

Author:	peteyz24 [ Sun Jan 22, 2017 4:57 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Sams cold start thread:
In the mid 20's mine starts up much much better than yours. I turn the key on, wait for gp light to go out then crank for about 5 seconds and it fires off. Your 24 degree start is pretty much like my -5f start. I wonder why they would be so different? Mine has 191k miles, and 7 volt etechnos. I run #2 fuel with white bottle powerservice mixed per the concentration on the bottle. I am talking about starts without the block heater.

Author:	Sir Sam [ Sun Jan 22, 2017 8:36 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Sams cold start thread:
Yes mine are all without the block heater thus far. I'm not sure why this engine starts this way. Even if the block heater is plugged in for 15-20 minutes it fires up just fine. Seems like if the coolant temp is over 45F outside air temp ts starts easy. Past experience shows that even at 45F I don't need glow plugs plugged in. This engine has less than 50k, and 5V Bosch plugs.

Author:	twulf [ Fri Jan 27, 2017 1:26 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Sams cold start thread:
poor fuel quality would be my guess.

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Sams cold start thread: http://www.lostjeeps.com/forum/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=85985	Page 1 of 1

Author:	Sir Sam [ Fri Jan 27, 2017 2:11 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Sams cold start thread:
This mornings startup. Actually better than I expected. 11F outside air temp, but coolant appeared warmer than ambient. Most starts my coolant is the same temp as ambient. twulf wrote: poor fuel quality would be my guess. Getting low on diesel and I need to get supplies at Costco, I'll get diesel there and also add powerservice and see what the next batch of cold brings.

Author:	twulf [ Sun Jan 29, 2017 2:14 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Sams cold start thread:
If you ran any Biodiesel that wasn't washed good the cold weather helps participate out the glycerin/water. Could have some lodged in your filter causing poor fuel delivery. When it warms up the glycerin softens and allows fuel to flow better thru the filter.

Author:	Sir Sam [ Sun Jan 29, 2017 12:56 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Sams cold start thread:
twulf wrote: If you ran any Biodiesel that wasn't washed good the cold weather helps participate out the glycerin/water. Could have some lodged in your filter causing poor fuel delivery. When it warms up the glycerin softens and allows fuel to flow better thru the filter. I haven't run bio through this jeep since I have had it. Will any of the waxes or other stuff stay plugged on the filter even in summer(90F) weather? Or will they dissolve off and get passed through the fuel system. It's not a bad thought to replace the filter thought, I have not done it. Filled up at costco yesterday, have not yet added PowerService, temps are up to 45F for startup this morning, the first start was a fail to fire, second was smooth and normal.

Author:	APC9199 [ Mon Jan 30, 2017 2:43 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Sams cold start thread:
Sir Sam wrote: twulf wrote: If you ran any Biodiesel that wasn't washed good the cold weather helps participate out the glycerin/water. Could have some lodged in your filter causing poor fuel delivery. When it warms up the glycerin softens and allows fuel to flow better thru the filter. I haven't run bio through this jeep since I have had it. Will any of the waxes or other stuff stay plugged on the filter even in summer(90F) weather? Or will they dissolve off and get passed through the fuel system. It's not a bad thought to replace the filter thought, I have not done it. Filled up at costco yesterday, have not yet added PowerService, temps are up to 45F for startup this morning, the first start was a fail to fire, second was smooth and normal. The fuel filter on these can have a pretty drastic effect on the performance of the vehicle. I had about 10k miles on one when I added a bottle of Marvel Mystery Oil to a full tank of diesel. Two tanks later it was starting hard and idling rough, blowing a puff of white smoke at startup. The mileage dropped from an average of about 23.5 to somewhere around 18. I thought I had damaged the engine but tried cleaning the MAP and changing the fuel filter before I did anything drastic. The MAP was fine, but the fuel that came out of the old filter looked like mud puddle water, foggy and with obvious particulates in it. Once the new filter was on, everything was back to normal. Long story short, the fuel filter can definitely cause problems like yours...and Marvel Mystery Oil is some incredible stuff!

Author:	thermorex [ Fri Feb 03, 2017 10:49 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Sams cold start thread:
Sam, that engine starts like a 300k miles, low compression engine, wonder why, I also have slight starting issues, but not more than 5 seconds, as peteys24 said. I also have etecnos but have a dual battery setup. If I run weeks101 intake heater for 2 minutes when really cold, it helps starting but still about 5 sec of crank. It takes about the same time cold crank at 10F as it takes at 40F. If I plug in even for 15 minutes (in garage at about 40F), it fires right up. My assumption is that the block heater is right below the cyl head, and the block being warm, the air and fuel will be also warmer. Definitely looks like being a glow plug issue, but man, for a 50K miles engine, thats bad. I wonder if there are any 12v glow plugs that would match the stock... I remember a conversation about this couple years ago but I can't recall the outcome. I believe earlier non US 2.8 and/or 2.5 had 12v plugs... I think Bill from South Africa said something about this, but I'm really not sure.

