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 Post subject: The conversion has begun!
PostPosted: Thu Apr 28, 2011 1:31 am 
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The veggie conversion on my 2005 CRD has begun. The system is designed, and will be partially installed by, Craig Reece of Plantdrive.com. I'm going with a two tank system with an in tank heater and a heat plate up front. I'm going with a 25 gallon tank behind the 1/3 seat. I'm using a computerized control to monitor the temperature, pressure, and purging of the system. It's gonna be $$$, but I worked out that it'll pay for itself in about a year or so. Plantdrive has done one other CRD conversion and I spoke with the owner and he's very happy. I'll report more soon.

-dmac


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 Post subject: Re: The conversion has begun!
PostPosted: Sat Apr 30, 2011 10:53 pm 
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Location: up state NY
Interesting........


Last edited by SLS on Thu Jul 14, 2011 7:00 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: The conversion has begun!
PostPosted: Sat Jun 25, 2011 10:51 pm 
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Did you do the ORM or the EHM? It would be a wise move. What is craig doing about loosing heat in the common rail? Does he have a temp sensor there. Remember that the thermostat is 176 degree. That usually makes it less than 160 after the FPHE. Things to think about.

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2006 Liberty CRD -- Spare tire replaced with Veg tank, semi filter for veg, FPHE, Electric common rail line heater, fill vegetable oil tank every 3 days. ORM, EHM comes out in front of the passenger rear tire. Wife has new job and 20 mile round trip to work. I borrow her Jeep a lot and live in South Florida.


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 Post subject: Re: The conversion has begun!
PostPosted: Mon Aug 08, 2011 2:27 am 
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Ok... so the conversion is complete. I have a 33 gallon tank heated by a Hotfox behind the 1/3 rear seat. I have a Vegtherm Mega heating the oil before the injectors. I am running a VO controller to monitor the system and it seems to be working well. I am sometimes getting a little rhythmic rpm surging after long drives, so I think I may be pulling a little air from somewhere. I have a few big road trips coming up, so I'll report back. If anyone has specific questions or pic requests I can post them.

take care
acuboy


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 Post subject: Re: The conversion has begun!
PostPosted: Mon Aug 08, 2011 6:25 pm 
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Is the veggie return to tank or looped. Does it get hot in the car? Does the car lean to the left with 33 gallons in the tank? Is it an aluminum tank or ploy, custom made or off the rack? Megatherm before or after the selector valve? Where did you mount the mega? Where did you connent the coolant at? How long do you flush for? Did you do the ORM and the EHM? How much did the conversion cost you? Do you have a FPHE? What part of the country are you in? Did you check the temp out of the Common Rail?

To many questions for you? I would like to see pictures.

We love our veggie Jeep.

_________________
2006 Liberty CRD -- Spare tire replaced with Veg tank, semi filter for veg, FPHE, Electric common rail line heater, fill vegetable oil tank every 3 days. ORM, EHM comes out in front of the passenger rear tire. Wife has new job and 20 mile round trip to work. I borrow her Jeep a lot and live in South Florida.


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 Post subject: Re: The conversion has begun!
PostPosted: Mon Aug 08, 2011 7:19 pm 
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So, the veggie return is looped. I suspect that I may be drawing a little air in from the filter housing and this is causing the occasional rpm surging. Have you ever had this symptom? It seems like the downside of a looped return is that even a small amount of air is a problem. The vegtherm mega is mounted on the frame rail and is thus pre selector valve. I was concerned about the weight of the fuel causing the jeep to list or sag to the left, but i haven't noticed any problem. I driven on a couple of long trips and I haven't yet noticed any heat problems in the cabin from the heated tank. I have not checked the temp at the common rail, but my understanding is that the vegtherm mega kicks out some serious heat, so I don't think I'm having temp issues. Before this jeep I've been running a 1980 mercedes 300d with a greaecar kit for 7 seven years, so this Jeep conversion isfar more technical than what I'm used to. I assisted in some of the labor on installation, but I still have a lot to figure out with this rig. Can you help me out with the abbreviations ORM, EHM, and FPHE? If I can't answer those I'm sure I could get an answer from Craig.


