Its always something

mass-hole · **Posted:** Tue Jan 17, 2017 12:54 pm

I've got a really hard vibration that's developed in the last few days but only when the engine is under load. If I am driving on a flat road its totally fine but when I go to climb a hill and get into the throttle it starts shaking. It will do this in all transfer case modes(2wd, Full time, part time.) I replaced the U-joints on the rear shaft about 1.5 years ago and when i went to go check them yesterday they felt rock solid.

I am thinking motor mounts since it doesnt seem to be the rear shaft and it happens in 2wd and 4wd. Does this sound like the correct symptoms for mounts?

flash7210 · **Posted:** Tue Jan 17, 2017 1:19 pm

At what speeds do you feel it?
Is OD on or off?
Does the vibration stop when you let off the throttle?

I think its the torque converter. But that should only be happening at speeds where the TC is locked. (i.e 50+ mph with OD-on)

mass-hole · **Posted:** Tue Jan 17, 2017 1:42 pm

flash7210 wrote:

At what speeds do you feel it?
Is OD on or off?
Does the vibration stop when you let off the throttle?

I think its the torque converter. But that should only be happening at speeds where the TC is locked. (i.e 50+ mph with OD-on)

It doesnt happen up to about 50% throttle i would say. I do most off my driving at 55+ so I really noticed it in 4th and 5th gear locked. I will see what it does around town when I head in today.

Thing is I have had almost 0 TC shudder. I think the only time i really had it was towing a trailer post GDE hot tune up a hill in 5th. That was years ago. Maybe I need to top of the transmission?

flash7210 · **Posted:** Tue Jan 17, 2017 2:06 pm

Well, you have been modding the tune... :wink:

Mine will definitely shudder when accelerating up a hill in 5th.
Sometimes on flat land too if I punch it hard. But gently accelerating seems fine.

WWDiesel · **Posted:** Tue Jan 17, 2017 2:37 pm

If you have or feel shudder when in lockup in either 4th or 5th gear going up an incline, its time to consider getting a new torque converter. :roll:

Best advice; I know it is a little pricey, but you get what you pay for; get a Suncoast TC and forget TC shudder forever!
It will handle anything you can throw at it, including hot tunes, modified tunes, hot tunes with performance boxes, bigger turbos, etc...
They are absolutely bulletproof!!!!!

flash7210 · **Posted:** Tue Jan 17, 2017 2:44 pm

WWDiesel wrote:

If you have or feel shudder when in lockup in either 4th or 5th gear going up an incline, its time to consider getting a new torque converter. :roll:

Best advice; I know it is a little pricey, but you get what you pay for; get a Suncoast TC and forget TC shudder forever!
It will handle anything you can throw at it, including hot tunes, modified tunes, hot tunes with performance boxes, bigger turbos, etc...
They are absolutely bulletproof!!!!!

I have a hemi TC waiting to install.

Its just that whole dropping the transmission part... :roll:

papaindigo · **Posted:** Tue Jan 17, 2017 3:56 pm

Per GDE "The Jeep Liberty CRD is equipped with hydromounts that do a better job isolating the engine vibration from the body as compared with more conventional mounts. However, the durability of the hydromount is not the - See more at: http://www.greendieselengineering.com/j ... CYA5e.dpuf best and tends to break internally with vehicle mileage above 70,000 miles. When this occurs the vibration will be increased when idling in gear. If the noise/vibration is higher while idling in drive compared to reverse, then the passenger side mount is failed. If the opposite is true then the driver's side is failed. The noise/vibration should be roughly the same in drive and reverse while idling with brake pressed if both mounts are still good. The passenger side mount is more prone to failure as it is loaded more in drive and tends to have higher heat loading due to the close proximity to the exhaust pipe."

Not unheard of for "U" joints to go bad more quickly than usual and IIRC they are hard to diagnose while on the vehicle.

Shudder is possible. Quickest way to tell is when the vibration happens immediately back off the throttle a bit. If the vibration immediately stops it's likely torque convertor but if not it's something else. If it does stop try adding 1qt of ATF+4 and see if that helps.

