Jeep Liberty CRD broken timing belt

GordnadoCRD · **Posted:** Sun May 27, 2018 12:52 am

Jackkep wrote:

GordnadoCRD wrote:

Jackkep wrote:

I can't afford a new head right now and I'm not just going to replace the gasket unless I'm replacing the head so I think I'll wait for that. I do all my wrenching myself and I have quite an extensive collection of tools so I'm not paying shop time for anything. I just don't know anything about this engine. So at this point I'm doing a whole new set of rockers and lifters, new timing pulleys and tensioners, new belt, and probably new glow plugs. Is there anything I'm missing?

1) Water pump. Don't forget the water pump. It is a wear item, and driven by the timing belt. It is critical for timing belt longevity.
Unlike a gasser you can't just change it when it starts leaking. It will have caused the timing belt to fail before that happens.
Recommend getting a timing belt kit from IDParts. It has everything you need.

2) This is only my opinion, but were I in your shoes, If you absolutely cannot afford ARP studs, at very least put in new TTY head bolts. The moving around described above, is kind of a big deal regarding head gasket life, and the TTY bolts lose their elasticity over time.
Since you already have the original head bolts exposed, you would be wise to install a new set in same manner as ARP studs are installed without removing the head. One at a time to full torque procedure in order of factory torque sequence At least then, you will have restored the head bolt elasticity it came with new, and a set of original bolts is a small fraction of ARP studs.

From my understanding the water pump is a 2 part unit and I only need to replace the front portion which does not disturb the seal. Is that true? Yes.
Anything else I should do that the original owner may have neglected that's specific to this engine?

Change all filters and fluids front to back, and use proper spec fluids. Anti-freeze lubricity declines with age. Recommend drain and replace. Use only Mopar or Zerex05.
If your transfer case fluid hasn't been drained and changed it may shock you how dirty it gets. ATF+4 same as in the trans.
Also look to your engine mounts. The right one nearly always fails first. Recommend replacing that one at least. If it has already failed, then change both.
Since you will have it off, check the alternator decoupler pulley. If it's bad it will murder your automatic belt tensioner.
Well over half of the problems / complaints have to do with the CP3 having to pull fuel all the way from the tank in the rear.. If it does not already have a fuel lift pump of some sort, I really strongly recommend it.
If you can't afford a Weeks EGR fix, at least install exhaust blockoff plates, and pull the FCV butterfly plate.

Had I known then what I know now, this is the order I would have addressed Mods on my CRD.

CRD guide, (short version)

Should be mandatory. (for reliability)
1) Lift pump (In Tank is best) Completely and permanently eliminates easily over half the drivability issues, common with this rig.
2) Provent (or similar, as long as it works)
3) Weeks kits (Passes sniffer and opacity tests on healthy engines. Visual too, IMO, depends on how much you flaunt it.)

Recommended (Things that lean towards optimization and a bit of diminishing returns for your dollar, rather than fixing problems that should never have made it to the market.)
1) Good Thermostat, Healthy cooling system, Especially if you are leaning towards power-ups.
2) good thermal protection for sensors, wiring looms, etc edit - also check wiring looms everywhere they go behind something (fuel filter bracket) around something, or through something (behind alternator, above starter, etc) check for worn insulation, bare wires, etc and fix anything you find (pre-emptive strike) Or you could just wait till something happens and hunt it down then.
3) Fuel filter upgrade (< 5 micrometer)
4) ARP Studs (best installed BEFORE head gasket fails)
5) Silicone CAC hoses and T-bolt clamps

Optional (power-ups and Fun-ups Things to do as time and money budget allows, depending on how you intend to use your CRD.)
1) Exhaust (On my list this was actually in highly recommended. Kind of depends on local statutes, or whether one licenses in CA)
2) ECM / TCM Tune
3) Torque converter (kind of goes along with #2) front pump, and any shifting mods desired.
4) Suspension / lift
5) Tires
6) Gearing / diff locks if needed / wanted.

