SFA kit price

JJsTJ · **Posted:** Thu Jan 06, 2011 9:00 am

Tell the shop to build a kit for you and then let us know the price they could sell it for. If it comes in low enough w/ the right parts included, I bet they could sell Many kits. Not everyone that is in, or might be in, the market for such a kit is on this forum and many would buy it regardless of what most here think. Look at the things that sell for Jeeps, many have been proven to be junk by many other Jeep owners w/ plenty of people still buying them regardless. (not saying you would build or sell junk, but i'm sure you get my meaning)

I think a kit in the same price range as is offered for other vehicle SFA conversions would sell if it is well made.

03Cactus.... do you really think OHV wheeled his SFA more than I have wheeled mine? Hmm... doubt it. :wink:

dirtrulz · **Joined:** Tue Jan 04, 2011 6:10 pm **Posts:** 19

We could not produce a complete kit as cheap as you could do it yourself by sourcing your own parts. We would have to use new parts for a complete kit. If you were to buy partial kits like just say the arms and brackets then you can use used parts if you like. Is anyone out there actually marketing a kit, I couldnt seem to find anyone. I know there are shops doing the work but I dont know if they have set pricing or are doing it on a per job price. I would like to develop as complete a kit as possible. Would probable have to exclude drivelines as there are too many variable there as far as what other things the customer plans to do.

We would not likely have a viable product if we tried to build a kit for only the hardest core wheelers. The vast majority of people would find a kit with built dana 60's way overkill and would not purchase the product, remember we have to look at the majority of buyers. Yes there will be those out there who will say it is junk because it wont hold up to the 50 inch tires they want to run.

So lets say the kit costs 12 thousand or so with new axles and lockers and new steering box, all new parts. Say another thousand or so on gears, drivelines and exhaust. Under 15 thousand for all new parts doesnt seem terrible. Obviously you could cut that price less than half if you source your own drivetrain parts. Plus you should be able to have a well thought out kit installed way faster than having to wait for a shop to custom build everything.

Maybe I am way off base and the project isnt worth pursuing, but I personally think it is doable.

tjkj2002 · **Posted:** Thu Jan 06, 2011 12:35 pm

It's doable,even with a high price.I mean Burnsville Offroad has done countless HEMI swaps into Wranglers and there prices start at $20,000+ and go well over $40,000+.

JeepBumm68 · **Posted:** Thu Jan 06, 2011 1:45 pm

Actually for someone that wanted bullet proof axles you could spend 20k. Ask me how I know.

A kit can be had for around 5k with all the parts needed minus the axles. You can do a budget build and keep the 8.25, or upgrade the 8.25 to a ford 8.8, get serious strength out of it, and throw the hp30 up front. You can wheel on that combo for a long time. No one has to build their SFA the same way as TJkjs, jj's, mine, ohv, inc, andy, arbseth, or jersobu. Each build has a different price with it. Ya a lot of the build well be the same in terms of body stiffeners, where the steering box mounts, or if you want to go CO's or coils. Not everyone needs to build it on coilover's and not everyone needs to build it on coils. Build the Jeep to what you need. Everyone knows that even on FW's that lowest you can go is 8''. But to work properly your gonna be sitting around 9'' or so.

in terms of easy to build with more room to work with, and just overall ease of build if a shop does not do it, I would go FW's. If you properly build your Axles up with stronger components you are going to spend up to 2.5k per axle if not more.

Also, In my opinion from doing are build out of a garage, and with off the shelf parts, I would never do it again. I would build custom arms, steering, and belly pan. I would also inset the steering box into a braced box portion of the front unibody frame. If I went coilovers again I would do it right by cutting up into the fender/engine and make coilover tube mounts and brace it across. I would only go full width, and I wouldn't touch a build like it unless I was in a shop, with all the right tools. The front you can get away with a 3-link front, or stay with the y-link, and the rear do a proper 4-link.

