I am lost - ETC and Battery light

InsaneZombieZA · **Joined:** Wed Mar 23, 2022 6:25 am **Posts:** 11

Hi guys!

I've been searching the forums and cannot find my exact issue. I have a 2007 CRD Liberty (we call them Cherokee in South Africa :roll:

) and when I start the engine and wait lets say around 30 seconds to about two minutes.. both the battery and the ETC (lightning bolt between two brackets) light starts flashing. I have tested the battery with a multimeter while the battery light is on and engine running and battery shows 14.2v which leads me to believe that the alternator is in fact charging. Sometimes while driving the battery light goes off for a short while and then comes back on again, the ETC light however stays on. But they come on at pretty much the same time each time after starting the engine.

I have fitted a new battery, fitted a new alternator clutch pulley, installed new alternator brushes, invented all sorts of swear words and still cannot figure it out.

These lights does not seem to affect performance, so I am a bit lost in trying to find and fixing this issue.

Any ideas perhaps?

WWDiesel · **Posted:** Wed Nov 16, 2022 2:44 pm

29. Electronic Throttle Control (ETC) Warning Light —
This light informs you of a problem with the Electronic Throttle Control system. If a problem is detected the light will come on while the engine is running. Cycle the ignition key when the vehicle has completely stopped and the gear selector is placed in the P (Park) position. The light should turn off. If the light remains lit with the engine running your vehicle will usually be drivable, however, see your dealer for service as soon as possible. If the light is flashing when the engine is running, immediate service is required and you may experience reduced performance, an elevated/rough idle or engine stall and your vehicle may require towing. The light will come on when the ignition is first turned on and remain on briefly as a bulb check. If the light does not come on during starting, have the system checked by an authorized dealer.

Check your wiring connection to the electronic throttle control (accelerator pedal) and make sure it is tight, dry, and clean, and no green crusties.
You may have to replace the the ETC. It is not serviceable and is replaced as a whole unit.
IDParts list them:> https://www.idparts.com/accelerator-ped ... -3926.html
OEM Mopar Part Number: 53013703AB

Billybob · **Posted:** Thu Nov 17, 2022 1:30 am

InsaneZombieZA wrote:

Hi guys!

I've been searching the forums and cannot find my exact issue. I have a 2007 CRD Liberty (we call them Cherokee in South Africa :roll:

) and when I start the engine and wait lets say around 30 seconds to about two minutes.. both the battery and the ETC (lightning bolt between two brackets) light starts flashing. I have tested the battery with a multimeter while the battery light is on and engine running and battery shows 14.2v which leads me to believe that the alternator is in fact charging. Sometimes while driving the battery light goes off for a short while and then comes back on again, the ETC light however stays on. But they come on at pretty much the same time each time after starting the engine.

I have fitted a new battery, fitted a new alternator clutch pulley, installed new alternator brushes, invented all sorts of swear words and still cannot figure it out.

These lights does not seem to affect performance, so I am a bit lost in trying to find and fixing this issue.

Any ideas perhaps?

Welcome to the site fellow South African!

WWDiesel has given you some good advice...you probably will need to replace the Throttle Assembly!

Can I ask you where you obtained the Pulley for the Alternator? From the USA?
Here in White River I would have to buy a new Alternator with the Pulley fitted....big Bucks!

I believe my 2002 2.5L CRD is long overdue for replacement of the Alternator Pulley especially considering that the early CRDs pulley was a "dry" pulley whereas newer pulleys are sealed with grease inside.

I can get this part from the USA but it is a major issue trying to pay for it in Dollars and have it shipped to me in the Sticks here! :roll:

InsaneZombieZA · **Joined:** Wed Mar 23, 2022 6:25 am **Posts:** 11

Welcome to the site fellow South African!

WWDiesel has given you some good advice...you probably will need to replace the Throttle Assembly!

Can I ask you where you obtained the Pulley for the Alternator? From the USA?
Here in White River I would have to buy a new Alternator with the Pulley fitted....big Bucks!

I believe my 2002 2.5L CRD is long overdue for replacement of the Alternator Pulley especially considering that the early CRDs pulley was a "dry" pulley whereas newer pulleys are sealed with grease inside.

I can get this part from the USA but it is a major issue trying to pay for it in Dollars and have it shipped to me in the Sticks here! :roll:

[/quote]

Hi guys, thanks for the quick response!!

Yeah when I bought the Jeep about a year ago the previous owner welded the pulley because they either could not find a new one or just didn't want to bother replacing it. It squeaked all the time which sounded like I was stepping on mice all the time and was driving me crazy!!!

I am in Cape Town and a place called Diesel Electric (in Parow) is where I got mine, took the new pulley and alternator to an auto electrician and they removed old pulley and fitted new one, took about 10 minutes and R100 labour

I also thought it might be the Throttle Assembly, but what throws me off is that the battery light comes on at the same time.

