Just bought a CRD KJ Limited, bulletproofing advice needed

GordnadoCRD · **Posted:** Sat Oct 21, 2017 9:49 pm

If you think the bottom part doesn't do anthing, put the bottom part in alone and start the engine. (Really don't, take my word for it) Even at idle, the GM fan sucks so much air that it literally sucked the unsupported sides into the fan.

One other tip, when you separate the top from the bottom, cut the sides 'just under' the side mounting bosses. I cut mine a little below, and it was too low. The cut is just adjacent to the radiator outlet, so reaching in to guide the halves together is impossible. I have to fit these before putting the bottom all the way down on mine. Bit of a pain, but avoidable if you know about that in advance.

CRD Joe · **Posted:** Sun Oct 22, 2017 9:13 pm

I bought my first CRD from an enthusiast who took care of it and new what he was doing. I bought it with 40,000 miles and Im at 125,000 and Ive NEVER had any problems. Ive gotten 40+MPG twice on road trips. My second CRD came from a friend who owned for years. It had the same mechanical reputation and mine when it was in an accident and totaled. I bought it from the insurance company for 1100,00. So, both of my CRD's have a great mechanical reputation.
Im not sure I would buy one without that background knowledge. They can penny pinch you to death.

casm · **Joined:** Sun Jan 29, 2006 5:05 pm **Posts:** 694

GordnadoCRD wrote:

If you think the bottom part doesn't do anthing, put the bottom part in alone and start the engine. (Really don't, take my word for it) Even at idle, the GM fan sucks so much air that it literally sucked the unsupported sides into the fan.

Yeah, I'm not huge on removing material from fan shrouds. Modifying them to be more easily-removeable, sure, but there're a couple of good reasons in my book as to why they're made the way that they are.

Quote:

One other tip, when you separate the top from the bottom, cut the sides 'just under' the side mounting bosses. I cut mine a little below, and it was too low. The cut is just adjacent to the radiator outlet, so reaching in to guide the halves together is impossible. I have to fit these before putting the bottom all the way down on mine. Bit of a pain, but avoidable if you know about that in advance.

Funnily enough, someone who was in there before me had already done a modification of their own to the shroud - they cracked the plastic at the very bottom straight through. This allows the shroud to flex open enough when you bring it upwards that it can clear the fan clutch and water pump pulley / shaft with a little wiggling. Underneath the bottom of the shroud (and I don't know if this was their addition or part of the factory design) there's a crescent-shaped piece of thick plastic attached to the underside of the shroud with Christmas tree fasteners providing reinforcement for the assembly when it's in place. Seems to work, so I'm running with it.

Just wish I'd noticed it before everything got hung up in just the right way to be able to see it while I was trying to extract the fan & clutch assembly - would've saved me 20 minutes of swearing

casm · **Joined:** Sun Jan 29, 2006 5:05 pm **Posts:** 694

CRD Joe wrote:

I bought my first CRD from an enthusiast who took care of it and new what he was doing. I bought it with 40,000 miles and Im at 125,000 and Ive NEVER had any problems. Ive gotten 40+MPG twice on road trips. My second CRD came from a friend who owned for years. It had the same mechanical reputation and mine when it was in an accident and totaled. I bought it from the insurance company for 1100,00. So, both of my CRD's have a great mechanical reputation.
Im not sure I would buy one without that background knowledge. They can penny pinch you to death.

Totally understood. FWIW, I researched the daylights out of these things before deciding to take the plunge - forewarned is forearmed, especially when you're buying a vehicle that was something of a unicorn to begin with. Avoiding the nickel-and-dime syndrome with this one as much as possible is key, so the early goals are to get as many of the known problem areas out of the way as possible up front. Part of this involved buying one that was super-clean and with a solid service history, especially where the timing belt, tensioners, and water pump were involved.

Today's tasks are going to be cleaning the MAP sensor (a routine I remember well from the 4.0 XJ days) and filling in a few blanks on things I haven't checked yet. Oh, and running it through the wash to get the road trip insect collection off of it

mass-hole · **Posted:** Mon Oct 23, 2017 7:59 pm

WWDiesel wrote:

taroo wrote:

We can start a new thread on this but want to know how much #9 and #10 increase the noise? I little is good but a lot is not.
9. *Remove CAT & choke point and put in straight piece of pipe (improves exhaust gas flow, lowers backpressure on turbo and improves turbo spool up response time)
10. *Replace muffler with straight through performance muffler (same improvements as item #9