After are build that we just got done with (a year process), this is what I have found out would make it easier and less expensive in the long run. If someone can get a complete bolt on kit, that includes everything, you would need, I mean everything, including axles, you would sell some kits.

anyways ask me how I know, since even though we just got the liberty on the road after a year, it goes back down in a few weeks to get the new Fullwidths axles under it. I was just not happy with the height of the rig nor the on road handling.

tjkj2002 · **Posted:** Thu Jan 06, 2011 2:11 pm

JeepBumm68 wrote:

Actually for someone that wanted bullet proof axles you could spend 20k. Ask me how I know.

A kit can be had for around 5k with all the parts needed minus the axles. You can do a budget build and keep the 8.25, or upgrade the 8.25 to a ford 8.8, get serious strength out of it, and throw the hp30 up front. You can wheel on that combo for a long time. No one has to build their SFA the same way as TJkjs, jj's, mine, ohv, inc, andy, arbseth, or jersobu. Each build has a different price with it. Ya a lot of the build well be the same in terms of body stiffeners, where the steering box mounts, or if you want to go CO's or coils. Not everyone needs to build it on coilover's and not everyone needs to build it on coils. Build the Jeep to what you need. Everyone knows that even on FW's that lowest you can go is 8''. But to work properly your gonna be sitting around 9'' or so.

in terms of easy to build with more room to work with, and just overall ease of build if a shop does not do it, I would go FW's. If you properly build your Axles up with stronger components you are going to spend up to 2.5k per axle if not more.

Also, In my opinion from doing are build out of a garage, and with off the shelf parts, I would never do it again. I would build custom arms, steering, and belly pan. I would also inset the steering box into a braced box portion of the front unibody frame. If I went coilovers again I would do it right by cutting up into the fender/engine and make coilover tube mounts and brace it across. I would only go full width, and I wouldn't touch a build like it unless I was in a shop, with all the right tools. The front you can get away with a 3-link front, or stay with the y-link, and the rear do a proper 4-link.

After are build that we just got done with (a year process), this is what I have found out would make it easier and less expensive in the long run. If someone can get a complete bolt on kit, that includes everything, you would need, I mean everything, including axles, you would sell some kits.

anyways ask me how I know, since even though we just got the liberty on the road after a year, it goes back down in a few weeks to get the new Fullwidths axles under it. I was just not happy with the height of the rig nor the on road handling.

FW's with a front AntiRock makes a world of difference,as is the correct shocks and coils for on-road handling.I feel just a safe as before when my KJ was on IFS as SFA'd and 10" of lift for cornering and such.

JeepBumm68 · **Posted:** Thu Jan 06, 2011 2:22 pm

Ya I hear ya on that. One reason why we decided to go ahead and do the FW's now, get the AR on.

durangotang · **Posted:** Thu Jan 06, 2011 3:26 pm

Instead of focusing on the kit right away... why not start out making some high quality weld on/bolt on brackets and mounts to make the job easier?

Once you developed all of them that were necessary, offer them up as a kit. For example, I know some people would have loved a chance to buy a steering box mount already sourced with the rebuilt steering box, arm, and proper lines. If you make a name for yourself selling top quality individual components, people will be a lot more likely to drop the bucks on the kit.

dirtrulz · **Joined:** Tue Jan 04, 2011 6:10 pm **Posts:** 19

Was thinking the was to go was to make custom arms and brackets, brackets for the popular axles and selling that as a kit. Of course after you get the barckets and arms figured out it isnt much farther of a step to just do a full kit. That way we could weld on the brackets to the axles and be sure they are done right. I am not really interested in letting a back yard mechanic do a crappy job of welding and then bad mouth me everywhere because something broke.

JeepBumm68 · **Posted:** Thu Jan 06, 2011 9:45 pm

you are on the right track man. Make all the brackets, body stiffeners, belly pan, steering box bracket, and the custom long or mid arms and it well be a set kit, add in the option of doing either coils or coilover's, and have options for all the popular axles.

