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Electric universal inline pump setup/ignition tap
http://www.lostjeeps.com/forum/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=86323		 Page 1 of 2
Author:  res0wc18 [ Thu Mar 23, 2017 4:44 pm ]
Post subject:  Electric universal inline pump setup/ignition tap
Considering putting in a carter P74020 or similar in the engine bay to help keep the cp3 fed. I have the new style filter head but gotta believe that no lift pump is hard on the cp3.

Not sure how much fuel and psi the liberty crd needs, but that pump is about 40 ounces of fuel a minute at max of 14psi.

Anyone done this? Where is a good spot to tap into a keyed hot ignition?

Thanks

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Author:  flash7210 [ Thu Mar 23, 2017 6:09 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Electric universal inline pump setup/ignition tap
Looks like it will work.
The fuel lines are 3/8" so make sure it has fittings for that.
And its a good idea to use a pre-filter at the pump inlet.
Power is sourced from the fuel pump relay in the fuse/relay box under the hood.

I use a Facet 40109.
I like it because it has a check valve.
Author:  WWDiesel [ Thu Mar 23, 2017 8:34 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Electric universal inline pump setup/ignition tap
I would strongly recommend installing an in-tank fuel pump verses an in-line pump!!! A majority of owners have installed the in-tank lift pump to cure air in fuel problems!
The absolute best way to ensure you never have any air infusion in the fuel system ever again is to install an in-tank fuel pump like the Carter P76148M in-tank fuel pump or an equivalent!
Your Jeep is already factory wired to a connector under the back seat on the drivers side for the in-tank pump including a fuel pump relay in the Power Distribution Center and the ECM already has the logic loaded for operation of the pump!
(The fuel pump relay runs the pump for ~15 seconds when you switch the key to the ON position and then runs the pump continuously when you start the engine)
It is a fuel pump for a diesel like the ones used in some of the later model Dodge Cummins Ram trucks.
You will be amazed at how much better the engine runs and performs with the addition of an in-tank fuel pump!!!
The pressure runs at about 12-14 psig with a clean fuel filter! This not only puts positive pressure all the way to the back of the CP3 injection pump, it also puts all fuel lines, filter head, filter, and all fittings under positive pressure which they are designed to seal.

Additional in-tank fuel pump part numbers: AIRTEX-E7181M, DELPHI-FG1224, MOPAR-5143160AA

A properly installed in-tank lift pump will ensure absolutely NO air infusion into the fuel system period! :!:
An in-tank lift pump puts the entire fuel system under a positive (+) pressure from where it first exits the fuel pump inside the fuel tank through all the fuel lines and fittings, through the fuel filter head, heater, and filter, all the way to the back of the CP3 injection pump.
ANY LEAK anywhere on the system will BE SELF EVIDENT and show up very quickly as fuel leaking out.
Air simply cannot get into the system while it is under 10-15 psig of pressure!!! :D

If you opt to do the wiring harness mod yourself, all you will have to add is two wires from under the rear seat to the top of the fuel tank. The OEM fuel line fittings are designed for positive pressure, not vacuum, and will work just fine with the in-tank pump install and will not require any changes...

These two links below will answer any questions concerning installing an in-tank lift pump and / or wiring it up properly.
http://www.auerbach.ca/kj/lift_pump/
viewtopic.php?t=26385&highlight=

Seth at Sasquatch Parts has both the fuel pumps and correct wiring harness listed on his web site, Link: > https://shop.sasquatchparts.com/
Link:> https://shop.sasquatchparts.com/product ... 5143160AA/

:SOMBRERO:
Author:  res0wc18 [ Thu Mar 23, 2017 9:18 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Electric universal inline pump setup/ignition tap
Thanks for the info. I'm very aware of the difference in an in tank vs inline pumps and theorys.

The one thing I am not sure of and haven't seen is if you can do the in tank lift pump mod etc while leaving the tank in the car and access it from the top? Not sure if there is an access panel or what not.

I was asking specifically about inline pumps with these engines and if anyone had done one and the results.




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Author:  res0wc18 [ Thu Mar 23, 2017 9:44 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Electric universal inline pump setup/ignition tap
Flash
Thanks for the info.

Have you put in this inline type instead of the in tank?

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Author:  jws84_02 [ Thu Mar 23, 2017 9:56 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Electric universal inline pump setup/ignition tap
I've done 2 inline pumps now. But I still drop the tank and replace the push fitting line and install the pump back there. If you put it up from it will still suck air eventually from the crappy factory line
Author:  res0wc18 [ Thu Mar 23, 2017 10:23 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Electric universal inline pump setup/ignition tap
Jws84_02


Understood. Can you do this with the tank still installed from the top? Is there an access hole or whatever under the carpet?

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Author:  GordnadoCRD [ Thu Mar 23, 2017 11:59 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Electric universal inline pump setup/ignition tap
Depends on the year and possibly the model.
I can tell you that my 2006 does not have access.
I've heard that older ones do have an access hatch but I don't know at what point they discontinued that.
Having dropped the tank and installed a 2006 Dodge-Cummins 1 ton unit in mine, I can tell you it's not nearly as difficult as I imagined it.
The hardest part was threading the new power wires through the existing wire loom and attaching proper ends, but that's not exactly necessary.
With the number of Dodge diesel trucks in wrecking yards, it's easy to get a really good deal.