My CAT is gone (2.5" straight pipe) with a Flowmaster muffler and stock tailpipe still in service. Sound level is very low, a real nice mellow tone that can only be heard by either standing behind the Jeep or having the windows rolled down a very low speeds. Cannot be even heard at speed with windows up and AC on! No drone whatsoever! :wink:

'
To me, it did seem to improve turbo spool up time by not having any back pressure on exhaust system. May have helped fuel milage just a tad?
And I know lowering back pressure does lower EGT's as I installed a 5" turbo back exhaust on my Dodge Cummins and it has a EGT gauge. :BANANA:

Never got around to installing a EGT gauge on the Jeep as I did not see a big need for it and had other things on my list I wanted done first. May get around to it one day. :roll:

My is 100% straight(no muffler) and its not even that bad. If you really get into it, it does roar a bit, but just cruising around its totally fine.

mass-hole · **Posted:** Mon Oct 23, 2017 8:02 pm

casm wrote:

flash7210 wrote:

Excellent. Sounds like you are off to a good start.
You may want to verify the function of the electric fan in the grille. Even without a engine driven fan, the electric fan should kick on and keep things cool as long as you are not towing.
Turning the AC on should kick on the electric fan. With AC off it should turn on at about 205F.

Yep, the A/C fan is verified working and keeps up just fine on flats or declines, but long and/or steep uphills make using A/C on them a no-go for the moment. The A/C is definitely exacerbating the issue, but isn't causing it directly - engine temperature will still rise on inclines with the A/C off. The mechanical fan can also be spun by hand with the engine off at full temperature, so it's confirmed shot.

Quote:

But of course, having the AC on only adds more heat.

The additional drag on the engine certainly doesn't help, that's for sure.

Either way, Amazon by way of the USPS dropped this off a little while ago. Pretty sure I know what I'm doing tomorrow (weather permitting).

Be careful with the hayden fan clutch. I would verify it works because a number of us have bought them and found out they were either not working from the get go or failed quickly. I was chasing down an overheat issue on my Jeep and the first thing I did was change the clutch to no avail. After going through everything else in the system(flushing fluid, new tstat, new water pump, pulled the radiator end tanks to make sure they were not plugged, etc) I realized that the NEW Hayden clutch was not working either. As soon as I switched to the fixed flex-fan mod(no clutch, just a flex fan attached straight to the pulley) my issues went away.

And you are right, the A/C fan wont keep the engine cool if you are pulling hills. Mine would never stay cool here in the mountains without the mechanical fan. I actually dont even have the a/c fan anymore because the flex fan draws enough air even at idle that it doenst need to be there. I honestly think its a restriction at highway speed.

WWDiesel · **Posted:** Mon Oct 23, 2017 8:53 pm

Going to the GM V8 van setup may be a better option! :juggle:

see this thread:?> viewtopic.php?f=5&t=82941
Those that have done it, including myself, say it moves a lot more air! :wink:

casm · **Joined:** Sun Jan 29, 2006 5:05 pm **Posts:** 694

mass-hole wrote:

Be careful with the hayden fan clutch. I would verify it works because a number of us have bought them and found out they were either not working from the get go or failed quickly. I was chasing down an overheat issue on my Jeep and the first thing I did was change the clutch to no avail. After going through everything else in the system(flushing fluid, new tstat, new water pump, pulled the radiator end tanks to make sure they were not plugged, etc) I realized that the NEW Hayden clutch was not working either.

Yep, I ran across a number of the same comments regarding the Hayden fan in researching what to do. In the end, I decided to risk it: in terms of what I could obtain relatively quickly, it was more or less the only choice that didn't come from Autozone / O'Reilly's, both of whom were overpriced for the same part and would have taken longer to get it here than Amazon. Granted, if this one grenades I'm out of luck for a convenient return, but if one from either of the retailers grenaded they'd just have to order the replacement out of national stock again, so it's pretty much six of one, half-dozen of the other.

One note: we're very much living in the flatlands right now, and temperatures aren't going above 75degF in the daytime. That number's only going to get lower over the next couple of weeks, so my ability to measure the fan's efficiency is kinda low right now. That said, I have verified that the fan clutch is locking up once the engine's at temperature, so at least the unit I received wasn't DOA. Longevity's another question, but that one will show itself when it shows itself.

Quote:

As soon as I switched to the fixed flex-fan mod (no clutch, just a flex fan attached straight to the pulley) my issues went away.

This one is filed away as a future mod for when the Hayden goes South. While I don't see a problem with doing it, my gut feeling was that while I'm cutting my teeth on the KJ I may as well get a feel for it stock so that I can better measure how a modification behaves down the road - hence installing the Hayden.

