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 Post subject: Re: Welcome, I come bearing gifts
PostPosted: Sun Jan 13, 2019 3:34 pm 
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 Post subject: Re: Welcome, I come bearing gifts
PostPosted: Sun Jan 13, 2019 3:37 pm 
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The advantage to the billet wheels over the cast is they can use more radical designs that won't work in cast, I have used them in many builds

After talking with these guys in Australia, they have a hopped up gt1756 that they said they did testing with and found it flows 20% more than the 1756, the biggest part of the upgrade they did was the billet wheel and doh4 9 blade turbine

https://gcg.com.au/diesel-performance/d ... ger-detail

The thing I have industrial working on as a pet project is a gen3 vnt Install and converting to ball bearing like the one mercedes uses plus the 60 compressor side, the problems With the 17 frame is 60 is on the large size for compressor wheels, the vw guys do it but there is risk involved as it has a smaller shaft. I thought about the old disco potato but it would be too laggy for what I want out to my build, it want super quick spool and I want it to pull to the moon.


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 Post subject: Re: Welcome, I come bearing gifts
PostPosted: Sun Jan 13, 2019 4:35 pm 
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Location: Republic, Oh
The wicked wheels flaw are the really tall blades that make the turbine work harder. Garrett, BorgWarner all spend millions developing compressor technology, and not one of them make wheels with blades that extend like wicked wheel does, theres a reason.

I use billet wheels in my builds also, as well as a 9 blade gt20 wheel and gtb (3rd gen)vanes. GT15-22 all have the same size shaft and use the same compressors. Some have built-in heat shrouds, some are twin ring, itll take em a bit to figure it out. It just seems odd your gonna pay out the butt for industrial to do something thats already done, and refined.

I did the ball bearing disco potato 5 years ago, it made great hp, but sucked for low end torque, so i developed the turbo i build now:

Stock turbine on the left, 9 blade i use on the right.
Image
Image
Image

The last pic is from a customer who had 2 identical crd’s, one with my turbo, one with stock turbo. Mine beat the stocker in every way possible, from a stop, rolling, mpg, cant get any better testing than that. It even was able to develop full boost at 7,000’ elevation where the stock one fell short.

Ive also custom built the bearings in my BB conversion, as well as borrowed some gas turbine technology to add vibration/harmonic dampening to take alot of “interference” out of the bearings. Initial testing has showed ~50% less internal bearing friction compared to garretts stock ball bearings.

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05 Liberty Limited CRD, converted to KPA 2863 ball bearing and billet turbo, 50hp injectorsl, complete egr delete, cooling fan delete, weeks intake kit, cummins in tank lift pump, ARP studs, 3" turbo back exhaust, samcos, etecno plugs, GDE trans tune, custom GDE engine tune.


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 Post subject: Re: Welcome, I come bearing gifts
PostPosted: Sun Jan 13, 2019 7:55 pm 
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Joined: Thu Dec 12, 2013 9:17 pm
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Location: Republic, Oh
My66dodge wrote:
The advantage to the billet wheels over the cast is they can use more radical designs that won't work in cast, I have used them in many builds

After talking with these guys in Australia, they have a hopped up gt1756 that they said they did testing with and found it flows 20% more than the 1756, the biggest part of the upgrade they did was the billet wheel and doh4 9 blade turbine

https://gcg.com.au/diesel-performance/d ... ger-detail

The thing I have industrial working on as a pet project is a gen3 vnt Install and converting to ball bearing like the one mercedes uses plus the 60 compressor side, the problems With the 17 frame is 60 is on the large size for compressor wheels, the vw guys do it but there is risk involved as it has a smaller shaft. I thought about the old disco potato but it would be too laggy for what I want out to my build, it want super quick spool and I want it to pull to the moon.



That turbo is for the new A428 engine, ours is the R428. Thats the same turbo used in the new colorado/canyon diesel. Ive built 3 of em so far, and can say im the only one in the world who’s converted them to use a gt20 turbine and vanes. They are just putting a bigger compressor wheel on the stock shaft, as thats what was originally on them.
Image

Image

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05 Liberty Limited CRD, converted to KPA 2863 ball bearing and billet turbo, 50hp injectorsl, complete egr delete, cooling fan delete, weeks intake kit, cummins in tank lift pump, ARP studs, 3" turbo back exhaust, samcos, etecno plugs, GDE trans tune, custom GDE engine tune.


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 Post subject: Re: Welcome, I come bearing gifts
PostPosted: Sun Jan 13, 2019 8:00 pm 
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My66dodge wrote:
The advantage to the billet wheels over the cast is they can use more radical designs that won't work in cast, I have used them in many builds

After talking with these guys in Australia, they have a hopped up gt1756 that they said they did testing with and found it flows 20% more than the 1756, the biggest part of the upgrade they did was the billet wheel and doh4 9 blade turbine

https://gcg.com.au/diesel-performance/d ... ger-detail

The thing I have industrial working on as a pet project is a gen3 vnt Install and converting to ball bearing like the one mercedes uses plus the 60 compressor side, the problems With the 17 frame is 60 is on the large size for compressor wheels, the vw guys do it but there is risk involved as it has a smaller shaft. I thought about the old disco potato but it would be too laggy for what I want out to my build, it want super quick spool and I want it to pull to the moon.


I kinda wonder if you would be selling yourself a bit short by going with the GTB17 turbine AND ball bearing. The GTB17 works on the TDI's because they are 1.9 or 2.0L and they need all of 30 psi to get to 220 hp or so. Our 2.8's are gunna flow a lot more, especially if you start pushing the boost to what a 56mm wheel can handle safely(30 psi or so). A GDE Hot tuned liberty is running ~20 psi. So you are literally going to be flowing ~30% more air mass and be able to push 280 hp or so, thats a lot more than a GTB17 should be dealing with.

