First start in over a year. Doesn't sound right?

sbarne3 · **Joined:** Tue Jul 25, 2017 9:33 pm **Posts:** 82

Hi all... It's me again... lol

I installed the timing belt this afternoon and made sure that I could turn the engine over by hand and everything felt smooth so I decided to crank it up, but it doesn't sound right to me. This is my first diesel so I know that they sound different than a gas engine, but is this normal?

Take a listen and tell me what you think. https://youtu.be/YGpws1QBHpM

Also, I'm guessing the smoke is because it sat for so long without running?

flash7210 · **Posted:** Wed Sep 06, 2017 10:04 pm

Sounds to me like you have an exhaust leak.

Also, the long cranking is because of air in fuel lines.

jws84_02 · **Posted:** Thu Sep 07, 2017 7:19 am

Bleed that fuel filter. To me it sounds like a little back pressure out the intake and is just more noticeable without the intercooler and plumbing on

krautastic · **Joined:** Sat Jun 03, 2017 9:52 pm **Posts:** 33

It sounds like its not running on all 4 cylinders. While it'll be louder without the induction piping on, it just sounds very lopey. I don't know your story or why it sat around for a year. Did you ever hear it run before? I've uploaded a video of my start up after completing headgasket/t-belt. While the t-belt cover is on, the induction system is still disconnected.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XZk5W72noHE

Whats weird is the smoke appeared before the engine fired up. Could be a massive exhaust leak and you had some oil leak down into the cylinders. With that exhaust leak would be the much louder pulses the engine is creating. The good news is that there's no metal on metal noises occurring.

joe_ · **Posted:** Thu Sep 07, 2017 12:52 pm

Aside from the fact that it only appears to be running on 3 cylinders, the compression doesn't sound even during cranking. Compare your video to the one krautastic posted. It sounds like one of your cylinders may not have compression. As much of a pain as this is, I'd suggest pulling the valve cover back off and seeing whether all the rockers are in place. You might have bumped one while installing the cover and it could be sitting crooked and holding a valve open or something.

sbarne3 · **Joined:** Tue Jul 25, 2017 9:33 pm **Posts:** 82

jws84_02 wrote:

Bleed that fuel filter. To me it sounds like a little back pressure out the intake and is just more noticeable without the intercooler and plumbing on

Good thought and definitely something I forgot.

I just replaced the fuel filter and bled the new one to get all of the air out, but it's still not sounding right

sbarne3 · **Joined:** Tue Jul 25, 2017 9:33 pm **Posts:** 82

krautastic wrote:

It sounds like its not running on all 4 cylinders. While it'll be louder without the induction piping on, it just sounds very lopey. I don't know your story or why it sat around for a year. Did you ever hear it run before? I've uploaded a video of my start up after completing headgasket/t-belt. While the t-belt cover is on, the induction system is still disconnected.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XZk5W72noHE

Whats weird is the smoke appeared before the engine fired up. Could be a massive exhaust leak and you had some oil leak down into the cylinders. With that exhaust leak would be the much louder pulses the engine is creating. The good news is that there's no metal on metal noises occurring.

Thanks for uploading the video... Yours is exactly what I would expect to hear, but mine definitely doesn't sound that way.

Previous owner hired someone to replace the head gasket (water in oil) and then the guy he hired got arrested mid way through the job. After about a year he gave up on it and sold it to me.

One thought I had is does the order of the injectors matter? I read in the SM that each one has a unique calibration code that has to be entered into the computer? Since they were already removed, I had no way of knowing what order to put them back in. My only clue is that two of them were marked with a white dot. Maybe those are #1 and #3?

sbarne3 · **Joined:** Tue Jul 25, 2017 9:33 pm **Posts:** 82

joe_ wrote:

Aside from the fact that it only appears to be running on 3 cylinders, the compression doesn't sound even during cranking. Compare your video to the one krautastic posted. It sounds like one of your cylinders may not have compression. As much of a pain as this is, I'd suggest pulling the valve cover back off and seeing whether all the rockers are in place. You might have bumped one while installing the cover and it could be sitting crooked and holding a valve open or something.