InsaneZombieZA · **Joined:** Wed Mar 23, 2022 6:25 am **Posts:** 11

WWDiesel wrote:

29. Electronic Throttle Control (ETC) Warning Light —
This light informs you of a problem with the Electronic Throttle Control system. If a problem is detected the light will come on while the engine is running. Cycle the ignition key when the vehicle has completely stopped and the gear selector is placed in the P (Park) position. The light should turn off. If the light remains lit with the engine running your vehicle will usually be drivable, however, see your dealer for service as soon as possible. If the light is flashing when the engine is running, immediate service is required and you may experience reduced performance, an elevated/rough idle or engine stall and your vehicle may require towing. The light will come on when the ignition is first turned on and remain on briefly as a bulb check. If the light does not come on during starting, have the system checked by an authorized dealer.

Check your wiring connection to the electronic throttle control (accelerator pedal) and make sure it is tight, dry, and clean, and no green crusties.
You may have to replace the the ETC. It is not serviceable and is replaced as a whole unit.
IDParts list them:> https://www.idparts.com/accelerator-ped ... -3926.html
OEM Mopar Part Number: 53013703AB

Thank you for the information - I saw a few other threads also saying that the ETC light could mean that the pedal needs to be replaced. But I am not sure whey the battery light would also light up at the same time?

WWDiesel · **Posted:** Thu Nov 17, 2022 12:01 pm

InsaneZombieZA wrote:

Thank you for the information - I saw a few other threads also saying that the ETC light could mean that the pedal needs to be replaced. But I am not sure whey the battery light would also light up at the same time?

I would advise you to fix the pedal problem first and then see if the battery light issue disappears.
There has been quite a bit of reported ECM quirkiness on these vehicles over the years that have produced some very strange things that defies normal logic. :banghead:

InsaneZombieZA · **Joined:** Wed Mar 23, 2022 6:25 am **Posts:** 11

WWDiesel wrote:

InsaneZombieZA wrote:

Thank you for the information - I saw a few other threads also saying that the ETC light could mean that the pedal needs to be replaced. But I am not sure whey the battery light would also light up at the same time?

I would advise you to fix the pedal problem first and then see if the battery light issue disappears.
There has been quite a bit of reported ECM quirkiness on these vehicles over the years that have produced some very strange things that defies normal logic. :banghead:

I had a look at the pedal at idparts but that is not the same one I have in my Jeep. The one I do have is this one https://www.ebay.com/itm/265914295661 The only real difference I can see is the electrical connector. The part number on mine is 53013784AB

Steve777 · **Joined:** Fri Oct 16, 2015 11:31 pm **Posts:** 279

A couple of other thoughts. If the batt and ETC lights are coming on at the same time, it may be a connection or ECM voltage issue in play here.

I spent a while in ETC hell, trying to find the source of that error. They can be caused by a worn/bad variable resistors (there are 2) in the pedal assembly (you can take the pedal apart carefully and inspect and clean), but also a faulty cam or crank sensor can trigger them. As can a connection or wiring fault to any of the above.

The batt light coming on when the alt is putting out decent voltage would lead me to suspect that the ECM is not getting accurate voltage measurements. Perhaps a loose connector or gnawed wire somewhere. If the ETC light is happening simultaneously with the batt, perhaps a loose connector which is carrying both signals. I don't know the wiring of these beasts well enough to venture a guess, but it might be worth finding the wires which carry the acc pedal signals back to the ECM and check them. Same for the alt/batt voltage sensing wire(s). Also might be worth checking the voltage with the engine running at a few other spots just to see if it is low anywhere. And of course reseating the connectors on the ECM. If you can get a hold of a good code reader, there may be codes stored which would give you some idea of what is going on (ones like pedal line shorted or open, etc).

FWIW, in my case it was an electrical connector which carried the pedal lines that had come partially disconnected. Eventually it got bad enough that the ETC would come on every time I went over a big bump. I got a code for one of the rheostats in the pedal being off, and traced its lines back to the ECM. That is when I found the partially loose connector (on the passenger side firewall strangely enough).

It can be a lot of detective work, but unless you get lucky with the parts replacing route, it's best to identify what's wrong first.

Good luck.

Billybob · **Posted:** Sat Nov 19, 2022 4:29 am

InsaneZombieZA wrote:

WWDiesel wrote:

InsaneZombieZA wrote:

Thank you for the information - I saw a few other threads also saying that the ETC light could mean that the pedal needs to be replaced. But I am not sure whey the battery light would also light up at the same time?

