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fuel rail pressure solenoid http://www.lostjeeps.com/forum/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=86360 |
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Author: | Mountainman [ Thu Apr 06, 2017 3:54 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: fuel rail pressure solenoid |
I just caution the possibility of blowing something up, although I'm 95% sure the ecu will kill it first. As for reselling it, they are a one time use item from what I've read, but many thanks for trying this out! This kind of stuff is what makes LOST so great |
Author: | GordnadoCRD [ Thu Apr 06, 2017 4:35 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: fuel rail pressure solenoid |
The original (as far as I know) that's currently in there is stuck closed and nothing is blown up. It will start and run with the fuel pressure sensor unplugged, and the fuel pressure hovers around 12000psi at 1100 rpm. If I plug the fuel pressure sensor back in, when the ECU senses the fuel over-pressure situation, it kills the engine. Takes from 2-6 seconds to react. |
Author: | joe_ [ Fri Apr 07, 2017 3:55 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: fuel rail pressure solenoid |
For the sake of comparison, mine reads about 8300psi @ ~1100 RPM in the Torque app. (I took that reading about 30 sec - 1 min after a cold start if that makes any difference.) |
Author: | GordnadoCRD [ Tue Apr 18, 2017 10:57 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: fuel rail pressure solenoid |
Part Received Rail pulled out Comparison pictures sent to WWDiesel. I'm having trouble with my cloud hosting thing. |
Author: | GordnadoCRD [ Tue Apr 18, 2017 11:21 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: fuel rail pressure solenoid |
The next step is finding out if it's compatible with this ECU. Interesting that it's physically the same unit used for the Dynamax 6.6L Price $85 shipped. |
Author: | GordnadoCRD [ Wed Apr 19, 2017 1:46 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: fuel rail pressure solenoid |
Thank You! Thank You very much! Having to make a special tool to properly torque this 30MM sleeve. more pics when it's done. Really hoping the ECM can make this valve work correctly. |
Author: | flash7210 [ Wed Apr 19, 2017 7:32 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: fuel rail pressure solenoid |
Can you please post pics of the end of the fuel rail with the solenoid removed and the crush sleeve? Is the crush sleeve reusable somehow? What is the torque value? When I replaced my rail pressure sensor there was no crush sleeve on it. I used blue locktite on the threads just to be sure is would seal tight. You might be able to do the same thing with the solenoid to seal its threads, keeping the old sleeve in place. But without seeing how it threads into the rail I cant be sure. Just for reference, IDparts list the same rail pressure solenoid for both the 2.8 CRD and the 3.0 CRD. I cant verify how accurate that is but this picture shows the 3.0 fuel rail and no crush sleeve on the solenoid. IOW, I dont think the crush sleeve plays any part in sealing the solenoid to the rail. |
Author: | WWDiesel [ Wed Apr 19, 2017 10:19 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: fuel rail pressure solenoid |
Looking at the pictures, it looks like a simple adaptor or adaptor/spacer to me, not a true "crush sleeve". They may have added this part because they did not want the sensor to screw in too deep into the end of the rail? A "crush sleeve" is something that actually gets "crushed" when enough pressure is applied! Like the sleeve between the pinion bearings! |
Author: | GordnadoCRD [ Wed Apr 19, 2017 2:10 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: fuel rail pressure solenoid |
[edited for clarity] There is no separate crush component. And it's not exactly a crush sleeve. The crushed part is the larger flat part at the very end of the valve body. It's a one time use only design, like in the manner of the copper washers used with banjo bolt fittings. The threaded part is somewhat like a step-down bushing for pipe, but there is no internal threads, so it spins freely on the valve body. I will refer to it as a "Torque Sleeve". The larger hex is for positioning the body, and for holding it from turning as the threaded part pushes it in. I will get better pictures when my bro gets home from work. Had to use his camera phone for the pics. If you've ever pulled the steering wheel from a GM vehicle to replace a broken signal switch, for example, the Saginaw column has that steel steering wheel lock ring plate that has to be removed. To do that it must be pressed down so the keeper ring can be removed. The body of this valve has a ring very much like that, and when you thread the bushing in, there is a groove the bushing fits in to as it pushes against the ring, so the ring can not come out of it's groove. I will try to show this as well. The business end of the valve pushes tight against a reduced diameter shoulder inside the rail. This is the part that