Oh man... I sure hope not... A mechanic, I am not... It has taken me many hours to get this far. I was very careful about not knocking over the rockers (anything is possible though I guess). What a stupid design btw.

krautastic · **Joined:** Sat Jun 03, 2017 9:52 pm **Posts:** 33

sbarne3 wrote:

Thanks for uploading the video... Yours is exactly what I would expect to hear, but mine definitely doesn't sound that way.

Previous owner hired someone to replace the head gasket (water in oil) and then the guy he hired got arrested mid way through the job. After about a year he gave up on it and sold it to me.

One thought I had is does the order of the injectors matter? I read in the SM that each one has a unique calibration code that has to be entered into the computer? Since they were already removed, I had no way of knowing what order to put them back in. My only clue is that two of them were marked with a white dot. Maybe those are #1 and #3?

Yes, injector order does matter. I don't know how one would figure out how to put them in not knowing what order they were removed in. I marked mine so I could put them back. I didn't hear the compression thing mentioned, it sounded like it was cranking like mine, there's a hiccup right when the smoke happens and then the engine catches. Determining injector order would be a good next step, but again, I don't know what that procedure is, but, I didn't hear any terrible metal to metal interactions, so I would lean toward an injection issue. Is your exhaust manifold bolted to the engine block, or is that off from the headgasket repair?

sbarne3 · **Joined:** Tue Jul 25, 2017 9:33 pm **Posts:** 82

krautastic wrote:

sbarne3 wrote:

Thanks for uploading the video... Yours is exactly what I would expect to hear, but mine definitely doesn't sound that way.

Previous owner hired someone to replace the head gasket (water in oil) and then the guy he hired got arrested mid way through the job. After about a year he gave up on it and sold it to me.

One thought I had is does the order of the injectors matter? I read in the SM that each one has a unique calibration code that has to be entered into the computer? Since they were already removed, I had no way of knowing what order to put them back in. My only clue is that two of them were marked with a white dot. Maybe those are #1 and #3?

Yes, injector order does matter. I don't know how one would figure out how to put them in not knowing what order they were removed in. I marked mine so I could put them back. I didn't hear the compression thing mentioned, it sounded like it was cranking like mine, there's a hiccup right when the smoke happens and then the engine catches. Determining injector order would be a good next step, but again, I don't know what that procedure is, but, I didn't hear any terrible metal to metal interactions, so I would lean toward an injection issue. Is your exhaust manifold bolted to the engine block, or is that off from the headgasket repair?

Yes, the exhaust manifold and turbo are both installed.

The only thing I know to do about the injectors is to try different configurations. Since two of them are marked with the same white dot I can try assuming that they are for cylinders 1 & 3 and see if that makes any difference.

Any other suggestions anyone?

jws84_02 · **Posted:** Thu Sep 07, 2017 5:16 pm

krautastic wrote:

sbarne3 wrote:

Thanks for uploading the video... Yours is exactly what I would expect to hear, but mine definitely doesn't sound that way.

Previous owner hired someone to replace the head gasket (water in oil) and then the guy he hired got arrested mid way through the job. After about a year he gave up on it and sold it to me.

One thought I had is does the order of the injectors matter? I read in the SM that each one has a unique calibration code that has to be entered into the computer? Since they were already removed, I had no way of knowing what order to put them back in. My only clue is that two of them were marked with a white dot. Maybe those are #1 and #3?

Yes, injector order does matter. I don't know how one would figure out how to put them in not knowing what order they were removed in. I marked mine so I could put them back. I didn't hear the compression thing mentioned, it sounded like it was cranking like mine, there's a hiccup right when the smoke happens and then the engine catches. Determining injector order would be a good next step, but again, I don't know what that procedure is, but, I didn't hear any terrible metal to metal interactions, so I would lean toward an injection issue. Is your exhaust manifold bolted to the engine block, or is that off from the headgasket repair?

If you look on each injector there is a 6 digit number. Also look on the timing cover, there should be a sticker that has a 24 digit number. Each 6 digit number goes in order to the 24 digit number. So the first 6 number is injector 1, next 6 is injector 2, etc.