I would advise you to fix the pedal problem first and then see if the battery light issue disappears.
There has been quite a bit of reported ECM quirkiness on these vehicles over the years that have produced some very strange things that defies normal logic. :banghead:

I had a look at the pedal at idparts but that is not the same one I have in my Jeep. The one I do have is this one https://www.ebay.com/itm/265914295661 The only real difference I can see is the electrical connector. The part number on mine is 53013784AB

I believe all the KKs use the same TYPE of throttle pedal as the 2007 KJ so maybe that is the difference!

InsaneZombieZA · **Joined:** Wed Mar 23, 2022 6:25 am **Posts:** 11

Steve777 wrote:

A couple of other thoughts. If the batt and ETC lights are coming on at the same time, it may be a connection or ECM voltage issue in play here.

I spent a while in ETC hell, trying to find the source of that error. They can be caused by a worn/bad variable resistors (there are 2) in the pedal assembly (you can take the pedal apart carefully and inspect and clean), but also a faulty cam or crank sensor can trigger them. As can a connection or wiring fault to any of the above.

The batt light coming on when the alt is putting out decent voltage would lead me to suspect that the ECM is not getting accurate voltage measurements. Perhaps a loose connector or gnawed wire somewhere. If the ETC light is happening simultaneously with the batt, perhaps a loose connector which is carrying both signals. I don't know the wiring of these beasts well enough to venture a guess, but it might be worth finding the wires which carry the acc pedal signals back to the ECM and check them. Same for the alt/batt voltage sensing wire(s). Also might be worth checking the voltage with the engine running at a few other spots just to see if it is low anywhere. And of course reseating the connectors on the ECM. If you can get a hold of a good code reader, there may be codes stored which would give you some idea of what is going on (ones like pedal line shorted or open, etc).

FWIW, in my case it was an electrical connector which carried the pedal lines that had come partially disconnected. Eventually it got bad enough that the ETC would come on every time I went over a big bump. I got a code for one of the rheostats in the pedal being off, and traced its lines back to the ECM. That is when I found the partially loose connector (on the passenger side firewall strangely enough).

It can be a lot of detective work, but unless you get lucky with the parts replacing route, it's best to identify what's wrong first.

Good luck.

I took the Jeep to a mechanic with a decent code reader and P0560 (system voltage malfunction) was the result. Upon checking the voltage that the ECM was getting using this code reader it hovered around 8.5v and fluctuated a fair bit and this was while idle. I also measured the battery with a multi meter and that shows it is getting a charge voltage of 14.2v. So it seems there is some truth to the fact that there could be a faulty connector or wire break somewhere in the system leading to the ECM.

Now I need to try and trace the issue. Do you perhaps know where I can measure the voltage to the ECM with a multi meter? Perhaps somewhere on a connector pin? Seems like I need to study the wiring diagrams :cry:

WWDiesel · **Posted:** Sat Nov 19, 2022 11:30 am

InsaneZombieZA wrote:

I took the Jeep to a mechanic with a decent code reader and P0560 (system voltage malfunction) was the result. Upon checking the voltage that the ECM was getting using this code reader it hovered around 8.5v and fluctuated a fair bit and this was while idle. I also measured the battery with a multi meter and that shows it is getting a charge voltage of 14.2v. So it seems there is some truth to the fact that there could be a faulty connector or wire break somewhere in the system leading to the ECM.
Now I need to try and trace the issue. Do you perhaps know where I can measure the voltage to the ECM with a multi meter? Perhaps somewhere on a connector pin? Seems like I need to study the wiring diagrams :cry:

If your Jeep is like the 06 US models?
IF so, Pins 1-6 on the C2 connector are the main power and grounds for the ECM. They come from the ASD relay and the Ign. switch.
Get a wiring diagram for your model, look at the pinouts for the ECM connectors, then backprobe the power and grounds using a voltmeter.
Let us know if you need help reading the wiring diagrams.

Is your 07 model the same as an 06 US model on wiring? The FSM's for the US models are available at:> http://www.colorado4wheel.com/manuals/Jeep/KJ/

InsaneZombieZA · **Joined:** Wed Mar 23, 2022 6:25 am **Posts:** 11

WWDiesel wrote:

InsaneZombieZA wrote:

I took the Jeep to a mechanic with a decent code reader and P0560 (system voltage malfunction) was the result. Upon checking the voltage that the ECM was getting using this code reader it hovered around 8.5v and fluctuated a fair bit and this was while idle. I also measured the battery with a multi meter and that shows it is getting a charge voltage of 14.2v. So it seems there is some truth to the fact that there could be a faulty connector or wire break somewhere in the system leading to the ECM.
Now I need to try and trace the issue. Do you perhaps know where I can measure the voltage to the ECM with a multi meter? Perhaps somewhere on a connector pin? Seems like I need to study the wiring diagrams :cry:

If your Jeep is like the 06 US models?
IF so, Pins 1-6 on the C2 connector are the main power and grounds for the ECM. They come from the ASD relay and the Ign. switch.
Get a wiring diagram for your model, look at the pinouts for the ECM connectors, then backprobe the power and grounds using a voltmeter.
Let us know if you need help reading the wiring diagrams.