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 Post subject: Re: The conversion has begun!
PostPosted: Tue Aug 09, 2011 1:01 am 
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ORM is a lost jeeps things Off Road Modification basically did you modifiy the EGR valve. EHM is also in the newbie section and is Elephant Hose Mod. This is removing the hose that vents the engine into the turbo inlet and venting it into the open air usually with a 3/4 inch hose makes it look like and elephant trunk on top of the engine. FPHE is a flat plate heat exchanger. It works like a hose in a hose to heat the fuel in a small area. Once I did not fill my wifes tank for her and she ran out of grease on the way home at highway speed. Knowing her probably ten MPH over highway speed. This sucked a lot of fuel out of the system. I have two valves one for fuel veg and diesel in and a common side. The return is a common side and return to the diesel tank and return the the veg loop. My loop is on the veg tank side of the veg filter. When she ran out of veg I think it emptied out the FPHE and the some of the veg filter and some of the fuel lines. I got it running on diesel and then flipped the switch back and forth at ten second intervials. After 4 or 5 the air was gone. Make sure all of the connections are tight, If your system is new the hoses can loosen from just being installed. If you use hose clamps like most people do you will need to go around and tighten them. To make sure. My Jeep did the surging on diesel before it was ever converted and still in factory mode. I do not think it is a good thing but I can not offer up a solution.

I just changed my thermostat and it now runs straight up on the gauge. This is much better than between the 1/4 and 1/2 marks. If yours does not run straight up you might consider changing it.

How did you get the fuel and coolant lines into the vehicle and does it smell like grease inside the cabin?

I hope yours will be as good a grease car as mine is. I just drove to and from the Miami airport at midnight it was the fastest trip there I have ever taken. 80-85 the whole way there running on grease. Good power nice ride throw the luggage in the back and we are out of here.

_________________
2006 Liberty CRD -- Spare tire replaced with Veg tank, semi filter for veg, FPHE, Electric common rail line heater, fill vegetable oil tank every 3 days. ORM, EHM comes out in front of the passenger rear tire. Wife has new job and 20 mile round trip to work. I borrow her Jeep a lot and live in South Florida.


Last edited by Greasey Bob on Wed Aug 10, 2011 4:51 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: The conversion has begun!
PostPosted: Tue Aug 09, 2011 1:51 am 
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I have heard that other people modifying their crd's to run on veg have downloaded tunings to advance their timing? Is this something you did? There are some basic crd maintenance issues I still need to attend to. Does your veg line return to your veg tank or loop? My VO controller monitors pressure, temp, and fuel level on the vo side. If my vo runs lower than 15% it switches to diesel. It seems to run great. My only concern is this occasional rhythmic rpm revving after prolonged freeway running. Any thoughts? I still think I may be drawing a little air from somewhere.


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 Post subject: Re: The conversion has begun!
PostPosted: Tue Aug 09, 2011 2:20 pm 
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I was thinking of adding a Green Diesel Engineering tuning package. I met a guy a few houses down from me who runs biodiesel in his crd and he swears by it. Do you use anything similar? Anyway, I'll go out in a minute and take a bunch of pictures to add to this thread. It will probably answer most questions. Did you change your filter housing to the upgraded one released by Chrysler? Any issues you've had that I should watch out for?

thanks
duncan


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 Post subject: Re: The conversion has begun!
PostPosted: Tue Aug 09, 2011 3:02 pm 
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Here are the basic components of the setup:

1. 2003-2007 Dodge 5.9L kit with VM2, $1250:
http://www.plantdrive.com/shop/product. ... 262&page=1

2. HotFox for the tank, $209:
http://www.plantdrive.com/shop/product. ... 264&page=1

3. Upgraded valves:
And here's the page for the 3-port 12V High Flow Valves:
http://www.plantdrive.com/shop/product. ... 253&page=1