Fulltimer · **Posted:** Fri Jan 07, 2011 12:13 pm

I have been following this with interest. It seems like the shipping cost of the kits could be reduced a whole lot if the axles were not included, as an option. For me getting the axles would not be a problem. To get an idea of what people would want why not use the "poll" function on here. One poll for axles or not. Another for one other thing. In the end you would have a pretty good idea of what people want without having all the discussions clouding things up. BTW, I would be interested in a medium priced kit. By "medium priced" I mean a good quality kit. Not one with only the best parts.

Terry

Rock Lizard · **Posted:** Fri Jan 07, 2011 1:07 pm

For an SFA kit price, here is what mine looks like. This is for those using stock width axles. Pricing for full width axle kit is pretty much the same, just with different coils/shocks/mounts in the front. My kit is 100% bolt on, only required 2" of pinch weld to be cut off in the front for the tracbar mount and removal of the rear LCA unibody mounts. If you retain the stock rear LCA mounts on the unibody, you can completely remove my entire kit and return to stock.

Godzilla SFA Parts List (Phase I Kit)
ROCK LIZARD KIT PARTS
SS3KJSFA Skink Super Sliders SFA Custom
GODZILLA Godzilla SFA Complete Mount Kit
w/ Belly Pan
CONTROL ARMS
RE4000 LONG ARM
RE4010 LONG ARM
RE4020 FRONT UCA PAIR
RE4030 REAR LOWER ARM PAIR
RE4040 REAR UPPER ARM PAIR
$4850.00 Plus Shipping

Godzilla SFA Parts List (Phase II Kit)
ROCK LIZARD KIT PARTS
SS3KJSFA Skink Super Sliders SFA Custom
RMBKJSFA Rock Monitor Phase IV SFA Custom (provisioned for Currie Anti-Rock Swaybar)
GODZILLA Godzilla SFA Complete Mount Kit
w/ Belly Pan
CONTROL ARMS
RE4000 LONG ARM
RE4010 LONG ARM
RE4020 FRONT UCA PAIR
RE4030 REAR LOWER ARM PAIR
RE4040 REAR UPPER ARM PAIR
STEERING PARTS/SWAYBAR
CE9900 Currie Anti-Rock Swaybar Kit
$5950.00 Plus Shipping

Godzilla SFA Parts List (Phase III Kit)
CONTROL ARMS
RE4000 LONG ARM
RE4010 LONG ARM
RE4020 FRONT UCA PAIR
RE4030 REAR LOWER ARM PAIR
RE4040 REAR UPPER ARM PAIR
COILS/SHOCKS/COILOVERS
OME864 REAR HD COIL PAIR
RXJ802 RE ZJ REAR SHOCK PAIR
980-02-005-A Fox Shocks 2.0" X 10.0" Coil-Over
w/ Remote Reservoir PAIR
1000.250.0300 Eibach ERS 10"long 2.5"I.D.Coil (X4)
ROCK LIZARD KIT PARTS
SS3KJSFA Skink Super Sliders SFA Custom
RMBKJSFA Rock Monitor Phase IV SFA Custom (provisioned for Currie Anti-Rock Swaybar)
TRACKBAR Custom Front/Rear Trackbars w/ Joints
GODZILLA Godzilla SFA Complete Mount Kit
w/ Belly Pan
DRIVETRAIN PARTS
HD SYE HD SYE 231
CVDSFRONT Front CV Driveshaft
CVDSREAR Rear CV Driveshaft
STEERING PARTS/SWAYBAR
CE9900 Currie Anti-Rock Swaybar Kit
BOX Ford Steering Box
LINKSTEER CUSTOM Tie Rod/Draglink with ends
OR
CE9701 Currie HD TIE ROD SYSTEM
$9100.00 Plus Shipping

CUSTOMER ADDED PARTS NOT INCLUDED IN KIT:
HP D30 FRONT AXLE
8.25 REAR AXLE CUSTOMIZED TO TJ MOUNTS OR TJ D44 REAR AXLE
CUSTOM BRAKELINES
ANY LABOR INVOLVED WITH INSTALL AND ANY CUSTOM WORK NEEDED FOR AXLES
WHEELS AND TIRES
(other accessories may be required depending on build, such as speedo fixes, etc.)
A JEEP LIBERTY TO PUT IT ALL ON.