Author:	joe_ [ Fri Feb 03, 2017 3:26 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Sams cold start thread:
thermorex wrote: I wonder if there are any 12v glow plugs that would match the stock... I remember a conversation about this couple years ago but I can't recall the outcome. I believe earlier non US 2.8 and/or 2.5 had 12v plugs... I think Bill from South Africa said something about this, but I'm really not sure. 2002-2004 with the VM 2.5L or 2.8L had the steel 12v (or actually 11v I think). From googling around, I'm finding these numbers: Beru GN055 / 0100226494 Bosch GLP109 / 0250202038 Champion CH180 Chrysler 5066840AA Delphi HDS408 Denso DG-176 Etecno1 GX123 FAE 74222 ICAT 917864 Lucas LP099 Magneti Marelli UC44A NGK Y1031J / 96289 SUPERDIESEL SD8932 Valeo 345166 VM 46072007F (most of these are from http://www.sparkplug-crossreference.com/)

Author:	commonrail [ Fri Feb 03, 2017 8:54 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Sams cold start thread:
Check my post I wrote last month on this thread. viewtopic.php?f=5&t=85701

Author:	Sir Sam [ Sat Feb 04, 2017 4:58 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Sams cold start thread:
thermorex wrote: Sam, that engine starts like a 300k miles, low compression engine, wonder why, I also have slight starting issues, but not more than 5 seconds, as peteys24 said. I also have etecnos but have a dual battery setup. If I run weeks101 intake heater for 2 minutes when really cold, it helps starting but still about 5 sec of crank. It takes about the same time cold crank at 10F as it takes at 40F. If I plug in even for 15 minutes (in garage at about 40F), it fires right up. My assumption is that the block heater is right below the cyl head, and the block being warm, the air and fuel will be also warmer. Definitely looks like being a glow plug issue, but man, for a 50K miles engine, thats bad. I wonder if there are any 12v glow plugs that would match the stock... I remember a conversation about this couple years ago but I can't recall the outcome. I believe earlier non US 2.8 and/or 2.5 had 12v plugs... I think Bill from South Africa said something about this, but I'm really not sure. Starts about the same as my 05 with 120k more miles on it. If I use the block heater for 15 mins or so before startup it starts easily, this usually has the ECT at about 45F. From previous experence starting my 05 with the glow plug harness disconnected it would start fine down to mid 40s without the glow plugs. Letting these 5V plugs cycle or warm longer before cranking helps. This morning I plugged the block heater in, and about 10 minutes later went out to start it up. It started easily and smoothly but after idling for 5 seconds or so I went to rev it a little to get the trans to pump up and it died. After that it was very hard to start - I think the ECT got just hot enough that the glow plugs weren't running when I tried to restart. I purchased a quart of MMO and dumped half of it in 3/4 guage of fuel, I'm going to go topoff with diesel and add the rest of it and some powerservice. After I have burned down that tank of diesel I will install a new fuel filter incase I send any crap into the filter with the MMO and powerservice.

Author:	TerryZ91 [ Wed Mar 15, 2017 11:43 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Sams cold start thread:
I like this thread. I think the videos does a good job on showing the cold start and the coolant temp verified the temp of the engine. Here is mine after it's been sitting for 2 days and with no block heater. I have Bosch 5v steel plugs with GDE eco tune for 5V programming. The outside temp was 14F. I have the coolant temp in the video which was -8c or 18F. I have the weeks winter start kit but I didn't activate it for this start. If I use it properly then it usually start up on 1st or 2nd try. I also don't like to crank it for too long to avoid damage to the starter. https://youtu.be/JxjHVUxp_fE

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Author:	WWDiesel [ Wed Mar 15, 2017 11:58 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Sams cold start thread:
Sir Sam wrote: I purchased a quart of MMO and dumped half of it in 3/4 guage of fuel, I'm going to go topoff with diesel and add the rest of it and some powerservice. After I have burned down that tank of diesel I will install a new fuel filter incase I send any crap into the filter with the MMO and powerservice. Good choice, I use both in the fuel and they are very good products. The MMO even makes my engine idle smother and quieter when added to the engine oil!!!

Author:	Sir Sam [ Sun Mar 19, 2017 12:04 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Sams cold start thread:
TerryZ91 wrote: I like this thread. I think the videos does a good job on showing the cold start and the coolant temp verified the temp of the engine. Here is mine after it's been sitting for 2 days and with no block heater. I have Bosch 5v steel plugs with GDE eco tune for 5V programming. The outside temp was 14F. I have the coolant temp in the video which was -8c or 18F. I have the weeks winter start kit but I didn't activate it for this start. If I use it properly then it usually start up on 1st or 2nd try. I also don't like to crank it for too long to avoid damage to the starter. https://youtu.be/JxjHVUxp_fE Wow, feels about like mine does. Like yours it seems like if it can get that little surge up above 1000rpm it will smooth out nicely and idle fine.

Author:	diesel_guy86 [ Sun Mar 19, 2017 12:30 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Sams cold start thread:
This was my entry for the 2015 idparts cold start contest: https://youtu.be/7DjFJk-R_n8 Fast forward to 1:42 for the start. Temp was 0°, no block heater.