Thanks for your input.

NP.

Jackkep · **Posted:** Sun May 27, 2018 7:59 am

GordnadoCRD wrote:

1) Water pump. Don't forget the water pump. It is a wear item, and driven by the timing belt. It is critical for timing belt longevity.
Unlike a gasser you can't just change it when it starts leaking. It will have caused the timing belt to fail before that happens.
Recommend getting a timing belt kit from IDParts. It has everything you need.

2) This is only my opinion, but were I in your shoes, If you absolutely cannot afford ARP studs, at very least put in new TTY head bolts. The moving around described above, is kind of a big deal regarding head gasket life, and the TTY bolts lose their elasticity over time.
Since you already have the original head bolts exposed, you would be wise to install a new set in same manner as ARP studs are installed without removing the head. One at a time to full torque procedure in order of factory torque sequence At least then, you will have restored the head bolt elasticity it came with new, and a set of original bolts is a small fraction of ARP studs.

From my understanding the water pump is a 2 part unit and I only need to replace the front portion which does not disturb the seal. Is that true? Yes.
Anything else I should do that the original owner may have neglected that's specific to this engine?

Change all filters and fluids front to back, and use proper spec fluids. Anti-freeze lubricity declines with age. Recommend drain and replace. Use only Mopar or Zerex05.
If your transfer case fluid hasn't been drained and changed it may shock you how dirty it gets. ATF+4 same as in the trans.
Also look to your engine mounts. The right one nearly always fails first. Recommend replacing that one at least. If it has already failed, then change both.
Since you will have it off, check the alternator decoupler pulley. If it's bad it will murder your automatic belt tensioner.
Well over half of the problems / complaints have to do with the CP3 having to pull fuel all the way from the tank in the rear.. If it does not already have a fuel lift pump of some sort, I really strongly recommend it.
If you can't afford a Weeks EGR fix, at least install exhaust blockoff plates, and pull the FCV butterfly plate.

Had I known then what I know now, this is the order I would have addressed Mods on my CRD.

CRD guide, (short version)

Should be mandatory. (for reliability)
1) Lift pump (In Tank is best) Completely and permanently eliminates easily over half the drivability issues, common with this rig.
2) Provent (or similar, as long as it works)
3) Weeks kits (Passes sniffer and opacity tests on healthy engines. Visual too, IMO, depends on how much you flaunt it.)

Recommended (Things that lean towards optimization and a bit of diminishing returns for your dollar, rather than fixing problems that should never have made it to the market.)
1) Good Thermostat, Healthy cooling system, Especially if you are leaning towards power-ups.
2) good thermal protection for sensors, wiring looms, etc edit - also check wiring looms everywhere they go behind something (fuel filter bracket) around something, or through something (behind alternator, above starter, etc) check for worn insulation, bare wires, etc and fix anything you find (pre-emptive strike) Or you could just wait till something happens and hunt it down then.
3) Fuel filter upgrade (< 5 micrometer)
4) ARP Studs (best installed BEFORE head gasket fails)
5) Silicone CAC hoses and T-bolt clamps

Optional (power-ups and Fun-ups Things to do as time and money budget allows, depending on how you intend to use your CRD.)
1) Exhaust (On my list this was actually in highly recommended. Kind of depends on local statutes, or whether one licenses in CA)
2) ECM / TCM Tune
3) Torque converter (kind of goes along with #2) front pump, and any shifting mods desired.
4) Suspension / lift
5) Tires
6) Gearing / diff locks if needed / wanted.

Thanks for your input.[/quote] NP.[/quote]

What's "provent" and where can I find a lift pump guide? I live in FL so no emissions testing or vehicle inspection

thermorex · **Posted:** Sun May 27, 2018 8:16 am

Jackkep wrote:

GordnadoCRD wrote:

1) Water pump. Don't forget the water pump. It is a wear item, and driven by the timing belt. It is critical for timing belt longevity.
Unlike a gasser you can't just change it when it starts leaking. It will have caused the timing belt to fail before that happens.
Recommend getting a timing belt kit from IDParts. It has everything you need.

