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Am I Nuts ??????? Welding advice needed
http://www.lostjeeps.com/forum/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=59&t=11262		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  kjhawaii [ Wed Aug 09, 2006 8:52 am ]
Post subject:  Am I Nuts ??????? Welding advice needed
Its true - I am nuts :roll: Its now 3 am.

am I :evil: . . . . Yes I am. . . . . . Metallaica fans. . . . . listened to it on the way home still love it

So Im at Home Depot, picking up some electrical crap and always thinking about the making the KJ "Trail Rated".

For those who do not know me "hate me like me whatever (lostkjs rocks)" I live on the Big Island of Hawaii in the boonies and its rough out here. $3.59 regular gas, $5 milk etc..... We just got Home Depot (100 mile round trip) few years ago and just got a Lowes. Napa and Carquest (thats all.....woefully overpriced and understocked) I love Ebay/Internet but add shipping (3000 miles from Cali) to hawaii, so I am worse off then those you in the boonies. Ok enough boohoo.

Id prefer to buy quality Rockrails but it would cost more to ship then the rails... plus . . I am :evil:

So I see these

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1 Inch Solid hexogonal Steel bars - point on one end and a chisel on the other - I bought 3 $24 each

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Says forged treated Tempered - I can return if needed

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4 inches out from plastic pinch cover
Bought Pipe for rack as well - 3/4 water galve sched 40 for main members

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low Profile - Maintain Max Ground Clearance
Step - out enough to step on so I can reach the rack
Strong - enough to jack with the hi-lift - just recived the hilift extreme

I am not a steel or welding expert so if anyone sees a serious flaw in my thoughts please speak it out
Im welding it myself with a 220 ac welder, Got 12" Chop, grinders and a hawaiin barn full of crap etc. I have access to a Mig and Acetaline or may mock it all and have a local welder do it.

So far what I see a problems could be

Welding on forged to forged - forged to galv - forged to plate

too heavy - adversely affect handling
too weak - solid vs tube to lift on a high lift - assuming number of crossmembers/braces
accomodate sliding over rocks

More to come - Rails, rack, bumper, I plan to paint same time

Any thoughts or comments welcomed - kjHawaii
Author:  Gris [ Wed Aug 09, 2006 9:57 am ]
Post subject: 
The only issue I see...

As thick and strong as that main bar might be, it's still solid steel. Solid steel is actually weaker than hollow tube. My concern would be that a good hit on a rock will bend that peice up and into the body actually doing more damage than the rock itself (Since both would now hit).

You might not be able to tell by feel, but take that bar you have and a peice of black pipe that's the same diameter.

put blocks under the ends of both peices and start hanging weight from the middle. THe solid bar is going to bend in half with about half the weight it takes to bend the tube.
Author:  Jeger [ Wed Aug 09, 2006 11:28 am ]
Post subject: 
Gris wrote:
The only issue I see...

As thick and strong as that main bar might be, it's still solid steel. Solid steel is actually weaker than hollow tube. My concern would be that a good hit on a rock will bend that peice up and into the body actually doing more damage than the rock itself (Since both would now hit).

You might not be able to tell by feel, but take that bar you have and a peice of black pipe that's the same diameter.

put blocks under the ends of both peices and start hanging weight from the middle. THe solid bar is going to bend in half with about half the weight it takes to bend the tube.


I do believe that the pipe is going to bend first. Now if you had a pipe that was the same weight as the bar it would certainly be stronger. Or even a pipe that was a certain amount bigger..how much i dont know... If this were true all of our pry/spud bars would be hollow.

I have done enough welding to know that some types of steel may need some sort of heat treatment after welding in order to get the strongest weld. I have not done enough welding to know what types of steel would need it. So here is a good place to learn more than you wanted to know about welding. http://www.lincolnelectric.com/knowledge/
Author:  kjhawaii [ Wed Aug 09, 2006 3:01 pm ]
Post subject: 
Thanks - Checking out

http://www.lincolnelectric.com/knowledge/
Author:  Gris [ Wed Aug 09, 2006 3:42 pm ]
Post subject: 
I'm probably wrong aobut the whole thing.

For a test, next time you go to that lowes that's a 100 mile round trip, Take a 10 foot piece of 1/2" blackpipe and hold it out at arms length.

Now go get a 10 foot peice of 1/2" rebar and hold that at arms length. tell me which one bends more.
Author:  Jeger [ Wed Aug 09, 2006 6:27 pm ]
Post subject: 
If I am wrong I will most certainly admit to it as well. I chose my tag line mostly because of how often it applies to me :shock: :lol:

Remember with the pipe and rebar thing that standard 1/2 inch black pipe is actually something like 7/8 OD whereas the rebar is 1/2 OD. If someone actually does this sort of test with similar metals let us know. I am going from experiences as a machinist/welder and no real formal training so I could be way off base.

And kjhawaii if you do make yourself some rails out of those things you MUST leave at least one of the working ends on there :wink: tell people its detachable for when you need to pry a big rock loose :-)r
Author:  GilaMonster [ Thu Aug 10, 2006 2:42 pm ]
Post subject:  What happened with the bumper?
I'm still following your bumper build, did you finish it? If so, will you post some pic on your bumper thread? (sorry for the hijack)

Keep up the pictures, its appreciated.

As for these as sliders, don't know, what type of deflection do you get if you bounce on them with just your body weight? They are forged, so you should be able to run beads just fine, but you will have to match up the steel and use high heat for good penetration/puddle between the two very different thicknesses.

From a web search, this bar is used to lever boulders and such, may just work for you.
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