CRD oil report showing very high wear metals

WWDiesel · **Posted:** Mon Jan 29, 2018 2:38 pm

No Flame intended here! Oil discussions always brings out a lot of diverse and spirited opinions, but API oil ratings and viscosities are what is important to look for, brands are secondary!

Only oils with an API rating of CI-4, CJ-4 or CK-4 in the proper viscosities are the correct oils to use in a diesel engine period!
This has been discussed in length several times before on this forum, so from a previous post!

Diesel Engine Oil wrote:

This subject has been discussed in great detail before and resurfaces from time to time as new members come on board!
Take aways: make your own decisions on what is the best oil for your vehicles based on type of driving, temperature conditions vehicle will be exposed to, and most importantly API ratings...
Here is some of the general discussions around this subject.

Mobil 1 0W-40 IS NOT AN API DIESEL RATED OIL!!!!!

See this Web page for API Oil Ratings:> http://www.api.org/products-and-service ... categories

It has NO diesel API ratings! It does not meet or have diesel CJ or CI ratings...

Mobil 1 0W-40 oil is rated: API SN, SM, SL, SJ
(all are GASOLINE engine oil Ratings!)

Mobil 1 Turbo Diesel Oil is rated: API CJ-4, CI-4 PLUS, CI-4, CH-4/ SM, SL, SJ
CJ, CI, & CH are all DIESEL engine oil API ratings!

Why in the world Mopar ever recommended a non API diesel rated spec oil for a turbo-diesel engine w/EGR system is ludicrous!
(No wonder many have had rocker arm/lifter failures!)

But if you need to know, this is the Mopar Specification that superseded it:
Keep in mind, this spec oil was listed for several Mopar GASOLINE engines!
Part No. - 68171066GA
0W-40 MOPAR® ENGINE OIL, synthetic MS-SPEC: MS-12633
Specifically formulated for the needs of Chrysler SRT engines where MS-12633 is required. It may also be used in SRT engines originally recommending Chrysler MS-10725
They no longer list the MS-10725 Spec on their "Mopar International - Lubricant and Chemical Cross Reference Chart"
It is an obsolete Specification!

A little more insight as to why Mobil 1 may not list the MS-10725 specification anymore:
May have been withdrawn due to a clause in their contract?
Apparently M1 0w-40 used to carry that spec in the US in the past, but no longer list it.

[i]From another forum:
I do not believe this was Fiat's doing given that it still meets 3 Fiat specs. It has been mentioned this change took effect during Daimler's ownership.
This is possibly the result of a Non-compete clause that Chrysler placed into Mobil's Factory Fill contract.
Something along the lines of...In return for us extending exclusive use of your product in our vehicles, you agree, after termination of this agreement, to forfeit the marketing and/or approval of this specification, so that it can be exclusively extended to a subsequent party for X amount of years.
:roll:

Use what you wish; I simply would never run or recommend an API non-diesel rated oil in my diesels or anyone else's diesel engine period!
The ratings are engineering developed standards and are rated as such for a reason!

Mobil 1 Turbo Diesel and several others including Rotella T6 all are good diesel oils with the correct API ratings...

We all have opinions and interpretations of all the available information!!!
But I do trust the API Ratings!
To each his own; I simply would never recommend Mobil 1 0W-40 oil to be used in any diesel engine when there are so many better choices of diesel rated oils available for the user.... :roll:

[/i]

geordi · **Posted:** Mon Jan 29, 2018 4:26 pm

Dennis MacGyver wrote:

Delo 400 with the latest & highest wear rating of CK
LOOK FOR THE JUG WITH THE RED CAP !!

https://www.walmart.com/ip/Chevron-Delo ... 3=&veh=sem

Good to know - I will look this up the next time I am in there, I still haven't found out for certain about the Delo that is available in Costco for a very very good case price.

Looking at this link you posted and the image... They aren't just highlighting the API rating, they are virtually screaming it out. I guess they really want you to know it is both a heavy duty diesel oil AND what the API grade is.