separates the high pressure that the pintle valve works in, and the low pressure area that the discharged fuel flows to, and out the return port. The high pressure valve is the really small pintle point at the tip. When the fuel pressure pushes it back against spring and magnetic pressure and away from it's seal, the fuel flows around the valve seal tip, and around and pintle shaft, through the journal it passes through, and comes out behind the major shoulder seal to the low pressure discharge area. In a similar fashion that that oil is supplied to a hydraulic lifter, but with reverse flow. Again, I will try to show this with pictures. I've disassembled the mounting parts of the removed valve to show how everything works. The pintle also has a tiny shoulder that limits the distance the valve shaft can be pushed back. I'm guessing here, but it appears to limit the movement to about 1.5mm to 2mm. It appears, in this case, that the part of the valve shaft that passes through the body (on my removed valve) is boogered a bit, and not allowing the valve to be pushed back properly, causing the pressure to be way too high. I will do my best to get a pic of the rail insides. One other thing if you do this, when you mount the rail in a soft-jawed vice, do not clamp down on the mounting journals, on mine, at least, the bolts that mount it to the valve cover pass through very very tightly, and if the surfaces are displaced at all, the bolts will give you a heck of a time going back in. |
Author: | Mountainman [ Wed Apr 19, 2017 3:32 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: fuel rail pressure solenoid |
Thanks again for the bravery! Are you just fabbing up a crows foot to torque it? |
Author: | GordnadoCRD [ Wed Apr 19, 2017 3:34 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: fuel rail pressure solenoid |
Something like that. It kind of depends on what kind of 30mm wrench I can find to improvise. |
Author: | Mountainman [ Wed Apr 19, 2017 3:58 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: fuel rail pressure solenoid |
http://www.ntxtools.com/network-tool-wa ... fgodOjkBBA A quick search turned up one for cheap. Unless shipping is crazy can't beat $6 |
Author: | GordnadoCRD [ Wed Apr 19, 2017 5:26 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: fuel rail pressure solenoid |
That is exactly what I was shopping around for, but never found one I could buy without paying for a whole SPECIAL ORDER special tool set for around $80. Thanks MM! I'll turn my fabrication skills loose on something else till it gets here... [edit] It should be here by Saturday. |
Author: | Mountainman [ Wed Apr 19, 2017 9:32 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: fuel rail pressure solenoid |
GordnadoCRD wrote: That is exactly what I was shopping around for, but never found one I could buy without paying for a whole SPECIAL ORDER special tool set for around $80. Thanks MM! I'll turn my fabrication skills loose on something else till it gets here... [edit] It should be here by Saturday. Anytime, yeah, I like making tools, but not really cheap ones |
Author: | GordnadoCRD [ Wed Apr 19, 2017 9:58 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: fuel rail pressure solenoid |
If I can buy a tool for a price like that, the hours spent heating, bending, cutting and welding, could be better spent in the time it takes to ship here. I have more pics that were requested I'm hoping WWDiesel will continue to help me with the uploading and posting. |
Author: | GordnadoCRD [ Wed Apr 19, 2017 11:51 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: fuel rail pressure solenoid |
Responding to Flash's question about the hydraulic fuel seal This component you can see with the photos I've sent to WWDiesel. For the fuel pressure sensor, it has a similar boss that the sensor seals against, however in it's case, the tip of the sensor has a machined relief from the fuel sensor port, outward to about 3 MM or so from the very outside edge. The raised portion at the outside edge is the part that presses against the internal rail boss. Very small contact area means very high force pressing against the fuel rail body. I put a very very high end non hardening thread sealing compound on the threads, but being brass it probably wasn't necessary. The tightening of the Fuel High Pressure relief valve - servo thing I'm working with here, has a really weird tightening procedure. The part you tighten is not the large hex you can see. All that is for as far as I can tell, is to hold the servo body from spinning out of position when torquing the threaded brass Torque Sleeve, so I have to have something like the tool MM found to be able to get to the 30mm torque sleeve hex, and apply the appropriate torque. I also understand I'm going to have to make adjustment to the torque values, since this tool is changing the force radius from that of the torque wrench drive. The procedure is 1) Torque the sleeve to 44 ft lbs. 2) Back the sleeve off 90 degrees. 3) RE-Torque the sleeve to 59 ft lbs |
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