I guess it depends what your goals are though. 220 hp a GTB17 is good. Over than and I would be looking for a bigger turbine to be able to swallow all that flow.

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2006 CRD - GTB2056 turbo by Dieselguy86, Eco Trans Tune, Lift Pump, Week's, HDS Tstat, Racor Filter, ARP's, OME 790's+Top Plate, JBA 2.5", JBA UCA, Moab's+265/75R16, ARB Bull Bar, 4.10's, TrueTracs


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 Post subject: Re: Welcome, I come bearing gifts
PostPosted: Sun Jan 13, 2019 8:21 pm 
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Joined: Thu Dec 12, 2013 9:17 pm
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I would expect to see compressor surge with a BB 17. The 17 on the stock colorados are known for causing excessive backpressure and heat. 2 of the 3 turbos ive built had some cracking in the exhaust housing from the excessive egts.

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05 Liberty Limited CRD, converted to KPA 2863 ball bearing and billet turbo, 50hp injectorsl, complete egr delete, cooling fan delete, weeks intake kit, cummins in tank lift pump, ARP studs, 3" turbo back exhaust, samcos, etecno plugs, GDE trans tune, custom GDE engine tune.


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 Post subject: Re: Welcome, I come bearing gifts
PostPosted: Mon Jan 14, 2019 12:34 am 
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Following along...


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 Post subject: Re: Welcome, I come bearing gifts
PostPosted: Mon Jan 14, 2019 10:21 am 
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I know that turbo is from the a428, have you used a 60 or 65 compressor wheel on your turbo build. I use industrial injection cause they have way more experience than I do at building turbos, injectors, and pumps. I dont have the resources (turbo parts books) or the time to play with the fittment of the parts myself so I use them as they offer a superb product. Have you looked into the vlkr ceramic ball bearings for your build, or the swap to an electronic actuator, the vacuum actuator is a lot less responsive than the electronic so that's why I want to converts mine, GDE has the programing down. I want mine to make around the 250hp mark but be quicker than 8 second 0-60 that's my end goal, I would love to be sub 6 second but I know thats less attainable with this little paint mixer, it's a good engine but it has it's limitations.

http://www.turbo-upgrade.com/produse/gt ... r-new/123/


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 Post subject: Re: Welcome, I come bearing gifts
PostPosted: Mon Jan 14, 2019 11:31 am 
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TURBO-DIESEL-FREAK wrote:
Following along...


Following along too :5SHOTS:

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 Post subject: Re: Welcome, I come bearing gifts
PostPosted: Mon Jan 14, 2019 2:26 pm 
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My66dodge wrote:
I know that turbo is from the a428, have you used a 60 or 65 compressor wheel on your turbo build. I use industrial injection cause they have way more experience than I do at building turbos, injectors, and pumps. I dont have the resources (turbo parts books) or the time to play with the fittment of the parts myself so I use them as they offer a superb product. Have you looked into the vlkr ceramic ball bearings for your build, or the swap to an electronic actuator, the vacuum actuator is a lot less responsive than the electronic so that's why I want to converts mine, GDE has the programing down. I want mine to make around the 250hp mark but be quicker than 8 second 0-60 that's my end goal, I would love to be sub 6 second but I know thats less attainable with this little paint mixer, it's a good engine but it has it's limitations.

http://www.turbo-upgrade.com/produse/gt ... r-new/123/


The 60mm is the exducer, and yes that is what i use. Theres a couple guys pushing 250hp now with my turbo, and building one for 300hp, but your elevation will determine what is possible.

I start with vklr bearings and build those too. I gut them, and replace with full complement grade 3 ceramic balls. Without seals i can get 25seconds of spinning from just blowing on it they’re that good. Im around a week out of having my BB conversion done.

Weve worked on fitting an electronic actuator, but havent been able to tune-wise, and its annoying to say the least lol.

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05 Liberty Limited CRD, converted to KPA 2863 ball bearing and billet turbo, 50hp injectorsl, complete egr delete, cooling fan delete, weeks intake kit, cummins in tank lift pump, ARP studs, 3" turbo back exhaust, samcos, etecno plugs, GDE trans tune, custom GDE engine tune.


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 Post subject: Re: Welcome, I come bearing gifts
PostPosted: Mon Jan 14, 2019 4:18 pm 
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Have you sent one to Keith to let him have a crack at it


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 Post subject: Welcome, I come bearing gifts
PostPosted: Mon Jan 14, 2019 7:49 pm 
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My66dodge wrote:
Have you sent one to Keith to let him have a crack at it


I haven’t tried directly but was told no by someone(not in this thread) who was also working on a GTB solution.

GDE has their own GTB1756 turbo kit they want to sell.

If they are willing to provide tuning support to make it happen for turbos that they don’t sell then great. I’ve been wanting to do the conversion for a long time now.

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2006 CRD - GTB2056 turbo by Dieselguy86, Eco Trans Tune, Lift Pump, Week's, HDS Tstat, Racor Filter, ARP's, OME 790's+Top Plate, JBA 2.5", JBA UCA, Moab's+265/75R16, ARB Bull Bar, 4.10's, TrueTracs


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 Post subject: Re: Welcome, I come bearing gifts
PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2019 3:21 pm 
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My66dodge wrote:
Have you sent one to Keith to let him have a crack at it


Did you have luck with GDE?

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2006 CRD - GTB2056 turbo by Dieselguy86, Eco Trans Tune, Lift Pump, Week's, HDS Tstat, Racor Filter, ARP's, OME 790's+Top Plate, JBA 2.5", JBA UCA, Moab's+265/75R16, ARB Bull Bar, 4.10's, TrueTracs


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