GordnadoCRD · **Posted:** Mon Jan 29, 2018 5:31 pm

From the beginning of this year, the one that had the big headlines and sale prices was the blue bottle with the red cap (15w-40). Glad they've followed with this.

BodhiBenz1987 · **Posted:** Mon Jan 29, 2018 6:14 pm

WWDiesel wrote:

No Flame intended here! Oil discussions always brings out a lot of diverse and spirited opinions, but API oil ratings and viscosities are what is important to look for, brands are secondary!

Only oils with an API rating of CI-4, CJ-4 or CK-4 in the proper viscosities are the correct oils to use in a diesel engine period!
This has been discussed in length several times before on this forum, so from a previous post!

Diesel Engine Oil wrote:

This subject has been discussed in great detail before and resurfaces from time to time as new members come on board!
Take aways: make your own decisions on what is the best oil for your vehicles based on type of driving, temperature conditions vehicle will be exposed to, and most importantly API ratings...
Here is some of the general discussions around this subject.

Mobil 1 0W-40 IS NOT AN API DIESEL RATED OIL!!!!!

See this Web page for API Oil Ratings:> http://www.api.org/products-and-service ... categories

It has NO diesel API ratings! It does not meet or have diesel CJ or CI ratings...

Mobil 1 0W-40 oil is rated: API SN, SM, SL, SJ
(all are GASOLINE engine oil Ratings!)

Mobil 1 Turbo Diesel Oil is rated: API CJ-4, CI-4 PLUS, CI-4, CH-4/ SM, SL, SJ
CJ, CI, & CH are all DIESEL engine oil API ratings!

Why in the world Mopar ever recommended a non API diesel rated spec oil for a turbo-diesel engine w/EGR system is ludicrous!
(No wonder many have had rocker arm/lifter failures!)

But if you need to know, this is the Mopar Specification that superseded it:
Keep in mind, this spec oil was listed for several Mopar GASOLINE engines!
Part No. - 68171066GA
0W-40 MOPAR® ENGINE OIL, synthetic MS-SPEC: MS-12633
Specifically formulated for the needs of Chrysler SRT engines where MS-12633 is required. It may also be used in SRT engines originally recommending Chrysler MS-10725
They no longer list the MS-10725 Spec on their "Mopar International - Lubricant and Chemical Cross Reference Chart"
It is an obsolete Specification!

A little more insight as to why Mobil 1 may not list the MS-10725 specification anymore:
May have been withdrawn due to a clause in their contract?
Apparently M1 0w-40 used to carry that spec in the US in the past, but no longer list it.

[i]From another forum:
I do not believe this was Fiat's doing given that it still meets 3 Fiat specs. It has been mentioned this change took effect during Daimler's ownership.
This is possibly the result of a Non-compete clause that Chrysler placed into Mobil's Factory Fill contract.
Something along the lines of...In return for us extending exclusive use of your product in our vehicles, you agree, after termination of this agreement, to forfeit the marketing and/or approval of this specification, so that it can be exclusively extended to a subsequent party for X amount of years.
:roll:

Use what you wish; I simply would never run or recommend an API non-diesel rated oil in my diesels or anyone else's diesel engine period!
The ratings are engineering developed standards and are rated as such for a reason!

Mobil 1 Turbo Diesel and several others including Rotella T6 all are good diesel oils with the correct API ratings...

We all have opinions and interpretations of all the available information!!!
But I do trust the API Ratings!
To each his own; I simply would never recommend Mobil 1 0W-40 oil to be used in any diesel engine when there are so many better choices of diesel rated oils available for the user.... :roll:

[/i]

Thanks for this, helpful to know. Also interesting that the ms10725 spec is gone now. I will see if a switch to a diesel-rated choice improves the wear in my dad's car's engine. Here's a question though, that's hopefully not stupid ... given that I just did an oil change about 100 miles ago, do I have to change the filter? Can I just drain the oil out of it and put it back on?

geordi · **Posted:** Mon Jan 29, 2018 6:55 pm

You should be fine just swapping the liquid.