Quote:

And you are right, the A/C fan wont keep the engine cool if you are pulling hills. Mine would never stay cool here in the mountains without the mechanical fan. I actually dont even have the a/c fan anymore because the flex fan draws enough air even at idle that it doenst need to be there. I honestly think its a restriction at highway speed.

Interesting. I'm keeping that in mind for when I have to revisit this (which hopefully won't be too terribly soon).

casm · **Joined:** Sun Jan 29, 2006 5:05 pm **Posts:** 694

WWDiesel wrote:

Going to the GM V8 van setup may be a better option! :juggle:

see this thread:?> viewtopic.php?f=5&t=82941
Those that have done it, including myself, say it moves a lot more air! :wink:

That one's also in the 'for consideration' pile for when the Hayden eventually dies

casm · **Joined:** Sun Jan 29, 2006 5:05 pm **Posts:** 694

Air filter looked both clean and recent, so am leaving it as-is for now. The MAP sensor was a caked-up mess (which fortunately cleaned up nicely), but I sense the word 'Provent' becoming relevant to my interests.

Finally remembered to check the fuel filter head; driver's side plug is blue, so am working on the assumption that it's a) the revised design and b) one less thing to have to take care of

taroo · **Joined:** Sun Apr 27, 2008 2:14 pm **Posts:** 271

casm wrote:

Air filter looked both clean and recent, so am leaving it as-is for now. The MAP sensor was a caked-up mess (which fortunately cleaned up nicely), but I sense the word 'Provent' becoming relevant to my interests.

Finally remembered to check the fuel filter head; driver's side plug is blue, so am working on the assumption that it's a) the revised design and b) one less thing to have to take care of

Highly recommend the Provent air/fuel separator. Will keep your turbo from getting gunked up. I am not sure how often you need to change, if at all, the Provent filter. I have had mine in for years and seems to still be dripping oil out the check valve onto my catch pan in the garage. If anyone here knows if it should be changed please chime it. Otherwise I will assume it is good indefinitely

Let me add, I also have a 2 micron bypass oil filter that is picked off of at the main oil filter. Additionally I have the WVDiesel design for a 2 micron secondary fuel filter. I am under the belief that these engines need to run clean for peak performance and longevity.

WWDiesel · **Posted:** Tue Oct 24, 2017 2:11 pm

casm wrote:

Air filter looked both clean and recent, so am leaving it as-is for now. The MAP sensor was a caked-up mess (which fortunately cleaned up nicely), but I sense the word 'Provent' becoming relevant to my interests.
Finally remembered to check the fuel filter head; driver's side plug is blue, so am working on the assumption that it's a) the revised design and b) one less thing to have to take care of

If you want to replace the MAP sensor, get a GM PN 55206797
They can be bought for ~20 bucks online and works perfect with our Jeep CRD's!

Adding a ProVent filter will not solve the caking up mess by itself!
But be sure and either blank off the EGR system or get rid of it totally by installing the Weeks Elbow Kit!
Once you do this and add a ProVent filter, your MAP sensor will stay clean along with all the rest of the inside parts that the oil and soot are contaminating and gunking up! :wink:

casm · **Joined:** Sun Jan 29, 2006 5:05 pm **Posts:** 694

taroo wrote:

Highly recommend the Provent air/fuel separator. Will keep your turbo from getting gunked up. I am not sure how often you need to change, if at all, the Provent filter. I have had mine in for years and seems to still be dripping oil out the check valve onto my catch pan in the garage.

Out of curiosity, has anyone rigged one of these up to just return the trapped oil to the crankcase? My concern has less to do with oil loss and more to do with being able to be lazy and not having to drain it at oil changes

Quote:

Let me add, I also have a 2 micron bypass oil filter that is picked off of at the main oil filter. Additionally I have the WVDiesel design for a 2 micron secondary fuel filter. I am under the belief that these engines need to run clean for peak performance and longevity.

Concur, and both of those are on the 'later mods' list. I'm honestly amazed at how much crud the intake / exhaust / fuel designs allow into places it should never go in the first place.

casm · **Joined:** Sun Jan 29, 2006 5:05 pm **Posts:** 694

WWDiesel wrote:

If you want to replace the MAP sensor, get a GM PN 55206797
They can be bought for ~20 bucks online and works perfect with our Jeep CRD's!

Good to know. After the Provent, etc. are installed, I'll likely replace the MAP sensor just to know that it was done.

