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 Post subject: 08-12 Liberty Lift FAQ / please read before asking questions
PostPosted: Fri Jun 20, 2014 12:56 am 
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Most of this information has been posted in the Lift FAQ in the KJ section. However, I realize a lot of KK people don't visit that section, thus they have never seen this. I decided to add one for the 08-12 KK. I essentially copied and pasted everything from tonycrd's post. I edited out the broken pics, and changed some information to pertain to our KK. No need to reinvent the wheel, and change what is correct, so overall a big thanks to tonycrd for his original post. I'll continue to edit with new information, make corrections, and add more pics as time goes on. The original post can be seen here:
http://www.lostjeeps.com/forum/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=44037

If you have any additional info on a Liberty lift that is not already in this thread, please post that so that it can be added. Anything deemed not essential to this topic will be removed in order to maintain the ease of searching.

Liberty Lift FAQ

Since the same questions with the same answers keep coming back I thought it might be handy if we’ve had a little FAQ on lifting the KK instead of typing our fingers blue every time.

Let’s start with some commonly used abbreviations you see in most of the posts:

IFS: independent front suspension
UCA: upper control arm
LCA: lower control arm
UBJ: upper ball joint
LBJ: lower ball joint
CV’s: constant velocity joints
SFA: solid front axle
OTT: over the top / so on top of the strut / spacer lift

OME: Old Man Emu
JBA: Jeepin' by Al
ALL J: All J products
RLF: Rock Lizard Fabrications
IM Ironman
TM Tommudd

What is the best lift for my Libby? ( no matter if it’s 4 or 2 wheel drive )

The Liberty is built on a unibody structure, not a body on frame like other jeeps. Because of this, body lifts are not possible.

Types of lifts:

Jeepinbyal Coilover

OME

Ironman

Tommudd's Econo-lift

OME Econo-lift

Daystar 2.5” spacer lift


What are they?

Jeepinbyal: 2.5”- 4” Jeepin' By Al Adjust-a-strut up front, Jeepin' By Al springs in the rear http://www.jeepinbyal.com

OME Lift: just like it says, you get the OME 927 springs and OME Nitrocharger(#90009) shocks in the front and OME 731 springs and OME 60069 shocks in the rear.

Daystar 2.5¨ lift: A so called spacer lift, meaning you fit spacers under your stock springs. With this kit you can also use your stock shocks but it is highly recommended you swap the rears for some longer ones.

Ironman: Uses IM front springs and shocks. IM currently does not offer rear springs for the KK, you can use JBA or OME with Ironman rear "long" shocks.

TM Econo-lift: Uses IM front springs and shocks, 1/4" spacer plate, clevis lift(3/8-1/2") and a-arms up front. The rear uses 4" JBA springs and IM long rear shocks. This lift will get 3.5" of lift. *JBA also offers this kit with OME front springs.*

OME Econo-lift: The old econo-lift includes OME 927 front springs, Bilstein front shocks(or you brand of choice, Bilstein is quality and affordable), 1/4" spacer plate, 3/8" clevis, and a-arms for the front. The rear includes OME 731 rear springs, Bilstein shocks(again you can choose a different brand), and 2 extra rear springs isos per side(total of 4 extra isos, make sure you add them to the top). This will get 3.5" of lift.

Part numbers for Bilstein shocks:
Front lifted or unlifted 24-139168

Rear lifted (5125 Series) 33-185552 (255/70 valving 15.91" collapsed, 25.93" extended)
or
33-104645 (170/60 valving 15.91" collapsed, 25.93" extended) *softer valving than above*

Can I install any of these myself?

Yes you can. But for some you will have to take the front struts apart.

See this 'how to' for a 2.5" Daystar install made by KJ TAZ:
http://www.lostjeeps.com/forum/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?t=26190&start=0

This is Scar0's "how-to" for the 2.5" JBA lift. This is very similar to the 4" lift and similar to all other lifts, just include the spring compressing:
http://www.lostjeeps.com/forum/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=104&t=41880

How much lift will I get?

Most common on any of these is 2.5” to 4” lift.

JBA: Depends on the kit, and height the front is adjusted to.
OME: 927 and 731 will net 2.5" of lift
Ironman: Will net just under 2.5" for the front. Rear depends on the spring choice.
TM Econo-lift: 3.5"
OME/Bilstein Econo-lift: 3.5"

How do I know how much lift I get?

The most accurate way is to measure from the center of the hub to the flare. This takes tire size out of the equation and gives an accurate measurement of your ride height.

For comparison new stock height is about 18" in the front and 19" in the rear.