Save what comes out and you can use it in a gas vehicle since it only has 100 miles on it. It will be pitch black, that is normal. It is still clean.

Crash227 · **Posted:** Sun Feb 11, 2018 7:49 pm

Great to know! I’ve done most of the oil changes on my Jeep since the factory warranty expired. I always bought Mobil 1 turbo diesel oil even though it wasn’t the 0w 40 specified in the manual. It seemed the logical choice. Makes me wonder if all those dealership oil changes during warranty were with the WRONG OIL?

geordi · **Posted:** Sun Feb 11, 2018 8:19 pm

Of course we will never know for certain, and they will insist up and down that they only use what is approved... But service guys also will say that they have techs certified to replace the water pump on your 67 VW Beetle.

The only thing you can trust about dealers is that they don't have a clue about anything spewing from their mouths. Oh, and they will rob you blind.

I wouldn't be surprised at all if what they were putting in any vehicle was a synthetic blend (if any synth at all) but just a gasser rated oil because "hey, oil is oil right? If it is at the dealer it must be good" is exactly what they want you to think. Then when it burns up after 100k miles, you buy another vehicle.

My VW Jetta is about to hit 400k miles. Of course I do all my own maintenance and only put in diesel oil.

WWDiesel · **Posted:** Sun Feb 11, 2018 9:34 pm

Crash227 wrote:

Great to know! I’ve done most of the oil changes on my Jeep since the factory warranty expired. I always bought Mobil 1 turbo diesel oil even though it wasn’t the 0w 40 specified in the manual. It seemed the logical choice. Makes me wonder if all those dealership oil changes during warranty were with the WRONG OIL?

It's highly possible that the wrong oil was used unless you were standing there and watching what was poured into your engine.
The oil changers at a dealership are are only one notch above the cleanup guy and they don't make squat. Ask me how I know!
They will use the cheap bulk oil in everything unless told to do different since it comes out of the line gun from the bulk tank and is easy.

Only way to be sure, do your own oil changes or stand over them and supply your own oil, and even then you better watch em close! :roll:

Working for a dealership service department, you learn a lot of things and not all of them are good.... :shock:

thermorex · **Posted:** Wed Feb 14, 2018 11:31 pm

mass-hole wrote:

BodhiBenz1987 wrote:

geordi wrote:

NOT THE RIGHT OIL.

That is primarily a GAS rated oil, that is the "european car formula" and is only rated CF for diesel which is the absolute minimum rating the CRD should ever have, and certainly not for extended drains. When the CRD was released, the CF standard had already been superseded several times and the current standard at that time was CH. The CF standard dates back to the mid 1990s.
The following are all acceptable options, and can be switched at will based on cost or preference within this list:
Mobil 1 Turbo Diesel Truck 5W-40
Mobil 1 Delvac 1 (Silver bottle) 5W-40
Mobil 1 Delvac ESP (Silver bottle) 5W-40
Mobil 1 Delvac 1300 (black bottle) IS NOT ACCEPTABLE as it is not synthetic.

Shell Rotella T6 (blue bottle) 5W-40
Chevron Delo 400 - IF CH or higher rated and fully synthetic 5W-40 - information on this one is varied.

The oil specified by the manufacturer is not the right oil? I probably shouldn't be surprised given Chrysler's general approach to this car, but I'm not sure why I would assume that. Especially considering I've sent about 20 samples to Blackstone, which is an oil specialist, and never once have they written back that this is not an adequate oil for this usage. I'll switch but it's kind of closing the barn door after the horse is out ... or would a couple of shorter runs with one of the above oils be enough?