Is your 07 model the same as an 06 US model on wiring? The FSM's for the US models are available at:> http://www.colorado4wheel.com/manuals/Jeep/KJ/

I have the manuals, thanks! Yes I think the 2007 and 2006 are the same (production date on my Jeep was Sept 2006), but I think because it was sold and registered in 2007 it sort of goes as a 2007 model.

Thanks for the tip re pin 1 and 6. I see on the wiring diagram that both pin 1 and 3 are a fused ASD relay outputs (both circuit K347) and pin 6 is ground. I'll see if I can get the back probe pins and check the voltage. I have today removed all the ground straps, cleaned them nicely and tightened it all up again. Went for a test drive and so far no pings and lights on the dash. I took a few measurements at the fuse box under the dash as well to check if I get 12V there and they all seem fine.

I will be driving around tomorrow and Monday to see if the lights return. Will get the probes as well and also take back to mechanic for a re-scan. I'll keep you posted.

Billybob · **Posted:** Sun Nov 20, 2022 3:12 am

Hopefully it is fixed now....bad grounds are common and cause all sorts of problems....been there done that!
When I have had to do major fault-finding in the wiring I tape a small sewing needle or pin to the meter leads so that I am able to piece the insulation on the wires to take voltage/OHM readings...when I am finished I close the small hole up with some glue or melt the hole carefully with a soldering iron! :wink:

WWDiesel · **Posted:** Sun Nov 20, 2022 1:20 pm

Billybob wrote:

Hopefully it is fixed now....bad grounds are common and cause all sorts of problems....been there done that!
When I have had to do major fault-finding in the wiring I tape a small sewing needle or pin to the meter leads so that I am able to pierce the insulation on the wires to take voltage/OHM readings...when I am finished I close the small hole up with some glue or melt the hole carefully with a soldering iron! :wink:

Order yourself some of these: "Wire Piercing Clips", they are a great tool and work great for piercing wires when testing and diagnosing individual electrical circuits on automotive wiring. So much better than trying to use sewing needles; been there done that!
The great thing about them is, most voltmeter leads connect (plugin) directly to them.

For sealing up a pierced hole in a wire, liquid tape is a great product for this purpose! Use it quite often.

InsaneZombieZA · **Joined:** Wed Mar 23, 2022 6:25 am **Posts:** 11

Sorry for the late reply guys.. I think I have finally sorted out the issue. Since the battery light came on at the same time as the ETC light, I had two options... Get a new accelerator pedal or look at the charging circuit for issues since the headlights and interior lights had an intermittent flicker when revving the engine - the flicker wasn't that noticeable and at times did not flicker at all, but every now and then it did for about 10 seconds or so and is much more noticeable at night, my wife on the other had while she was in the passenger seat did not see any flicker (or she didn't know what to look for).

So I removed the alternator, sent it in to a place that rebuilds alternators and they took the whole thing apart, stripped it to its bare bones. They replaced bearings, regulator as well as the brush box, the rectifier and slip rings were still fine. I fitted the alternator back into the jeep, and so after about 3 days and probably around 200km so far no more ETC and battery lights. Only time will tell if the lightning bolt of head ache and swear words comes back again, but at least so far so good :BANANA:

Having the alternator rebuilt cost R1700 (+/- $95). And getting a new accelerator pedal plus shipping from the USA would've been around R5100 (+/- $290) excluding customs fees.

But with all of this in mind you can purchase the regulator at a parts store and by the looks of things remove the old regulator and fit the new one without even removing the alternator from the vehicle, which would've been even cheaper than having a auto electrical shop rebuilding the entire thing.

My thinking is this... If the alternator charging circuit voltage drops too low (in my case it was around 8v for a few moments) the battery light comes on, then it might cause certain sensors etc to have a spike in resistance or amps or whatever happens in a circuit when volts drops to low (please correct me if I am wrong, I am sure there are a lot of electrical savvy guys on this forum). And this voltage drop might trigger a spike or incorrect (volt/amp/ohm) readings on the ETC circuit and the moment the computer sees this and thinks that it is a fault with the pedal circuitry (of whatever circuit is monitored here) and illuminates the ETC light. Then a few moments when the voltage returns to normal and the battery light goes off again the ETC light will stay on because the only way to "reset" it is to cycle the ignition key. So turning the jeep off and starting up again will clear the ETC light for a while only until the voltage drops again and the entire cycle repeats itself.

I will however report back and update this post if the issue returns or if in a few months everything is still good. Then you could perhaps add this solution to the list of things to check/fix/replace if ever the ETC light comes on.

I am lost - ETC and Battery light

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