General rule for figuring out the future height:

Due to the front suspension geometry you get double of what you put into it. Say you add 1/2" spacer, you get 1" of lift in the front. This makes it easier when doing the math to plan out your lift.

The rear is simple, you get what you put in. Put a 1/2" spacer in the rear, you get 1/2" of lift.

What is the difference between a 926 and a 927 OME coil?

Spring Rates:

925 Light Load: 350 lbs
926 Medium Load: 375 lbs
927 Heavy Load / CRD Medium: 400 lbs
790 CRD Heavy Load: 500 lbs

Just for comparison:
Stock/Rustys: 310 lbs

Which OME Springs Should I Fit?

"If your vehicle is stock and you simply want a taller stance, fit the medium-rate springs for your particular vehicle in both front and rear. The medium springs will give you a taller stance and will also give your vehicle improved handling on the road. You will also be able to carry medium loads without sagging your springs.
If your vehicle is fitted with a heavy-duty front bumper like the ARB Winch Bar or the TJM Bull Bar, even without a winch, recommended are heavy-duty front springs. The heavy-duties are required to prevent your front end from sagging even if you do not have a winch fitted. If you do have a winch fitted in addition to your heavy-duty front bumper, then it's highly recommended to fit heavy-duty front springs on the ground that the medium-duty front springs will sag.

For the rear, if you are going offroading, you should be carrying all of the necessary recovery equipment required for offroading, spare parts, food, Power Tank, Engel Freezer Fridge, fuel and water containers, spare clothing, etc. All of this equipment weighs a considerable amount. Accordingly, it's generally recommend to fit heavy-duty for the rear."

Most of this is taken from a previous post. My recommendations agree more with Tommudd. I recommend 927 front springs and 731 rear springs. Heavy duty, no matter which application.

Do I need bump stops and why?

Yes you need longer bump stops. A common rule of thumb is for every inch of lift an inch of bump stop is needed. You can use the Terraflex (3").

Image

For the rear there are JBA’s but any DIY will do, hockey pucks are most commonly used. JBA sells 4" bumpstops, but they can be cut down to suit your needs.

Image

Why you need them: If you fit longer springs they can be compressed to far with the stock bump stops so you get spring binding (the metal parts of the coil touching). That’s not good. The spring will start to sag or even break pretty quick. They help with the rubbing of tires on the fenders when flexing. They also protect shocks from bottoming out. Especially necessary with longer shocks.

OME has now stated that for their suspension system you do not need any longer bumpstops. Beware: that works only if you do not mix their stuff with other components!

Can I fit the Daystar 2,5” spacer to a OME lift?

No you cannot. Anything above 4” needs more modifications, see how JBA does it.

How do I level after a lift / what if it starts to sag?

For the front you can fit extra top plate spacers these go on top of the strut (Rusty) or the spring (JBA) or do a clevis lift.

Image

On the rear you can add extra isolators (the rubber doughnuts on top of spring=rear isolator part #52089341AE) You can add a total of 2 to each spring max.
Image

What is a clevis lift?

Jack up your Libby, get a stand under it, take of the wheel, loosen up the clevis bolt. Get a crowbar and gently pry the clevis down. You can do a safe 3/8 - 10mm lift. Re-torque the bolt. Done.

AFTERMARKET SHOCKS ONLY: If you want to make sure they don't sag back you can fit some conduit nuts under the strut.

Image

Clevis lift How to:(thanks to Diggerfreek)
viewtopic.php?f=104&t=48731

What are conduit nuts?

http://www.lowes.com/lowes/lkn?action=productDetail&productId=75927-15527-47106&lpage=none

2 Pack 2" Rigid Conduit Locknut

Item #: 75927 Model: 47106

Steel

$1.38 for a two pack

Image

Do I need an alignment after fitting the lift?

Yes you do. And a headlight adjustment.

Can I expect any problems getting alignment back to specs?

Not on a 2.5" - 4" lift of this list.
Maybe with other brands.
NOTE:Some people report issues with alignments over 3.5" (21.5" center of hub to fender).

What are JBA uca's?

JBA uca's are aftermarket uca's that give the ubj a better angle when lifted thus also bringing alignment back into specs. They also prevent UBJ / strut contact. The ubj is greasable and much stronger then the mopar one.

Image

What UBJ do I need for my JBA uca?

You need a subj from a late 90s GM 4x4 1500 series trucks. I know for a fact they match the 1997 Chevrolet Tahoe 4x4, 4dr with a 5.7 v8.

