Jackkep wrote:
rancherman wrote:
I'm still dealing with the aftermath of a 'slipped' timing belt, which broke all 8 rockers on the exhaust side. My intake side was ok, because they weren't that far out of time.
If your belt 'broke', you might be only looking at just a few of the rockers being broke.
You can get just the rocker individually, for about 150 bucks for a set of 16. I'd personally replace all of them regardless of how many are actually broke. I replaced just the rocker part because I figured the 80k mile lifters should have a lot of life left in them. (they don't actually wear against the cam, they just pump up the center section to take up lash)
Originally, I was only going to just replace those broken parts. And 9 out of 10 members have done so with good results.
The broke rockers are supposed to 'prevent' a catastrophic failure.. You should be 'ok' with just fixing what is broke.
I'm number 10, that went a little deeper with the head removal, and found other 'non timing belt failure related issues'.
Since I needed to split the engine away from the trans for a convertor upgrade, I figured it was 'kill 2 birds with 1 stone' to pull the engine and work on it out of the vehicle.
I found no evidence of bent valves, mucked up pistons, or any other reason to have the head off, "other than putting on a new head gasket, and head studs".
You are going to be ankle deep into this project, just to fix the rocker arms... and only a few more hours and you be able to do all the Flash7210 mentioned 'upgrades' for getting a LOT more dependable miles from your new purchase.
'ankle deep' may not seem too deep when standing upright.... unfortunately, this is a heads first operation.
I'll look into the upgrades but because I'm only spending 800$ on the liberty I don't want to jump into spending a crazy amount of money quite yet. Do you think I can get away with not pulling the head? I can't afford ARP studs and I don't really want to have to land a new head gasket if I mess up the current perfectly good one. I'm planning on just replacing all the rocker arms and the lifters by buying the whole set from ID parts but if the consensus is I'm fine with replacing the broken rockers and not even bothering with the lifters then I'll do that.
Understood.
I guess, it's your TIME that is going to be the expensive part. Parts seem to be readily available, and if anything, slightly cheaper than say 10 years ago.
Snag a test kit to test your coolant for exhaust contamination. Not all blown head gaskets put oil in the coolant. If it does show oil, I'd suspect the oil cooler before the head gasket.
If you have a head gasket that isn't leaking at this time, sure. Fix what is broke. But remember, this will be only a short term until the next time you are 10-12 hours away from being this close to popping the head off, instead of only a couple.
First thing; can you do the wrenching part yourself? (tools, space, time, etc?)
My thoughts on head bolts;
They lasted yours about 140k, assuming they are still original. Some guys seen less, some more, some quite a bit more.
For about 140 bucks, you get the gasket, and new bolts. Starting over with a good clean. flat head and new gasket and bolts 'should' get you by for quite a few years.
Mine with 80k wasn't officially 'blown'... but there were signs of it leaning that way.. I'm certainly glad I pulled the head to inspect.
As far as saving some bucks on the head, I went with a 'good used, low houred take off' from VmSpecialist in England.
They claim they are taken off of low hour, 'test, development, and salvaged for parts on warrantee returns'.
Said to be fully checked, tested, and ready for service. Basically all is up to spec. ~400 bucks.
Mine is enroute as we speak. A member told me his looked good out of the box, and has been running it since.
Head shops better know the specs on this head; They'll have to do a valve job to get the valves correct for installed height.. This is very important. If they take off say, .005 to regain flatness, they also need to 'sink' the valves the same amount. I don't recommend anything other than a light 'skimming', more for regaining the proper ra (surface roughness). These heads are nickel plated, not to mention they are fairly thin in places. The nickel is there to keep the aluminum from galling against the head gasket Aluminum heads crawl all over the place when they are heated up, and cooled down. Plus it helps on corrosion when to dissimilar metals are in contact (cast block, steel gasket, and finally the aluminum head) Then throw in an electrical charge from all the neat electronics underhood..
I really doubt there is a head shop that would touch these heads for less $$$ than what I have coming in next week. Get the wrong head guy standing over it... and you may be sorry, and still out 500-600 bucks.
Honestly, I was going to re use my old head, but time and my machinist's back log of jobs put me WAAAY out of the schedule..
I'm going to keep my old head, test it for cracks, flatness, then put in new exhaust valves for the 'next time' I'm staring at the opened up engine.
So, yes; you can do it the cheaper way, which I have no problem with, but understand this won't be the last time you'll need to be 'deep'. If you do it all yourself, the R and R part anyway, it's easier to swallow than paying a shop 140 bucks an hour