If you still choose to put on an out-of-tank pump, Make sure to:
1) get a pump with an anti-drain back check valve, or install one between the tank and the pump.
2) get a pump that has the ability to pull at least 20" head height.
1&2 are necessary to prevent recurrence of the air-in-fuel issues.
3) get a pump that has a draw-through capability, so if it fails for any reason, you won't be stranded, as the cp3 will still be able to pull fuel from the tank as it does now.
4) Prime it before you install it. You don't want it running when dry.

Good Luck

{edit} Another thing I found helpful was that I spun the unit around so that the fuel fittings at the top of the unit face forward rather than backward. This way I saved about a foot of line on each side. (at 9 bucks a foot for silicone fuel line it was worth it. It also lines in such a way that the lines won't kink due to having to make an immediate 180 degree bend, just to point in the right direction.
Also, the Dodge Cummins sending unit float arm makes a bend that's right about dead even with the bottom of the tank. The Liberty one makes a bend that's about 3/8" higher. This is due to the shape of the Liberty tank bottom. For the gauge to read correctly you will need to either swap the Liberty sending unit with the Dodge one, OR re-shape the bend in the Dodge unit to compensate for the ridges in the Liberty tank bottom.
Author:  flash7210 [ Fri Mar 24, 2017 9:23 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Electric universal inline pump setup/ignition tap
res0wc18 wrote:
Flash
Thanks for the info.

Have you put in this inline type instead of the in tank?

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Yes. My Facet pump is inline and in the engine bay.
I've been using it for almost 8 years now. Sometimes removing it for diagnostic purposes.
IMO, if you are using a lift pump of any type, you dont need to fix the line back at the tank. But this may not always be the case.
I fixed my fuel line at the tank.

Because my Facet pump has a check valve, my hand priming pump on the filter head is always firm. Even when it hasnt been driven for several days.
Author:  joe_ [ Fri Mar 24, 2017 11:36 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Electric universal inline pump setup/ignition tap
flash7210 wrote:
IMO, if you are using a lift pump of any type, you dont need to fix the line back at the tank. But this may not always be the case.
I fixed my fuel line at the tank.
If you have an in-tank lift pump, you shouldn't have to modify the connections at the tank because they're now under pressure rather than vacuum. If you have an inline pump, those fittings are still under vacuum, right? So they're probably just as likely to allow air to leak in as they are when you're running with only the CP3.
Author:  racertracer [ Fri Mar 24, 2017 1:12 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Electric universal inline pump setup/ignition tap
The inline compensates for the leak. No issues since 2009.
Author:  mass-hole [ Fri Mar 24, 2017 1:59 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Electric universal inline pump setup/ignition tap
Dropping the tank is not hard. A floor jack and a few ratchet straps should be all you need.

The longest part of the whole in-tank pump install was pulling apart the interior and reconfiguring/installing the wiring. Dropping the tank and performing pump swap were pretty straight forward and easy.
Author:  res0wc18 [ Fri Mar 24, 2017 5:40 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Electric universal inline pump setup/ignition tap
Awesome info guys

Found out the Facet 40304 is the highest flow and PSI unit with the check valve and stainless steel insides. 70 bucks. Seems like it would be more than enough to keep the 2.8 happy.

Figure out how to wire the pump to run when the key is on via the said fuel pump relay and boom should be straight forward.


http://www.facet-purolator.com/cat_part ... 50&col=GPH


As far as dropping the tank and what not for the plastic leak prone fittings, I'm not sure it's necessary for mine. I have the updated fuel filter head and it always keeps a prime so not sure if it is necessary.

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Author:  flash7210 [ Fri Mar 24, 2017 5:47 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Electric universal inline pump setup/ignition tap
res0wc18 wrote:

Found out the Facet 40304 is the highest flow and PSI unit with the check valve and stainless steel insides. 70 bucks. Seems like it would be more than enough to keep the 2.8 happy.



http://www.facet-purolator.com/cat_part ... 50&col=GPH


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But that pump only has 1/8" fuel line fittings.
Author:  res0wc18 [ Fri Mar 24, 2017 9:04 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Electric universal inline pump setup/ignition tap
Yup common size for almost all pumps except super high flow

https://m.summitracing.com/parts/sum-221108

Or more commonly

https://m.summitracing.com/parts/edd-846260

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Author:  flash7210 [ Fri Mar 24, 2017 9:23 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Electric universal inline pump setup/ignition tap
Keep driving on then. Looks like you've got it covered.
Author:  res0wc18 [ Sat Mar 25, 2017 2:35 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Electric universal inline pump setup/ignition tap
Flash on your setup how did you tap into the relay/etc under the hood you mentioned?

Did you use the under hood factory relay to signal a secondary constant duty relay to power the pump or?

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Author:  racertracer [ Sat Mar 25, 2017 2:41 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Electric universal inline pump setup/ignition tap
here is the pump to buy...

Facet / Purolator lift pump Number 60104

http://www.facet-purolator.com/posi-flo-pumps.php

viewtopic.php?f=5&t=58378&hilit=facet+inline+lift+pump
Author:  racertracer [ Sun Mar 26, 2017 4:26 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Electric universal inline pump setup/ignition tap
Here is the Kennedy Pump install thread.

viewtopic.php?f=98&t=39362
Author:  foxhunter [ Sun Mar 26, 2017 10:10 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Electric universal inline pump setup/ignition tap
you should have plenty of info now.
http://liberty.eurekaboy.com/kennedy.htm
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