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| New Fan Clutch, is it working? http://www.lostjeeps.com/forum/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=87859 |
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| Author: | Steve777 [ Wed Feb 28, 2018 7:51 pm ] |
| Post subject: | New Fan Clutch, is it working? |
So I had noticed that the cabin temp gauge would shoot up to the 3/4 mark when I was "going home" (10 mile drive up the mtns, 3000' elevation rise). I figured it was the fan clutch, and I tried spinning the fan at the top of my trip and it was about the same resistance to turning as when cold. OK figured it was new fan clutch time. So I just put in a Hayden 2905. At first I was a bit concerned, because the new 2905 spun much freer than the old clutch when cold. But took it for a ride up and down the "hill" and it seems to work, temps coming up the hill rise to just below the 1/2 way mark and stay there where they are supposed to be (although it was 40F outside so not a real hard test). The thing that puzzles me, is again at the top of the trip, with the engine still 1/4 way hot, I stopped the engine and tried spinning the fan by hand. Spins freely just like it did when cold??? I thought with the clutch and engine relatively hot there'd be more resistance. So how should one test a fan clutch? Can you expect to feel the resistance on a stopped engine hot or cold? Or do they require some RPM before they do their clutch thing? Anyway, perhaps I am overthinking this, the new 2905 does seem to fix the overheating at least at cool temps. But I'd sure like to know if I got a working fan clutch or not and how to tell. |
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| Author: | GordnadoCRD [ Wed Feb 28, 2018 8:29 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: New Fan Clutch, is it working? |
A thermal fan clutch works more like a torque converter than a manual clutch. They never lock up 100% solid, but increase the resistance to relative motion. Electrical fan clutches use ECM - PWM to vary the viscosity of the fluid in the clutch, but other than that are pretty much the same. http://www.haydenauto.com/upload/HaydenAuto/Documents/Cat_Hayden/Hayden%20Fan%20Clutch%20Design%20Types.pdf |
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| Author: | joe_ [ Thu Mar 01, 2018 1:05 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: New Fan Clutch, is it working? |
Steve777 wrote: The thing that puzzles me, is again at the top of the trip, with the engine still 1/4 way hot, I stopped the engine and tried spinning the fan by hand. Spins freely just like it did when cold??? I thought with the clutch and engine relatively hot there'd be more resistance. I would wait until the engine is good and hot before trying that. The fan clutch doesn't have any way of knowing where your temperature gauge is pointing, it only reacts to the temperature of the air coming out of the radiator. With your coolant gauge at the 1/4 mark, your thermostat is most likely still closed and therefore hot coolant isn't circulating through the radiator yet.
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| Author: | Mountainman [ Thu Mar 01, 2018 1:44 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: New Fan Clutch, is it working? |
The mech fans for our jeeps come on pretty late, something like 205 or more. By the time you stop and open the hood, even during hot summer weather, I don't think you'll have any luck feel more resistance. The only testing I've seen was in an oven. Those Hayden fans are also famous for being bad out of the box. Read online, and it's easy to find where they are junk new on multiple different applications. No clue why, but I only had to overheat once with a newer Hayden and I went electric. WWdiesel found one made by GM I think. I bet it's a better option, as the Hayden's have a terrible track record. |
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| Author: | GordnadoCRD [ Thu Mar 01, 2018 7:16 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: New Fan Clutch, is it working? |
Hayden 2986 GM 15017911 Better than original No problems with either. |
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| Author: | mass-hole [ Thu Mar 01, 2018 8:05 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: New Fan Clutch, is it working? |
My experience with the Hayden was that it never worked from the second I installed it. Best way to be sure it locks is to put it in the oven. I just wouldn't really trust it as a number of folks around here had theirs fail right away or quickly after installing Also, I thought the Hayden was designed to lock at a lower temp than the stock fan? Sent from my Pixel using Tapatalk |
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| Author: | GordnadoCRD [ Thu Mar 01, 2018 9:11 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: New Fan Clutch, is it working? |