2) This is only my opinion, but were I in your shoes, If you absolutely cannot afford ARP studs, at very least put in new TTY head bolts. The moving around described above, is kind of a big deal regarding head gasket life, and the TTY bolts lose their elasticity over time.
Since you already have the original head bolts exposed, you would be wise to install a new set in same manner as ARP studs are installed without removing the head. One at a time to full torque procedure in order of factory torque sequence At least then, you will have restored the head bolt elasticity it came with new, and a set of original bolts is a small fraction of ARP studs.

From my understanding the water pump is a 2 part unit and I only need to replace the front portion which does not disturb the seal. Is that true? Yes.
Anything else I should do that the original owner may have neglected that's specific to this engine?

Change all filters and fluids front to back, and use proper spec fluids. Anti-freeze lubricity declines with age. Recommend drain and replace. Use only Mopar or Zerex05.
If your transfer case fluid hasn't been drained and changed it may shock you how dirty it gets. ATF+4 same as in the trans.
Also look to your engine mounts. The right one nearly always fails first. Recommend replacing that one at least. If it has already failed, then change both.
Since you will have it off, check the alternator decoupler pulley. If it's bad it will murder your automatic belt tensioner.
Well over half of the problems / complaints have to do with the CP3 having to pull fuel all the way from the tank in the rear.. If it does not already have a fuel lift pump of some sort, I really strongly recommend it.
If you can't afford a Weeks EGR fix, at least install exhaust blockoff plates, and pull the FCV butterfly plate.

Had I known then what I know now, this is the order I would have addressed Mods on my CRD.

CRD guide, (short version)

Should be mandatory. (for reliability)
1) Lift pump (In Tank is best) Completely and permanently eliminates easily over half the drivability issues, common with this rig.
2) Provent (or similar, as long as it works)
3) Weeks kits (Passes sniffer and opacity tests on healthy engines. Visual too, IMO, depends on how much you flaunt it.)

Recommended (Things that lean towards optimization and a bit of diminishing returns for your dollar, rather than fixing problems that should never have made it to the market.)
1) Good Thermostat, Healthy cooling system, Especially if you are leaning towards power-ups.
2) good thermal protection for sensors, wiring looms, etc edit - also check wiring looms everywhere they go behind something (fuel filter bracket) around something, or through something (behind alternator, above starter, etc) check for worn insulation, bare wires, etc and fix anything you find (pre-emptive strike) Or you could just wait till something happens and hunt it down then.
3) Fuel filter upgrade (< 5 micrometer)
4) ARP Studs (best installed BEFORE head gasket fails)
5) Silicone CAC hoses and T-bolt clamps

Optional (power-ups and Fun-ups Things to do as time and money budget allows, depending on how you intend to use your CRD.)
1) Exhaust (On my list this was actually in highly recommended. Kind of depends on local statutes, or whether one licenses in CA)
2) ECM / TCM Tune
3) Torque converter (kind of goes along with #2) front pump, and any shifting mods desired.
4) Suspension / lift
5) Tires
6) Gearing / diff locks if needed / wanted.

Thanks for your input.

NP.[/quote]

What's "provent" and where can I find a lift pump guide? I live in FL so no emissions testing or vehicle inspection[/quote]

The 2-3,000 is coming from the above parts. Rockers plus lifters (all of them), check the cyl head and camshafts, gde tune (I’d advise you to go with it, otherwise get the free one - but you need a tune to make the engine run w/o so much soot, timing parts, coolant flush (I believe it’s recommended every 100k), new thermostat (maybe not right now, but budget for it - maybe you’ll be willing to spend more and get the Hds one - which is the best there is but quite expensive),etc.