Mountainman · **Posted:** Tue Jan 17, 2017 4:22 pm

X2 for torque converter. I'd just have a shop do it and update the pump while they're in there. Expensive, but doing it yourself will just suck and no insurance. If you have to do the updated pump, you'll need the updated cover also, but I've surprised on some of them when I open them up there's already an updated pump, 2005's too, so don't order the parts until you see what you have

mass-hole · **Posted:** Tue Jan 17, 2017 4:34 pm

OK so I drove to town. The shakimg was REALLY bad when I first left the house(11 degrees out). Even mildly accelerating from a stop the whole car was shaking and even at just mild throttle on flats and downhills it was pretty bad. Like 5-10% throttle was all it took. As soon as I let up it would stop shaking and coast like nothing was wrong.

The thing is, as the driveline warmed up it got MUCH better. It would still do it lightly at higher load in higher gears, but by the time I got to park city I couldn't get it to do it in town.

Edit. A little more driving and doesn't seem to be related to TC lockup. I merged on the highway from a stop and it was shakimg from like 25 up to 60. It actually seemed to almost go away at 65+/fully loaded in 5th. Very weird.

mass-hole · **Posted:** Tue Jan 17, 2017 4:49 pm

papaindigo wrote:

Per GDE "The Jeep Liberty CRD is equipped with hydromounts that do a better job isolating the engine vibration from the body as compared with more conventional mounts. However, the durability of the hydromount is not the - See more at: http://www.greendieselengineering.com/j ... CYA5e.dpuf best and tends to break internally with vehicle mileage above 70,000 miles. When this occurs the vibration will be increased when idling in gear. If the noise/vibration is higher while idling in drive compared to reverse, then the passenger side mount is failed. If the opposite is true then the driver's side is failed. The noise/vibration should be roughly the same in drive and reverse while idling with brake pressed if both mounts are still good. The passenger side mount is more prone to failure as it is loaded more in drive and tends to have higher heat loading due to the close proximity to the exhaust pipe."

Not unheard of for "U" joints to go bad more quickly than usual and IIRC they are hard to diagnose while on the vehicle.

Shudder is possible. Quickest way to tell is when the vibration happens immediately back off the throttle a bit. If the vibration immediately stops it's likely torque convertor but if not it's something else. If it does stop try adding 1qt of ATF+4 and see if that helps.

I'm gunna try the ATF+4 when I get home.

The u-joint I replaced last year was literally about to come apart, it was hanging on for dear life. Your right though, the first time I checked it it looked fine then a month or two later it was completely obvious.

undrgnd · **Joined:** Sat Mar 26, 2016 4:47 am **Posts:** 194

papaindigo wrote:

Per GDE "The Jeep Liberty CRD is equipped with hydromounts that do a better job isolating the engine vibration from the body as compared with more conventional mounts. However, the durability of the hydromount is not the - See more at: http://www.greendieselengineering.com/j ... CYA5e.dpuf best and tends to break internally with vehicle mileage above 70,000 miles. When this occurs the vibration will be increased when idling in gear. If the noise/vibration is higher while idling in drive compared to reverse, then the passenger side mount is failed. If the opposite is true then the driver's side is failed. The noise/vibration should be roughly the same in drive and reverse while idling with brake pressed if both mounts are still good. The passenger side mount is more prone to failure as it is loaded more in drive and tends to have higher heat loading due to the close proximity to the exhaust pipe."

Not unheard of for "U" joints to go bad more quickly than usual and IIRC they are hard to diagnose while on the vehicle.

Shudder is possible. Quickest way to tell is when the vibration happens immediately back off the throttle a bit. If the vibration immediately stops it's likely torque convertor but if not it's something else. If it does stop try adding 1qt of ATF+4 and see if that helps.

Thank you for this. Great info!

