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 Post subject: Serpentine Belt Alternative Lengths
PostPosted: Fri Jan 05, 2018 2:38 pm 
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Joined: Sat Apr 11, 2015 12:31 pm
Posts: 274
Location: North America
This thread is intended to provide the lengths, and where possible PN's (Part Numbers), for installing non-stock serpentine belt lengths in modified routings. Contributors are encouraged to clearly specify how they altered their accessory routings, including whether they are using OEM-diameter (=2.75"/70mm) pulley(s) for the 2 idlers and/or tensioner pulley (other custom location?).
It is assumed that the stock harmonic balancer (crankshaft) is driving your belt. Please specify if you have somehow modified your harmonic-balancer setup.
SUGGESTED ABBREVIATIONS FOR SERP-DRIVEN COMPONENTS:
(In order of belt rotation)
HB= Harmonic Balancer (Crankshaft)
TP= Tensioner Pulley.
PS= Power Steering pump
VH= Viscous Heater
IPA= Idler Pulley "A"
ALT= Alternator
IPB= Idler Pulley "B"
AC= Air Conditioning Pump
MF= Mechanical Fan
------------------------------------------------------

STOCK (OEM) SERPENTINE BELT
(ALL climates, hi-load):
LENGTH: 113"/2870mm
NAPA PN(Part Number): 25-061130.
(feel free to provide other parts suppliers' & their PN's).

ALL JEEP LIBERTY CRD SERPENTINE BELTS ARE 6-RIB "V" STYLE; WIDTH= .80"/20.5MM
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
THE FOLLOWING ALTERNATIVES TO A COMPLETELY-STOCK SERPENTINE BELT-DRIVEN SETUP ARE CONSIDERED TO:
- Increase HP
- Increase MPG
- Reduce load on engine
- Reduce component wear through seasonal modification.

----------------------------------------------------------------
A. NO VISCOUS HEATER (40f-HOT climate, hi-load setup):

BELT LENGTH= 101.5"/2578mm. Duralast PN 1015K6*
**IPA= 3.54"/90mm, Ribbed/Flanged. Duralast PN 131082**
IPB= STOCK (2.75")
PIC-LINK:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/i5vh4ppwdlqzp ... 2.jpg?dl=0
Note serp-clearance @ TP (3/8") & @ IPA-MF(5/16").
**UPDATE: This opposite-routing around IPA may be susceptible to loosening from rotational-force. Use blue threadlocker and regularly inspect mounting-bolt tightness.**

---------------------------------------------------------------
B. NO AC (COLD-80f climate, hi-load setup):

--------------------------------------------------------------
C. NO AC/VISCOUS HEATER (40-80f climate, hi-load setup):

BELT LENGTH*= 89"/2260mm. Duralast PN 890K6.
IPA= DuralastPN 131082: 3.54"/90mm, Ribbed/Flanged
IPB= Duralast PN 62176: 3"/76mm Ribbed/Flanged
* Updated from 89.5"/PN 895K6; PS was slipping @low RPMs
-----------------------------------------------------------------
D. NO MECHANICAL FAN (COLD-HOT climate, LOW-load):

----------------------------------------------------------------
E. NO AC/MECHANICAL FAN (COLD climate, LOW-load setup):

BELT LENGTH= 88.2"/2240mm. Duralast PN 882K6.
IPA/IPB Stock (2.75"/70mm).
----------------------------------------------------------------
F. NO VISCOUS HEATER/AC/MECHANICAL FAN (40-80f Climate, LOW-load):

BELT LENGTH= 76.3"/1938mm, Duralast PN 763K6
IPA= Duralast PN 131082: 3.54"/90mm, Ribbed/Flanged
IPB= Deleted.
PIC LINK: Tensioner-clearance is circled;
https://www.dropbox.com/s/ti8g0gxnnmmiu ... 2.jpg?dl=0

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
ALL SCENARIOS OF "NO MECHANICAL FAN" PRESUME INSTALLATION OF AN ELECTRICAL-FAN COOLING ALTERNATIVE!

KEEP IN MIND THAT RESULTS MAY VARY. There is every chance that you may have to substitute the next shorter/longer belt for your specific modified setup (keep your receipts for exchange!).

My Two Cents (which I'll update as my grasp & setup improves):

UPDATE: This entire experiment has been kinda' ridiculous.
My goal of a VH/AC/MF delete has hit some snags:
- MAINLY, WITH THE SERP THREADING OVER INSTEAD OF UNDER THE 3.54" OVERSIZED IPA IT MAY BE SUSCEPTIBLE TO UNSCREWING ITSELF! Although I used blue-threadlocker on the IPA's reverse-threaded mounting bolt, with the rotational-force reversed from stock it may have been coaxed slightly loose. I'm evaluating further after re "blue-locking" the bolt.
UPDATE: after 2nd effort, it's fairly certain that even with blue thread-locker the combination of rotational-force & vibration cause the IPA mounting-bolt to slowly loosen. Custom replacement with 'normal' threads in-process.
- My local MX machine shop wants $75 (1400pesos) to fabricate two separate plates to effectively replace the single OEM MF-bracket. "Two" because it is a LOT easier to fabricate 2X something which requires orienting only two mounting holes vs. 1x replicating the layout of the OEM bracket's four mounting-holes. That quote includes providing a threaded-sleeve on each plate for mounting a serp-pulley; for the IPA on one plate & on the other plate for a pulley-sleeve located in place of the MF shaft. The IPA would be standard-threaded, removing concern of it unscrewing itself through rotational force; the MF substitute-pulley would have a reverse-threaded sleeve for the same reason.
All sleeves would be gussetted for rigidity & strength.
Anyhoo, that setup would replace the heavy, protruding MF hub with a low-profile, low-drag idler-pulley. Tempting.