JBA lists these part numbers as replacements:
Moog #k6292
AC/Delco #45D0062
Raybestos #500-1062

Do I need JBA uca's?

That depends on the height of the lift and if you have UBJ to spring contact. On most lifts you don't but it's a great upgrade.

General rule, anything over 3" will need a-arms. 3" of lift seems to be the absolute limit of stock a-arms.

What tire size can I fit with brand/height X lift?

A 245/75-16 will fit with a 2.5" lift with very little to no rubbing. If you prefer wider then you can opt to go to 265/70-16. They are the same height as 245/75-16s, but slightly wider. There will also be more potential for rub with lifts of 2.5" or lower.
For more info on tire sizes please look here.
http://www.lostjeeps.com/forum/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?t=958

Any brake hose issues?

At 3.5-4" yes. When upgraded to longer sway bar links longer rear hoses will be needed. At 4+" of lift, rear brake line extensions are a definite.

Front will be fine at any amount lift we can run.

Where can I get extended brake lines?

JBA sells stainless steel extended brake lines, as well as Crown Performance .

You can find more information about the Crown Performance brake lines here:
viewtopic.php?f=88&t=81956&hilit=Brake+lines

Can I install these extended brake lines myself?

Yes you can. lfhoward has made an excellent how-to for the install here:
viewtopic.php?f=104&t=80528

Sway Bars

Sway bars are on the front and rear of the KK and they keep the vehicle from experiencing body roll in turns and off camber situations. The front should not be removed unless only temporarily while off roading. It is debatable whether disconnecting the front sway bar on an IFS vehicle is an advantage off road(there is still some debate on this subject). The rear sway bar, however can be taken of if you desire more rear articulation. Rear can be removed. It is not recommended for on road driving, but has been done for years with other solid rear axle trucks. Do so at you're own risk. I have not heard of many people removing or disconnecting their rear sway bars when offroad, so I cannot say if it actually does improve performance on the KK.

Jeepin' By Al does sell adjustable, quick disconnect front sway bar links, as well as extended rear sway bar links for 4" lifts(3.5" lifts would use the same links). Some have also used JKS JK quicker disconnects. You would need JKS #2034.

Extended rear links:
Image

Front disconnects:
Image

Rear Track Bar

The track bar centers the rear axle under the Jeep.

Do I need a new track bar?

Yes, but only when you start getting close to the 4" lift mark. Many have custom fabricated these, others have just purchased one from JBA. Adjusting this correctly will center the axle after the lift is installed as well as help keep the driveshaft from rubbing on the gas tank during articulation.

What's the "rub" on Fenders?

Depending on what tire size you choose along with what lift you choose, fender trimming may be required. The pinch weld is the most common ender adjustment needed to fit larger tires after a lift. The pinch weld is in the front wheel well and is a piece of plastic about 6" long and 1" wide that covers a piece of metal that needs to be move so you can run bigger tires. You will need to cut back the plastic, not off, and expose the metal. Take a large hammer and smash it flat to one side. Use a heat gun to melt the plastic piece back in place and you are done. Some people just cut the plastic covering off and call it done that way. From there, it depends a great deal on an individual basis to cover what you may or may not need to trim on your bumper or wheel well.

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Last edited by Bmxer524 on Mon Nov 02, 2015 7:25 pm, edited 12 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: 08-12 Liberty Lift FAQ / please read before asking quest
PostPosted: Fri Jun 20, 2014 1:57 am 
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Good work Bmxer, hopefully this can be stickied.

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 Post subject: Re: 08-12 Liberty Lift FAQ / please read before asking quest
PostPosted: Fri Jun 20, 2014 2:00 am 
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Atthehelm wrote:
Good work Bmxer, hopefully this can be stickied.


That's what I'm hoping for. It'll help some of the KK guys that don't really visit the KJ section.

Honestly, I can't really take much credit for this. tonycrd wrote it for the KJ and I just edited some of it for the KK. I even sent him a pm thanking him for writing the original and asking if he minds what I did. I don't know how active he is anymore though. Worse case scenario I have to rewrite some of it and put it in my own words.

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 Post subject: Re: 08-12 Liberty Lift FAQ / please read before asking quest
PostPosted: Fri Jun 20, 2014 2:34 am 
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Here's a diagram of a clevis lift (also courtesy of TonyCrd) that I think would be helpful.
Image

Also the newer part numbers for Bilstein shocks:

FRONT lifted or unlifted 24-139168

Rear lifted (5125 Series)

33-185552 (255/70 valving 15.91" collapsed, 25.93" extended)

33-104645 (170/60 valving 15.91" collapsed, 25.93" extended) softer valving than above.