Fabio_The_Jocker · **Joined:** Fri Mar 10, 2017 6:37 am **Posts:** 13

Good morning! Were you able to resolve? I have THE SAME Problem: uphill enters the lockup, we hit the gas and I have strong vibration to rear axle.
Thinking to TC I did make a map with less torque, but the result does not change. Even the intensity of vibration. It's really strong, I feel distinctly come from behind. I do not know what to think, tomorrow change oil and check the differential. :?:

Ah sorry for my bad English :oops:

ROKTAXI · **Posted:** Fri Mar 10, 2017 10:35 pm

I've been having about the same condition that the OP mass-hole has been experiencing. Mine starts the vibration, with a drone, at 40 mph and continues to just over 50 mph. Smooths out at 60+. No shudder. Can feel it in the steering wheel.

At the vibration speeds, if I let off the throttle momentarily, it goes away. As soon as I resume throttle pressure, it starts up again. Is not effected by engine RPM, only vehicle speed in any gear except 1st gear of course.

I have previously posted this issue on another thread but no consensus on a solution. Drive shaft u-joints and CV's / front axle shafts / wheel bearing hubs /motor mounts have been replaced. Went to a shop that builds TC's and after driving it, is pretty sure it's not the TC .... but said he'd be glad to sell me a custom or stock one if I wanted one. GDE also does not think it's the TC. :5SHOTS:

thermorex · **Posted:** Sat Mar 11, 2017 1:30 am

I'm curious what is it... Could be torque converter, motor/transmission mounts, drive axle/shaft related. You said there is vibration, not just noise. Could be driveline...

WolverineFW · **Posted:** Sat Mar 11, 2017 1:34 am

Is you drive shaft out of balance or bent?

Sent from my SM-N910W8 using Tapatalk

ROKTAXI · **Posted:** Sat Mar 11, 2017 10:21 am

The front driveshaft was removed and the vibration / drone was still there. Still the possibility lingers about the rear drive shaft out of balance. However, would that be felt in the steering wheel and come and go with throttle response?

thermorex · **Posted:** Sat Mar 11, 2017 11:02 am

Oh, btw, did you hit anything significant with one of the tires? You could have an inside hump or one on the thread side, that's not visible easily. I'd imagine if your front tire had one, you'd feel it in the steering wheel. But the rear tires can make the jeep shake. Also, if you recently changed wheels, and the new rims are not perfectly centered on wheel hub. It happened to me with custom rims on a different vehicle. The center hub hole on the new rims was bigger than the hub size, so the rims came with a hub ring to fill in the extra space on the rim. I forgot to install the rings and I had some serious vibrations, since the rim did not perfectly centered no matter what. The vibrations were very visible over 50 mph.

ROKTAXI · **Posted:** Sat Mar 11, 2017 4:04 pm

The first thing I did was have the NEW tires / rims re-balanced and rotated. No change in behavior. However, that doesn't mean that all the rims don't have a mfg. issue. But I would think it would show up when they were balanced. The vibration was there even before the new tires / rims, but not as pronounced.

Fabio_The_Jocker · **Joined:** Fri Mar 10, 2017 6:37 am **Posts:** 13

WolverineFW wrote:

Is you drive shaft out of balance or bent?

Sent from my SM-N910W8 using Tapatalk

how can I check if the drive shaft is balanced or not? :?:

my vibrations coming from behind (rear axle, driveshaft, differential)?

racertracer · **Posted:** Mon Mar 13, 2017 8:49 am

Fabio_The_Jocker wrote:

WolverineFW wrote:

Is you drive shaft out of balance or bent?

Sent from my SM-N910W8 using Tapatalk

how can I check if the drive shaft is balanced or not? :?:

my vibrations coming from behind (rear axle, driveshaft, differential)?

Question ... have you replaced all the old fluids from the differentials? I replaced the diff fluid with synthetic and cleaned out the caked mud that was sitting at the at the bottom of the housing by reaching in with my rubber gloved hand and dragging out all the thick mud

That solved the shaking I was experiencing coming from the rear part of the vehicle at high speeds.

Its always something

Who is online