"C" Serp-Routing, excluding AC/VH (but including PS/ALT/MF).
ALL REPLACEMENT PN's ABOVE.
Route threads HB-TP-PS-IPA-ALT-IPB-MF-HB.
Substitutes a necessarily larger IPA in order to clear the TP when threaded PS-IPA-ALT. Serp threads OVER the larger IPA, and threads OUTSIDE of IPB (opposite of stock routing around both idlers):
UPDATE: This opposite-routing around IPA & IPB may be susceptible to loosening from rotational-force. Use caution and regularly inspect mounting-bolts' tightness.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/ru4kaeeogfqoa ... 7.jpg?dl=0
Circled in Pic: Ribbed, large IPA; subsequent space created between TP & PS-IPA belt-run; resulting space between IPA & MF tight, but adequate. UPDATE: after deciding on 895K6 belt, the belt fits closer to the TP than in the pic, but is still acceptable (longer belt= more relaxed tensioner).

https://www.dropbox.com/s/h5rpod13b9rfo ... 2.jpg?dl=0
Pic shows 6 bearings sacrificed to learning curve & the many pulleys subjected to experimentation (ignore bearing box). Labels inserted in pic show autozone PN's for the 'victorious' bearings (w/metal seals) & the v-ribbed pulleys substituted for the stock IPA&IPB.
(Note: Incorrect 7-rib pulley corrected to 6-rib Duralast PN 62176 for IPB. Apologies if anybody purchased PN for 7-rib in past 2 days).

"E" Serp-routing, excluding AC/MF (but incl. PS/VH/ALT):
BELT LENGTH= 2240mm/88.2", Duralast PN 882K6.
Stock-diameter TP & IPA pulleys; routing eliminates IPB, running directly between the ALT-HB; rest of routing threads stock between HB-TP-PS-VH-IPA-ALT-HB.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------

CONCLUSIONS RE SERP-BELT TENSION/DEFLECTION:
UPDATED- AGAIN: Let's presume that the OEM tensioner load is ideal. The stock tension is no more than 45-degrees shy of MAX tension. With your alternative setup serp installed, place the handle of your socket-drive or ratcheting-wrench so that it is sticking straight-up at "12:00", then when you torque the tensioner clockwise your tool should not exceed "1:30" to max the tensioner. It should take a noticeable amount of effort to torque the tensioner to its full-throw, maybe 60#.

When sizing alternative-setup serp-lengths your 'canary in a coal-mine' is "heavy steering" when your jeep is WARM AND AT IDLE. As long as you have "normal" power-steering at all rpm's the serp isn't too loose. Other opinions welcome.

Keywords: accessory belt specification, accessory-belt, serp belt specs, serp-belt, serpentine-belt, viscous-heater removal


Last edited by Gypsy62 on Wed Jan 31, 2018 9:01 pm, edited 52 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Serpentine Belt Alternative Lengths
PostPosted: Fri Jan 05, 2018 3:02 pm 
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Joined: Sat Aug 24, 2013 11:36 pm
Posts: 3575
Location: Central GA
Two pulleys I have on file for consideration depending on location and need, grooved or non-grooved! Others may have some different proven PN's

Non-grooved for back side of belt
Gates 36141
Material: Steel
Pulley Inside Diameter (mm): 17mm
Pulley Outside Diameter (mm): 76mm (2.99 in)
Pulley Type: Serpentine
Number Of Pulley Grooves: 0

Grooved for grooved side of belt
Gates 36157
Material: Steel
Pulley Inside Diameter (mm): 17mm
Pulley Outside Diameter (mm): 87mm (3.42 in)
Number Of Pulley Grooves: 6
Contact Surface: V-Ribbed Grooved

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 Post subject: Re: Serpentine Belt Alternative Lengths
PostPosted: Fri Jan 12, 2018 10:42 pm 
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Joined: Sat Apr 11, 2015 12:31 pm
Posts: 274
Location: North America
It would be helpful, I think, if folks listed their 'delete-pulley-belt' setups as briefly and concisely as possible. After, they can elaborate on their setup.
Ex:

" My AC/MF delete:
Pulleys,
IPA= NAPA PN ______ (flanged, ribbed 3.5");
IPB= OEM;
SERP BELT= AZONE PN _________ (118")" .
Threading= 'HB-TP-PS-VH-IPA-ALT-IPB-HB'."

"I wanted a setup that suits my home in the tundra..."

It is as easy as herding cats to achieve consensus on delete-routing component-combinations. Sometimes the determining factors for PN's are preferred or accessible store brands.
At least standardizing and simplifying setup-descriptions assists folks to list the parts necessary to achieve their personal objectives.


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