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 Post subject: Re: 08-12 Liberty Lift FAQ / please read before asking quest
PostPosted: Fri Jun 20, 2014 5:40 am 
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Is the stock height measurements correct for the KK? 18" front & 19" rear. It's actually the piece of information I was looking for. :rockon:

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 Post subject: Re: 08-12 Liberty Lift FAQ / please read before asking quest
PostPosted: Fri Jun 20, 2014 4:06 pm 
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Atthehelm wrote:
Here's a diagram of a clevis lift (also courtesy of TonyCrd) that I think would be helpful.
Image

Also the newer part numbers for Bilstein shocks:

FRONT lifted or unlifted 24-139168

Rear lifted (5125 Series)

33-185552 (255/70 valving 15.91" collapsed, 25.93" extended)

33-104645 (170/60 valving 15.91" collapsed, 25.93" extended) softer valving than above.


I'll add in this information tonight after work. Thanks for the pic. I know it was floating around, I think it was just broken in his post.

toy4everyseason wrote:
Is the stock height measurements correct for the KK? 18" front & 19" rear. It's actually the piece of information I was looking for. :rockon:


Stock is correct. My 3.5" lift sits at 21.5" in front; leaving stock at 18". lfhoward's sits at 22" when adjusted to 4". There's also been a lot of talk and measurements over the years about it. Some sit a tad higher, some sit a tad lower due to being considered "in spec" at the factory.

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 Post subject: Re: 08-12 Liberty Lift FAQ / please read before asking quest
PostPosted: Mon Jul 28, 2014 2:42 pm 
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Would these be the right ones when doing the clevis lift? I know I got the thickness right, but they seem small in diameter but were the only ones I saw.
Image

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 Post subject: Re: 08-12 Liberty Lift FAQ / please read before asking quest
PostPosted: Mon Jul 28, 2014 3:29 pm 
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nFodzy wrote:
Would these be the right ones when doing the clevis lift? I know I got the thickness right, but they seem small in diameter but were the only ones I saw.
Image



You need 2 inch ones not 3/4 inch
Yes they make them and are available at all hardware stores etc

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 Post subject: Re: 08-12 Liberty Lift FAQ / please read before asking quest
PostPosted: Mon Jul 28, 2014 6:04 pm 
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Hmm must have missed them then or they didnt have any. I'll have to go to home depot tmrw.. those were packs of 5 cause you need three spacers per side correct?

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 Post subject: Re: 08-12 Liberty Lift FAQ / please read before asking quest
PostPosted: Mon Jul 28, 2014 6:11 pm 
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nFodzy wrote:
Hmm must have missed them then or they didnt have any. I'll have to go to home depot tmrw.. those were packs of 5 cause you need three spacers per side correct?


Depot didnt have them when I went there. Lowes had them in a 2 pack.

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 Post subject: Re: 08-12 Liberty Lift FAQ / please read before asking quest
PostPosted: Mon Jul 28, 2014 7:49 pm 
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I couldn't find them when I first went to home depot. My friend that's an electrician knew exactly what they were when we were talking, he got sent there(ironically we work in the food industry...) and came back with 6 for me. They do sell them. No idea which aisle though. You need 2" conduit nuts. Should be pretty cheap, I think it was around $5 for all 6.

P.s. Tom, any way you could sticky this? That way new members could see this on the first page.

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Last edited by Bmxer524 on Mon Jul 28, 2014 7:55 pm, edited 3 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: 08-12 Liberty Lift FAQ / please read before asking quest
PostPosted: Mon Jul 28, 2014 7:52 pm 
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Bmxer524 wrote:
I couldn't find them when I first went to home depot. My friend that's an electrician knew exactly what they were when we were talking, he got sent there(ironically we work in the food industry...) and came back with 6 for me. They do sell them. No idea which aisle though. You need 2" conduit nuts. Should be pretty cheap, I think it was around $5 for all 6.


I'll go on lunch tomorrow. Luckily I work right across the street from Home Depot.

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 Post subject: Re: 08-12 Liberty Lift FAQ / please read before asking quest
PostPosted: Wed Aug 27, 2014 3:00 pm 
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Fast question. I'm going to get my front springs & struts assmbled at a local shop tomorrow. The clevis/conduit nuts can be installed afterwards right, I won't need them for when the shop assmbles my springs/struts? Also, what are the front spring isolators for?