fan clutches dont lock at any temp |
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| Author: | dennyb [ Fri Mar 02, 2018 1:41 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: New Fan Clutch, is it working? |
I bought Hayden last fall. My check is it does the noisey fan howl first thing in the morning for a couple of seconds when cold. Then warms up and is quiet. |
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| Author: | WWDiesel [ Fri Mar 02, 2018 2:25 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: New Fan Clutch, is it working? |
GordnadoCRD wrote: Hayden 2986 GM 15017911 Better than original No problems with either. Please Note: If going to the HD V8 GM fan clutch set up on your Jeep CRD, you must use the *GM 11 blade fan listed below. (OEM Jeep fan blades will not bolt up to the GM fan clutch) NAPA part no.s (fitment: Chevrolet V8 Truck w/HD cooling system) GM Severe Duty Fan Clutch NAPA 271625 Hayden Fan Clutch PN for GM: HY 2986 Four Seasons Fan Clutch for GM: FS46023 (almost identical to GM OEM fan clutch) *GM 11 blade HD Cooling Fan NAPA PN - 8552223 or GM PN - 15976889 |
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| Author: | mass-hole [ Fri Mar 02, 2018 5:09 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: New Fan Clutch, is it working? |
GordnadoCRD wrote: fan clutches dont lock at any temp Well no but close. What word should we use instead?Sent from my Pixel using Tapatalk |
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| Author: | WWDiesel [ Fri Mar 02, 2018 9:48 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: New Fan Clutch, is it working? |
mass-hole wrote: GordnadoCRD wrote: fan clutches dont lock at any temp Well no but close. What word should we use instead?Sent from my Pixel using Tapatalk Gordon is correct, they never FULLY lock up 100%  Notice the percentages and those numbers are for a fully functioning new fan clutch; they degrade from there with time and miles...  
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| Author: | Billybob [ Sat Mar 03, 2018 2:25 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: New Fan Clutch, is it working? |
When I had a BMW E30 the method to test the viscous fan clutch was to take a rolled up newspaper and push it into the turning fan when engine was hot.....if the fan ground to a halt then the clutch was faulty.....if you suddenly had an engine bay full of shredded newspaper then you knew the clutch was OK  I must try this test on my 2002 Export CRD....do not have any overheating problems but she is getting a bit old now and the fan clutch is the original as fitted at the factory. |
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| Author: | GordnadoCRD [ Sat Mar 03, 2018 8:04 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: New Fan Clutch, is it working? |
mass-hole wrote: GordnadoCRD wrote: fan clutches dont lock at any temp Well no but close. What word should we use instead?Sent from my Pixel using Tapatalk I suppose something like engage or activate would be a better term, however the point is, heating them in an oven and testing for lockup isn't going to work. With a fluid coupling, they need to be turning to test them, as they are activated by fluid pathing, similar to a torque converter, only the bimetal spring operates what would function as the stator in a TC. When the fluid is allowed to circulate, resistance is high, causing to fan to draw air. Once it cools enough, the viscous fluid is blocked, releasing the resistance, so the fan free-wheels. I suppose a better way to test it would be to make a way to couple the drive to a drill motor, then measure resistance force of the clutch when you use a heat gun or I suppose a propane torch held at a distance to produce the heat on the bi-metal spring. |
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| Author: | Steve777 [ Mon Mar 05, 2018 9:32 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: New Fan Clutch, is it working? |
Thanks. So it sounds like spinning the fan with my fingers, hot or cold, isn't going to show much. That makes sense. I am guessing for now, since this new clutch does keep the temp gauge from going too high when climbing the mtn home, that it is working. One other point I noticed, the old clutch never released as completely as this new one. Even by hand there was some resistance when dead cold. And with the new clutch the engine also seems to warm up a bit faster than before. I suspect the old one was stuck at some middle setting always partially engaged but never fully. Kept things cooler when it shouldn't have when cold and did not work the fan enough when it needed to on hot. Just a data point for others considering this repair. |
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