Rock Lizard · **Posted:** Fri Jan 07, 2011 1:12 pm

I have been working on my kit for several years now, and between Ted, Troy and I have almost $50,000 and over 300 hours of labor invested just in the design plus parts and materials for both of their jeeps. Troy's jeep hasn't even seen dirt yet and I'll get to the reason for that soon. He has about 10,000 miles of real world road time on my kit, meaning, just like the largest percentage of jeep owners that wheel, it is their daily driver. If you rely on it as a daily driver, and you intend to spend any amount of time on the highway, that thing better ride like a cadillac and it better be built safe, because I always have my kids in the car with me and would prefer not to be killed because some designed a POS kit to make a quick buck. And you can ask anyone that has ridden in Troy's jeep, it is a cadillac. Since Troy's was the first, there we a few very minor tweaks to the design to make it function and ride better, which slowed things down for trail time. Also, all of us have full time jobs where our days off don't always jive and most of the local good trails are buried in snow half of the year, and for trail testing we would prefer a nice day on a local trail for testing, just in case of carnage. I have full confidence in my kit on the trails, but with this kit, I am not leaving any R&D to my customers. Better safe than sorry. Oh, and my kit uses some of the best components on the market. Just not my style to go half @$$ with crap parts. From my research, if you are spending this much on a kit, why sacrifice function, quality, and safety to save a few hundred dollars on mediocre parts. But, this is why I have the stages of kits for those that want to go that route to save a buck, or just like the thrill of building they're own jeep but they just can't do the fab work. To make the install of my kit realistic, I designed it and we installed in in my driveway on an incline. If you have a drill, dremel, and a set of wrenchs/sockets, you can install this kit. Oh, and some really big jack stands.

If you are going to do it, do it right. If you are going to cut corners, cut them on your paycheck, not on quality or especially safety. Hopefully this info helps. Also, I'm not posting my stuff on your thread to steal your thunder to drum up my own business, you asked for help, this is as realistic of comparative pricing and what it takes to develop a "safe, quality kit" as you are going to get since it is the only one to compare to.

dirtrulz · **Joined:** Tue Jan 04, 2011 6:10 pm **Posts:** 19

I pretty much totally agree with you rock lizard. I was trying to find out if anyone was marketing a kit yet, I guess I know now. We have been building suspension component for a while now and know what it takes to build quality components, dont know why everyone assumes when someone tries to come out with something new it has to be junk. Do people think we want it on our conscience that we killed someone, i dont. I would hope the developement time would be less due to it being our jobs. Being able to work on it full time would help. That and the boss has done somewhat similar stuff before so we already have some of the designing figured out, it just needs to be modded a little bit to fit this application.

Rock Lizard · **Posted:** Fri Jan 07, 2011 3:06 pm

Everyone assumes it to be junk because from history with SFA builds, it usually is junk. Unfortunately, many people look at an SFA jeep and then hear a price they would expect a kit to run, and get all excited and throw praise and think it is a cool jeep and the build was great, but to those few of us that do this as a living and have been doing it for many years, you take a quick peak under the hood and can come up with a dozen different ways it will ride like crap and/or kill someone. Most I have seen have been absolute garbage, but there are a few I have been pretty impressed with, and with some constructive criticism and some very minor adjustments, could be a perfect SFA build. Those individuals I have already given my input and they took it well and acknowledged the needed improvements. The other builds? Well, the dogs have already torn into them, I won't waste my time beating that horse.

dirtrulz · **Joined:** Tue Jan 04, 2011 6:10 pm **Posts:** 19

I could personally never build something that I am not proud to put my name on. If I am not able to build a kit that works and is both safe and of high quality I will switch my time and talents to other endeavors. The prices I had in my head are right in line with the pricing you have so I dont see Why it cant be quality also. The type of suspension I am thinking of using is of a different style than what you are running so people would have a couple of different options. I dont know why someone would risk their entire company and possibly their freedom, by going to jail, over selling an unsafe and dangerous product.