Exactly. Its because its Chrysler. They did the same thing with the Ram Ecodiesel. After a bunch of them blew up due to bearing failures they started recommending 5W-40(I think rotella T6 maybe)

Regarding ram EcoDiesel, there is no proof that the factory recommended then pennzoil euro L 5w30 (which is actually a diesel rated oil compared to Mobil 1 0w40 which is a gasoline oil also diesel cf rated) has any connection with bearing failures. It has to do with the corporate deals. On the contrary, there were few folks that posted quite disturbing facts and tests with Rotella T6, related to excessive foaming and engine failure (not EcoDiesel). My own take is that both euro L and t6 are great diesel oils. I use both of them and oil analysis is equally good. T6 with deal price is unbeatable.

Regarding 0W-40 mobil 1, I used it and no issue, but I also have gde Eco tune. I had a bunchof it on stock. Now I use Rotella t6 since is the cheapest good oil.

To the op: definitely changing the oil won't hurt. If you have a bunch of 0W-40 on stock, do an oil change with it, drive 1,000 miles to clean the engine and do another oil change with t6 or mobil 1 tdt, and get a sample at 2,000. Based on that sample, you'll know how much can you go with the oil change.

Oh, and quite important, I'm not sure how you take the sample, but you should let a bit of oil to drain before taking the it, to make sure you don't sample the bottom of the oil that sits on the pan.

thermorex · **Posted:** Wed Feb 14, 2018 11:33 pm

WWDiesel wrote:

Ask me how I know!

How do you know? Lol.

BodhiBenz1987 · **Posted:** Sat Feb 17, 2018 6:08 pm

thermorex wrote:

Regarding 0W-40 mobil 1, I used it and no issue, but I also have gde Eco tune. I had a bunchof it on stock. Now I use Rotella t6 since is the cheapest good oil.

To the op: definitely changing the oil won't hurt. If you have a bunch of 0W-40 on stock, do an oil change with it, drive 1,000 miles to clean the engine and do another oil change with t6 or mobil 1 tdt, and get a sample at 2,000. Based on that sample, you'll know how much can you go with the oil change.

Oh, and quite important, I'm not sure how you take the sample, but you should let a bit of oil to drain before taking the it, to make sure you don't sample the bottom of the oil that sits on the pan.

I have the GDE Eco tune on mine as well, and do relatively short oil runs (3-4K) so that's probably why I've done OK with the 0-W40 as opposed to my dad's which is stock tune and he's gone 6-7K on a run (he just doesn't keep as good track of these things as he used to and it's hard for me to monitor his car's mileage). Regardless I got 4 gallons of Mobil 1 Turbo Diesel Truck and will switch both cars over. My parents just got a new car so he'll drive the CRD a bit less and will be easier for me to monitor in the future. Hopefully the proper oil and shorter runs can get it sorted out.

I did sample the middle phase of the stream for the sample, but good tip nonetheless. The first spurt of oil usually ends up all over my arms and the floor anyway. :lol:

Question for those who recommended the Mobil M1-301 filter: Is there a problem with the OEM filters? Any big advantage to switching or is just a cost/convenience thing? I usually just swing by the dealer and get filters/crush washers, and might still have one on my shelf.

BSquared · **Joined:** Tue Feb 06, 2018 7:17 pm **Posts:** 3

This is a lively and very interesting discussion which I wish to add a very short story to...

While in the local Walmart to get some Rotella T6 for my newly acquired 05 CRD, I paused to look at the Mobil one shelf.
The 0W-40 has only an SN rating on the front of the container and NO indication if it's for gasoline or diesel engines, unlike
the rest of their offerings (which have printed clearly in the lower right of the jug "For Gasoline Engines" )....finding this interesting, a quick inquiry to the Mobil website, inputting 2005 Jeep Liberty CRD comes
back with "Sorry we offer NO OIL for your specified vehicle"....

Regarding the Mobil one filter, as Mr. Weeks pointed out above, it has larger capacity and more filter media surface area than
the OEM.

Cheers,

BB

CRD oil report showing very high wear metals

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