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 Post subject: Re: 08-12 Liberty Lift FAQ / please read before asking quest
PostPosted: Wed Aug 27, 2014 3:05 pm 
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nFodzy wrote:
Fast question. I'm going to get my front springs & struts assmbled at a local shop tomorrow. The clevis/conduit nuts can be installed afterwards right, I won't need them for when the shop assmbles my springs/struts? Also, what are the front spring isolators for?


Yes, but you'll just need to take the tire off, then remove UCA and clevis bolts, then slide nut by nut on and reassemble. The isolators are the rubber pieces that the springs sit in between.

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 Post subject: Re: 08-12 Liberty Lift FAQ / please read before asking quest
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nFodzy wrote:
Fast question. I'm going to get my front springs & struts assmbled at a local shop tomorrow. The clevis/conduit nuts can be installed afterwards right, I won't need them for when the shop assmbles my springs/struts? Also, what are the front spring isolators for?


Yes, but you'll just need to take the tire off, then remove UCA and clevis bolts, then slide nut by nut on and reassemble. The isolators are the rubber pieces that the springs sit in between.

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 Post subject: Re: 08-12 Liberty Lift FAQ / please read before asking quest
PostPosted: Wed Aug 27, 2014 3:11 pm 
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NAMoulton1 wrote:
nFodzy wrote:
Fast question. I'm going to get my front springs & struts assmbled at a local shop tomorrow. The clevis/conduit nuts can be installed afterwards right, I won't need them for when the shop assmbles my springs/struts? Also, what are the front spring isolators for?


Yes, but you'll just need to take the tire off, then remove UCA and clevis bolts, then slide nut by nut on and reassemble. The isolators are the rubber pieces that the springs sit in between.


Okay good. Sooo, should I have ordered the front isolators when I bought my springs? Or do I even need them?

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 Post subject: Re: 08-12 Liberty Lift FAQ / please read before asking quest
PostPosted: Wed Aug 27, 2014 4:04 pm 
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nFodzy wrote:
NAMoulton1 wrote:
nFodzy wrote:
Fast question. I'm going to get my front springs & struts assmbled at a local shop tomorrow. The clevis/conduit nuts can be installed afterwards right, I won't need them for when the shop assmbles my springs/struts? Also, what are the front spring isolators for?


Yes, but you'll just need to take the tire off, then remove UCA and clevis bolts, then slide nut by nut on and reassemble. The isolators are the rubber pieces that the springs sit in between.


Okay good. Sooo, should I have ordered the front isolators when I bought my springs? Or do I even need them?


You're going to end up dropping the front spring assembly from the KK. That entails disconnecting the sway bar, unbolting the clevis, etc. In the end you'll have the shocks bolted to a top plate(and a bottom plate that is part of the shock) with a spring between both plates. At each end of the spring are the isolators. You take that to the shop, they compress the spring and unbolt the top plate. That lets you take the spring off the shock. Then put the original isolators on the new shocks and put the springs on that and bolt the plate back on(with the isolator).

I'll see if I can get a pic and get back to you later with it to show what I'm explaining.

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 Post subject: Re: 08-12 Liberty Lift FAQ / please read before asking quest
PostPosted: Wed Aug 27, 2014 10:09 pm 
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I kind of understand. But if I didn't want to take apart my old strut/spring assembly, I can just buy a set of new front isolators right (would need 4, 2 for top and bottom on both sides) and a set of top plates?????

Edit: Sorry, I thought I had everything ready but all of a sudden these isolators and top plates are messing with me... It's hard to wrap your head around.

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2011 Brilliant Black KK Sport - 3" OME/Bilstein & JBA UCA's, 245/75r16's & other goodies


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 Post subject: Re: 08-12 Liberty Lift FAQ / please read before asking quest
PostPosted: Fri Nov 14, 2014 11:37 am 
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Posts: 15
Was reading your post and was wondering if anyone has done a write up on OME lift kit install. I just order the kit and the JBA Arms just waiting on them to come in. Thanks

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2009 Liberty Rocky Mountain Edition
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 Post subject: Re: 08-12 Liberty Lift FAQ / please read before asking quest
PostPosted: Fri Nov 14, 2014 12:32 pm 
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Location: York, PA
Nikon84 wrote:
Was reading your post and was wondering if anyone has done a write up on OME lift kit install. I just order the kit and the JBA Arms just waiting on them to come in. Thanks



Check out the below post by Scar0. It's a great writeup that I printed and used to install my OME lift.

http://www.lostjeeps.com/forum/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=104&t=41880

The instructions are for a Dodge Nitro, but everything is exactly the same.

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2008 Jeep KK Sport - Red Rock Crystal Pearl
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Cooper Adventurer A/T - 245/75R16


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