I just watched the video again as I was kinda in a hurry this morning. It does seem that you may have knocked a rocker off. By chance, did you rotate each cam separately once you put the valve cover back on to check to see if you could feel/hear a difference?

sbarne3 · **Joined:** Tue Jul 25, 2017 9:33 pm **Posts:** 82

jws84_02 wrote:

If you look on each injector there is a 6 digit number. Also look on the timing cover, there should be a sticker that has a 24 digit number. Each 6 digit number goes in order to the 24 digit number. So the first 6 number is injector 1, next 6 is injector 2, etc.

This is great to know... thanks! While I was waiting for a reply I tried switching a couple of them around and it actually ran worse. Based on your information I had them in the correct order in the first place. Not sure how I did that since I didn't know what I was doing.. lol

jws84_02 wrote:

I just watched the video again as I was kinda in a hurry this morning. It does seem that you may have knocked a rocker off. By chance, did you rotate each cam separately once you put the valve cover back on to check to see if you could feel/hear a difference?

Yes I did, and they both had four evenly spaced "spring intervals" (not sure what that's called).

As for the smoke it appears to be coming from right behind the turbo where it connects to the exhaust pipe. So maybe I didn't get it seated properly before I tightened up the clamp? Could that also be the clanging noise I am hearing?

GordnadoCRD · **Posted:** Thu Sep 07, 2017 6:21 pm

It runs like a gasser with the spark pllug wires hooked up the wrong firing order.

On a diesel the thing that could cause that is the injector clips are wrong.

Make sure the #1 connector comes from the branched off loom that goes to the front passenger side and includes the coolant temp, and MAF sensors.
The next 2 are obvious coming from the main ventral loom. #4 could be confused with one of the rear sensor wires. Make sure the one going to #4 injector is the wire that comes out alone. The sensor plugs come out paired.

sbarne3 · **Joined:** Tue Jul 25, 2017 9:33 pm **Posts:** 82

GordnadoCRD wrote:

It runs like a gasser with the spark pllug wires hooked up the wrong firing order.

On a diesel the thing that could cause that is the injector clips are wrong.

Make sure the #1 connector comes from the branched off loom that goes to the front passenger side and includes the coolant temp, and MAF sensors.
The next 2 are obvious coming from the main ventral loom. #4 could be confused with one of the rear sensor wires. Make sure the one going to #4 injector is the wire that comes out alone. The sensor plugs come out paired.

Thanks... I double-checked the connectors per your description and it all looks right.

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GordnadoCRD · **Posted:** Fri Sep 08, 2017 12:55 pm

sbarne3 wrote:

Could that also be the clanging noise I am hearing?

If you are referring to the "clank" / "knock" noise it makes just as it is shut down, no that's definitely not the exhaust. I don't know exactly what it is, but there is nothing good making a noise like that
(28 seconds in)

rankom · **Posted:** Fri Sep 08, 2017 5:48 pm

when vehicle is parked a long time with old fuel in it , common rail injectors not like it , did you test them before you reassembled the engine , very important step ? if NO then there is some test can be done , one that i like as old 310 T tech we did pulled turbo and exhaust manifold , cap oil supply line and watch for smoke ,for you its better to take them to BOSCH for testing.

sbarne3 · **Joined:** Tue Jul 25, 2017 9:33 pm **Posts:** 82

Still poking away at this. I retimed it from scratch (ended up stripping out the tensioner bolt hole... that was fun to fix) and made sure that the injectors are in the correct order per the sticker on the front timing belt cover.

Now it will only start momentarily, release a ton of smoke and then die again.

Here's a question... after bleeding the fuel line of air, I pump it a few times until the pump handle will only go down about half-way (per the instructions) and then wait a minute or two and the pump handle has become soft and easy to pump again... Is this normal or should it stay hard to pump?

flash7210 · **Posted:** Tue Sep 26, 2017 9:44 pm

The hand pump should remain firm until you start the engine.

sbarne3 · **Joined:** Tue Jul 25, 2017 9:33 pm **Posts:** 82

flash7210 wrote:

The hand pump should remain firm until you start the engine.

So does that mean I have a leak somewhere? I don't see any puddles on the ground

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GordnadoCRD · **Posted:** Tue Sep 26, 2017 11:30 pm

The leak could be internal. Possibly the check valve that is designed to prevent the bled pressurized diesel on the CP3 side, from backing through to the inlet side of the plunger pump.

First start in over a year. Doesn't sound right?

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