4. The $550 VOController: http://www.plantdrive.com/shop/product. ... 256&page=1

5. http://www.plantdrive.com/shop/product. ... 250&page=1

Then the tank was custom built out of aluminum to match the contour of the rear 1/3 seat compartment. My goal was to get at least 25 gallons, but it's closer to 34. Anyway, I'll throw up some pics later today. Thanks for pointing me to the newbie section. It looks like I'll have a little work to do this weekend.

take care
duncan


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 Post subject: Re: The conversion has begun!
PostPosted: Tue Aug 09, 2011 3:42 pm 
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I did not do a timing adjust. Mine still has the factory fuel filter unless it was chanaged before I got it and I think mine was late enough model that it already was the upgrade. I think the ERG is the source of your serging. Disconnect the electric connection on the top of the air cleaner and clean the sensor on the fuel rail (MAF I think) That will go a long way. I really do not want to spend the money on the Green Diesel tune, but I am all for it. The only issue I have had is it is very sensitive to flushing. Flush every time you turn off the engine. Even if it is just for 30 seconds.

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2006 Liberty CRD -- Spare tire replaced with Veg tank, semi filter for veg, FPHE, Electric common rail line heater, fill vegetable oil tank every 3 days. ORM, EHM comes out in front of the passenger rear tire. Wife has new job and 20 mile round trip to work. I borrow her Jeep a lot and live in South Florida.


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 Post subject: Re: The conversion has begun!
PostPosted: Tue Aug 09, 2011 4:13 pm 
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That's for the advice. I'll clean the MAF sensor this weekend and let ya know. The cool thing about the VO controller is that it automatically flushes when you turn off the vehicle unless you manually override. So after the ignition is turned off the engine will continue to run for another minute while it flushes. Obviously, you can start the flush manually while still driving, but it never shuts down on its own without a full purge. You can literally turn off the jeep, lock the doors, and walk away. It will continue to run for a purge cycle then switch itself off. Personally, I'd never walk away from while my jeep while it was still running! but, it is pretty cool.


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 Post subject: Re: The conversion has begun!
PostPosted: Wed Aug 10, 2011 1:13 am 
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Here are some photos:

http://photobucket.com/crd

take care
duncan


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 Post subject: Re: The conversion has begun!
PostPosted: Wed Aug 10, 2011 5:08 am 
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Do you have 3 hydroforce vavles? Do you know why if so? That is a monster tank, how did you get the fuel lines and coolant lines into the vehicle? I can see the mega mounted on the engine, is it actually mounted to the fuel rail? If so that could help with the heat loss issue that the Commonrails can have.

In the engine bay I can see a lot of hose clamps, and some braided hose. You need to get a screwdriver and retighten all of those. After a few cycles of heat cool heat cool they tend to get loose especially the braided hose. But I do not think that is your surging issue, because air in a looped system makes the motor stall.

Nice battery!

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2006 Liberty CRD -- Spare tire replaced with Veg tank, semi filter for veg, FPHE, Electric common rail line heater, fill vegetable oil tank every 3 days. ORM, EHM comes out in front of the passenger rear tire. Wife has new job and 20 mile round trip to work. I borrow her Jeep a lot and live in South Florida.


Last edited by Greasey Bob on Thu Aug 11, 2011 6:46 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: The conversion has begun!
PostPosted: Wed Aug 10, 2011 2:10 pm 
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Here's how plantdrive describes the upgrade to 3 valves: the advantage of 3 High Flow Valves over 2 is quicker purge times, which means less purchased fuel used, but also is of benefit with a VOController, since you may decide to opt for the all-automatic option when programming the controller (not only auto-switchover from diesel to vegetable oil, but auto-purging: turn off the key, lock the doors, and walk away while the vehicle continues to run until the diesel has purged the vegetable oil from the system. An unattended but running vehicle is a carjack target (even though you've got the key in your pocket and the vehicle will stall once the purge is complete) so a quicker purge time helps keep the idiots away. (And "quicker" is hard to quantify - it depends on the vehicle. But a typical passenger car will see purge times shortened from 2-3 minutes at idle to less than a minute, and a truck's purge can be 3-4 minutes at idle with 2 valves, and about a minute with 3 valves.