Provent - google “Provent 200”. It’s an oil-air separator. Good to have but not a must, especially with gde tune.

Keep in mind you may need a torque converter too, not sure what prev owner installed.

Honestly), this Crd jeeps are more a rarity and unique vehicle than anything else, I one really like mine and don’t think I’ll ever sell it, but to make it reliable, you need a small fortune. Once you do proper maintenance and upgrades, maybe proactively changing some sensors also (crank is the one I’d change - quite hard to replace it in the middle of the road). As long as you know what to expect and are ok with it, then it’s all good, and that’s what I’d like to make sure you understand before getting the vehicle.

flash7210 · **Posted:** Sun May 27, 2018 9:07 am

Jackkep wrote:

I can't do a pressure test when the engine doesn't run because the timing belt is broken. Should I get 5v or just steel tipped 7v. What are the advantages? I found the post about the DIY tune and I will order that cable and setup the software. Thanks.

Actually, you can do the pressure test.
Once you get it tore down with the intake removed, the injectors will be out (but leave the glow plugs in), and all the valves will be closed.
Reconnect all coolant hoses and top off with water.
Pressurize to 16 psi, wait 30 minutes, then crank the engine.
If water shoots out the injector holes, you will have your answer.
A follow up test involves removing turbo and exhaust manifold and checking for water in the exhaust ports.

Many of us here are trying to share our experiences with you so you can make informed decisions and avoid many of the pitfalls we have already encountered.
Some had blown head gaskets.
Some had broken valves.
I had a cracked head.

Jackkep · **Posted:** Sun May 27, 2018 10:21 am

thermorex wrote:

Jackkep wrote:

GordnadoCRD wrote:

1) Water pump. Don't forget the water pump. It is a wear item, and driven by the timing belt. It is critical for timing belt longevity.
Unlike a gasser you can't just change it when it starts leaking. It will have caused the timing belt to fail before that happens.
Recommend getting a timing belt kit from IDParts. It has everything you need.

2) This is only my opinion, but were I in your shoes, If you absolutely cannot afford ARP studs, at very least put in new TTY head bolts. The moving around described above, is kind of a big deal regarding head gasket life, and the TTY bolts lose their elasticity over time.
Since you already have the original head bolts exposed, you would be wise to install a new set in same manner as ARP studs are installed without removing the head. One at a time to full torque procedure in order of factory torque sequence At least then, you will have restored the head bolt elasticity it came with new, and a set of original bolts is a small fraction of ARP studs.

From my understanding the water pump is a 2 part unit and I only need to replace the front portion which does not disturb the seal. Is that true? Yes.
Anything else I should do that the original owner may have neglected that's specific to this engine?

Change all filters and fluids front to back, and use proper spec fluids. Anti-freeze lubricity declines with age. Recommend drain and replace. Use only Mopar or Zerex05.
If your transfer case fluid hasn't been drained and changed it may shock you how dirty it gets. ATF+4 same as in the trans.
Also look to your engine mounts. The right one nearly always fails first. Recommend replacing that one at least. If it has already failed, then change both.
Since you will have it off, check the alternator decoupler pulley. If it's bad it will murder your automatic belt tensioner.
Well over half of the problems / complaints have to do with the CP3 having to pull fuel all the way from the tank in the rear.. If it does not already have a fuel lift pump of some sort, I really strongly recommend it.
If you can't afford a Weeks EGR fix, at least install exhaust blockoff plates, and pull the FCV butterfly plate.

Had I known then what I know now, this is the order I would have addressed Mods on my CRD.

CRD guide, (short version)

Should be mandatory. (for reliability)
1) Lift pump (In Tank is best) Completely and permanently eliminates easily over half the drivability issues, common with this rig.
2) Provent (or similar, as long as it works)
3) Weeks kits (Passes sniffer and opacity tests on healthy engines. Visual too, IMO, depends on how much you flaunt it.)