I thank you very much for any advice you are willing to give. Obviously I dont expect you to give me much. It is after all info you spent a lot of time getting and have no reason to give it away to anybody else. I have lots of questions but dont want to step on any more toes so I will just have to do trial and error and figure then out myself.

offroadohio · **Posted:** Sat Jan 08, 2011 4:30 pm

There are alot of options a company could go with for a solid front axle kit on a kj.

Just a few off the top fo my head:

cherokee/wrangler style short arm 4 link suspension

cherokee/wrangler long arm style suspension

Ford radius arm style ( sorta like a long arm I guess)

leaf springs ( doubt anyone would want them as an out fo the box kit though)

high travel 4 link suspension, for front and rear

regardless of what was done to the front you would want to offer it with a rear lift kit that gives the same amount of lift, and that could bring the price way up depending on how that is achieved.

I know I can buy a bolt on geo tracker SFA 4 link front,and 4link rear conversion kit for under $3000 without axles.
I will take a little more on the liberty becuase of the rack n pinion so I'd figure $5000 would be a fair price for a SFA 4 link conversion, and that would have to include the stuf for a 4link conversion on the rear, with enough lift to equal the front.

edit: I completely skipped over rock lizards post when I typed this, now that ive seen it, looks like we are in the same thinking for prices.

Here is the tracker kit for an idea
http://www.trailtough.com/index.php?pag ... &Itemid=53

You could go cheaper using a 2 link front suspension like the ford radius arms, but I dont imagine anyone would want topay big money for a kit like that

Chino78 · **Posted:** Mon Jan 10, 2011 12:13 pm

offroadohio wrote:

You could go cheaper using a 2 link front suspension like the ford radius arms, but I dont imagine anyone would want to pay big money for a kit like that

Why don't you like the ford radius arms set up???... It would clear some space over the front axle and may be you can do a 6 inch SFA kit...

offroadohio · **Posted:** Mon Jan 10, 2011 5:00 pm

I never said I didnt like the setup. I said I doubt anyone would want to pay big money for setup like that.

imgoin · **Posted:** Mon Jan 10, 2011 11:27 pm

Before I tore the liberty down for the conversion I'm working, I searched for Specific brackets or kits, to weld on the liberty and had no luck.
I instead went to all the 4wd websites that has builder parts for sell and figured which parts would work best for me. Trial and error for me, I have a few extra parts laying around, I will use them on projects in the future, I'm sure.
If you get it out there I am sure it will sell.
IMO
Having all the parts available and being able to sell the componets that a person needs at the time of their build would be a good service. I am not attracted to a lump sum package, I prefer to do the build in stages as my budget allows. {The CRD liberty I'm working on was my son's. I kept it in the insurance settlement so I didn't have to worry about it being a daily driver.} If I had enough money to buy the complete package, I would probably instead go buy a new ktm dirtbike.
I think the prices for individual parts could be a little more than the one size fits all brackets that I used. I know if I had found some specifc brackets and arms I would have paid a little more money.

dirtrulz · **Joined:** Tue Jan 04, 2011 6:10 pm **Posts:** 19

I already have 3 ktm dirtbikes, and a couple others, dont need any more, wife would kill me. At this point I am talking to the boss about just doing the brackets for the arms and steering and the axles. I see on some builds they used the Y-arms, or whatever you guys call them on the front, with a panhard bar. Is there some reason that they could not be used on the back also. Basically a trailing arm system. Seems they would give ample travel and make mounting much simpler. One negative I can think of would be the bow you would put in the spring when the suspension drooped. I wouldnt think it would be so bad to the point of causing a problem. Would make the kit cheaper and more idiot proof.

SFA kit price

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