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 Post subject: Re: The conversion has begun!
PostPosted: Thu Aug 11, 2011 7:00 am 
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I would like a VO Controller but that is a lot of money and even my wife does not want to spend that when the one three way switch works fine.

Do you have an add on lift pump? Because mine does not. The CP3 injector pump works as the lift pump also. I have one valve for fuel selection and another for fuel return. On my first valve the diesel goes in and the Veg goes in. Only one comes out. When I flip the switch the veg goes in, instead of the diesel. For the second switch the return comes out and either goes to the diesel tank or behind the veg filter. When I flush the diesel goes into the engine and the return goes to behind the veg filter(veg tank).

We have found that ten seconds at idle then flip to diesel works the best. We usually drive on diesel for 100 yards just to get a good rinse.

Usually the 3rd valve is to isolate the lift pump so that the fuel is pushed though the filter not pulled. But on the Jeep the factory method is to pull thought the filter.

Curious.

_________________
2006 Liberty CRD -- Spare tire replaced with Veg tank, semi filter for veg, FPHE, Electric common rail line heater, fill vegetable oil tank every 3 days. ORM, EHM comes out in front of the passenger rear tire. Wife has new job and 20 mile round trip to work. I borrow her Jeep a lot and live in South Florida.


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 Post subject: Re: The conversion has begun!
PostPosted: Thu Aug 11, 2011 2:37 pm 
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So I do have a walbro pump on the vo side. The VO controller monitors pressure and usually I see about -1 or -2 on the diesel side, as it is pulling the fuel, and registered pressure of 8 or 9 on the vo side. My understanding with the 3 valve flush was that the valves were timed to eliminate cross contamination of VO into the diesel tank. Apparently, this is not much of a problem unless one is driving many short trips with very frequent purges. However, I do remember the installer spending time with clear fuel line and dyed diesel to get the timing of the 3 valve flush just right.

take care
duncan


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 Post subject: Re: The conversion has begun!
PostPosted: Thu Aug 11, 2011 3:35 pm 
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Also, i decided to pull the trigger and buy the Green Diesel Engineering tune. My buddy across the street has been very happy with it. Also, I'd rather not do the ORM mod as we have to smog check diesels in California now. This is based on a visual inspection of the engine and tailpipe emissions. Apparently, the wvo conversion should cause no problems if I bring it to the right shop. I have to say that I "have a parallel heated fuel line so I can run certified biodiesel in subfreezing temperatures and no modifications have been made to the original diesel side." Anyway, I'll let you know how it goes.


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 Post subject: Re: The conversion has begun!
PostPosted: Thu Aug 11, 2011 9:22 pm 
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I am all for the Green diesel tune. Your conversion sounds first class with all of the upgrades. I would really like to see it, but I am on the other side of the country.

On a side note I have seen one other CRD and it had plates from a different county and I have never seen it again. There are not very many around here.

Keep us updated with any issue or additional upgrades you might have.

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2006 Liberty CRD -- Spare tire replaced with Veg tank, semi filter for veg, FPHE, Electric common rail line heater, fill vegetable oil tank every 3 days. ORM, EHM comes out in front of the passenger rear tire. Wife has new job and 20 mile round trip to work. I borrow her Jeep a lot and live in South Florida.


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 Post subject: Re: The conversion has begun!
PostPosted: Fri Aug 12, 2011 1:31 am 
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Yeah, they were only sold in California for two years because of the idiotic anti-diesel laws out here. Luckily, my neighbor across the street has one. GreasyBob, I really appreciate all your input and advice. This has been a whole new level of complex from my 1980 300d. If you ever roll through the Bay Area you know where to fill up on VO!


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