Recommended (Things that lean towards optimization and a bit of diminishing returns for your dollar, rather than fixing problems that should never have made it to the market.)
1) Good Thermostat, Healthy cooling system, Especially if you are leaning towards power-ups.
2) good thermal protection for sensors, wiring looms, etc edit - also check wiring looms everywhere they go behind something (fuel filter bracket) around something, or through something (behind alternator, above starter, etc) check for worn insulation, bare wires, etc and fix anything you find (pre-emptive strike) Or you could just wait till something happens and hunt it down then.
3) Fuel filter upgrade (< 5 micrometer)
4) ARP Studs (best installed BEFORE head gasket fails)
5) Silicone CAC hoses and T-bolt clamps

Optional (power-ups and Fun-ups Things to do as time and money budget allows, depending on how you intend to use your CRD.)
1) Exhaust (On my list this was actually in highly recommended. Kind of depends on local statutes, or whether one licenses in CA)
2) ECM / TCM Tune
3) Torque converter (kind of goes along with #2) front pump, and any shifting mods desired.
4) Suspension / lift
5) Tires
6) Gearing / diff locks if needed / wanted.

Thanks for your input.

NP.

What's "provent" and where can I find a lift pump guide? I live in FL so no emissions testing or vehicle inspection[/quote]

The 2-3,000 is coming from the above parts. Rockers plus lifters (all of them), check the cyl head and camshafts, gde tune (I’d advise you to go with it, otherwise get the free one - but you need a tune to make the engine run w/o so much soot, timing parts, coolant flush (I believe it’s recommended every 100k), new thermostat (maybe not right now, but budget for it - maybe you’ll be willing to spend more and get the Hds one - which is the best there is but quite expensive),etc.

Provent - google “Provent 200”. It’s an oil-air separator. Good to have but not a must, especially with gde tune.

Keep in mind you may need a torque converter too, not sure what prev owner installed.

Honestly), this Crd jeeps are more a rarity and unique vehicle than anything else, I one really like mine and don’t think I’ll ever sell it, but to make it reliable, you need a small fortune. Once you do proper maintenance and upgrades, maybe proactively changing some sensors also (crank is the one I’d change - quite hard to replace it in the middle of the road). As long as you know what to expect and are ok with it, then it’s all good, and that’s what I’d like to make sure you understand before getting the vehicle.[/quote]

I've refined my shopping list a little. I'll adjust my budget for all this other stuff. Thanks for your help. I'll post some updates when I pick up the liberty and dive in.

Jackkep · **Posted:** Sun May 27, 2018 10:26 am

flash7210 wrote:

Jackkep wrote:

I can't do a pressure test when the engine doesn't run because the timing belt is broken. Should I get 5v or just steel tipped 7v. What are the advantages? I found the post about the DIY tune and I will order that cable and setup the software. Thanks.

Actually, you can do the pressure test.
Once you get it tore down with the intake removed, the injectors will be out (but leave the glow plugs in), and all the valves will be closed.
Reconnect all coolant hoses and top off with water.
Pressurize to 16 psi, wait 30 minutes, then crank the engine.
If water shoots out the injector holes, you will have your answer.
A follow up test involves removing turbo and exhaust manifold and checking for water in the exhaust ports.

Many of us here are trying to share our experiences with you so you can make informed decisions and avoid many of the pitfalls we have already encountered.
Some had blown head gaskets.
Some had broken valves.
I had a cracked head.

How do I go about pressurizing the cooling system?

WWDiesel · **Posted:** Sun May 27, 2018 10:49 am

Jackkep wrote:

How do I go about pressurizing the cooling system?

You will need a Cooling System Pressure Test Kit to pressurize the cooling system.
Most kits can be purchased for between $45.00 and $75.00
Some of the big box parts stores like Autozone actually rent the test kit. :wink:

This is a good writeup on how to perform using the kit:> https://www.2carpros.com/articles/radia ... ssure-test

Jeep Liberty CRD broken timing belt

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