Quote:

Adding a ProVent filter will not solve the caking up mess by itself!
But be sure and either blank off the EGR system or get rid of it totally by installing the Weeks Elbow Kit!
Once you do this and add a ProVent filter, your MAP sensor will stay clean along with all the rest of the inside parts that the oil and soot are contaminating and gunking up! :wink:

Totally understood and agreed. From the standpoint of what can be accomplished in stages with the time and funds available, though, at least getting the Provent in along with an EGR disable tune will help until the Weeks kit or similar can be fitted.

WWDiesel · **Posted:** Tue Oct 24, 2017 10:57 pm

casm wrote:

Totally understood and agreed. From the standpoint of what can be accomplished in stages with the time and funds available, though, at least getting the Provent in along with an EGR disable tune will help until the Weeks kit or similar can be fitted.

Until then, you can totally disable the EGR soot from entering your engine by blocking off the EGR feed tube where it bolts up to the EGR valve with a simple block off plate that can be made out of the top of a soup can or some other piece of similar thin metal.
Takes about 15 to 20 minutes to install the block off plate and it ensures no leakage in either direction! :wink:

These are the dimensions:

casm · **Joined:** Sun Jan 29, 2006 5:05 pm **Posts:** 694

WWDiesel wrote:

casm wrote:

Totally understood and agreed. From the standpoint of what can be accomplished in stages with the time and funds available, though, at least getting the Provent in along with an EGR disable tune will help until the Weeks kit or similar can be fitted.

Until then, you can totally disable the EGR soot from entering your engine by blocking off the EGR feed tube where it bolts up to the EGR valve with a simple block off plate that can be made out of the top of a soup can or some other piece of similar thin metal.
Takes about 15 to 20 minutes to install the block off plate and it ensures no leakage in either direction! :wink:

These are the dimensions:

Ooooh... That's nice. Thank you for that.

What would you recommend for material thickness? 1mm, 1.5mm? I know that a soup can lid isn't even close to that, but I have access to both a laser cutter and CNC tables that I've been wanting to learn to use and think this could make for a pretty good first project.

WWDiesel · **Posted:** Wed Oct 25, 2017 11:49 am

casm wrote:

WWDiesel wrote:

casm wrote:

Totally understood and agreed. From the standpoint of what can be accomplished in stages with the time and funds available, though, at least getting the Provent in along with an EGR disable tune will help until the Weeks kit or similar can be fitted.

Until then, you can totally disable the EGR soot from entering your engine by blocking off the EGR feed tube where it bolts up to the EGR valve with a simple block off plate that can be made out of the top of a soup can or some other piece of similar thin metal.
Takes about 15 to 20 minutes to install the block off plate and it ensures no leakage in either direction! :wink:

These are the dimensions:

Ooooh... That's nice. Thank you for that.
What would you recommend for material thickness? 1mm, 1.5mm? I know that a soup can lid isn't even close to that, but I have access to both a laser cutter and CNC tables that I've been wanting to learn to use and think this could make for a pretty good first project.

1mm to 1.5mm should work just fine, you don't need anything real thick! Not much room for a thick plate anyway. Blockoff plate must be sandwiched in between the two flanges.
Any flat metal plate material in the 14 (1.8mm) to 19 (1.0mm) gauge thickness range should work just fine for a block off plate... :wink:

casm · **Joined:** Sun Jan 29, 2006 5:05 pm **Posts:** 694

WWDiesel wrote:

1mm to 1.5mm should work just fine, you don't need anything real thick! Not much room for a thick plate anyway. Blockoff plate must be sandwiched in between the two flanges.
Any flat metal plate material in the 14 (1.8mm) to 19 (1.0mm) gauge thickness range should work just fine for a block off plate... :wink:

Perfect! The tools that I have access to will definitely cut those thicknesses without any trouble, so this would be a good time for me to start figuring out what CAD software to use

casm · **Joined:** Sun Jan 29, 2006 5:05 pm **Posts:** 694

Replaced the rotted Goodyear Wrangler STs today at 110,600 miles in favour of Goodyear TrailRunner ATs, also in the stock 225/75R16 size. Never ran them before, but decided to take the plunge based on reviews: they seemed like a good price/performance balance between what was too much of a road-biased tyre (see: the Wrangler STs) and the BFG T/A KOs I used to run on the XJs.

They're decently quiet on-road for something with a reasonably aggressive tread and side lug. Handling and steering are improved (no surprise given the state of the previous tyres); braking is about the same. Been dry the last few days so no idea as to performance in the wet, and we're at least a couple of months out from having any snow but reviewers seemed to like them in it.

I'll see if I can't find some dirt to try them out on in the next couple of weeks in order to at least give some impressions there, but first-glance experiences are at least favourable.

Just bought a CRD KJ Limited, bulletproofing advice needed

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