SAFETY WARNING: unplug your fuel heater element

DarbyWalters · **Posted:** Fri Dec 28, 2007 11:52 pm

Yeah, and that ain't enuff to start a fire? That investigation was flawed.

warp2diesel · **Posted:** Sat Dec 29, 2007 12:01 am

You can try the trick NBC used on the Chevy saddle tanks, mount model rocket engines on the tank and poke holes in it.
I have had fuel leaks on several Diesels and even with fried electrical harnesses I never had a fire.
I will have the leak repaired for two reasons:
1) Warranty
2) I don't like leaks, they are messy.

Steve :wink:

litton · **Posted:** Sat Dec 29, 2007 10:33 am

Collectively, we just need to keep hitting NHSTA with complaints. Charred electrical connections are a safety defect regardless of the location....IMHO.

gmctd · **Posted:** Sat Dec 29, 2007 12:58 pm

Basically, it takes a lot of continuous energy to ignite raw Diesel fuel - since it does not easily vaporize, even the fumes requires more energy and more duration than a mere spark can produce - that's why we have glow plugs and not spark plugs - you would need to determine the temperature at which the plastic connector begins to darken, and at which the thermoplastic puck begins to char to see if that offers enuff energy to initiate combustion - Diesel fuel readily ignites @ ~1625degF - it boils off to vapors @ 900degF without igniting (that's the white vapors on a cold morning) - the glow plug must be brightly glowing to initiate combustion in a cylinder full of compressed hot air - 'nuther words, it's prolly the lack of ignition energy near the fuel head that lost the case

Not saying it is not a problem and shouldn't be addressed - just that it's probably not going to be won on an immediate flammability issue, as would be considered in a gasoline leak.

warp2diesel · **Posted:** Sun Dec 30, 2007 8:58 pm

We could make the argument that diesel fuel leaks that end up on the pavement at intersections can cause accidents will get us farther than going after the fire issue.
When it comes to the bottom line I don't want a vacuum leak destroying my CP3 pump and I don't want to put up with the lousy performance related to air in the fuel system.

In my opinion based upon the laws of physics the L.O.S.T. inspired Lift Pump installation will eliminate the air pockets around the fuel heater and solve the problems we are having. I will keep my eye on the replacement fuel head (to be installed on 1/4/08 ) in the area where the first filter head leaked and report my findings to L.O.S.T..

Regards,

Steve

BankNote4X4 · **Posted:** Mon Dec 31, 2007 11:56 pm

My heater connection started streaming fuel.

This truck is a labor of love. It could have been a real Japanese killer- Picture this: they(DC) make 3 minor system changes and continue to demonstrate the cleanliness, reliability, torque, mpg's and countless other advantages to the general public. Continue with the new body/ platform changes, offer it in other models, and I bet this idea could have been BIG before 2009/2010, when honda and toyota will probably blow it up fairly quickly.
At least I'll, eventually, have one of these reliable, amazing vehicles I fantasize about. And years before the general public has another shot at it

Too bad DC and now C don't have the ability to think about profit in a longer term.

At least I get a great lesson in vehicle systems thanks to LOST.
You guys rock for making this forum outstanding.
It is the best feature of the CRD, period.

warp2diesel · **Posted:** Tue Jan 01, 2008 1:29 am

Every time I talk to my friends that work for the auto industry, I hear the same tune. The management of the auto industry in Detroit thinks the public is stupid. Now days Diesel Pickups fill the highways, but for years Detroit thought no one wanted a Diesel. To spite them, I have continued to buy diesel powered vehicles and when I could not buy them, I got out the torch, saw, and welder and converted them. As most of us have found out with our Liberty CRDs they are a very good place to start. Lift pumps and filter heads are minor issues and there are many bolt on solutions to these problems as we have proven. Our predecessors who have owned Jeeps of the past will be proud of what we do to make our Liberty CRDs run better than the bean counters ever wanted. Screw the Chrysler Bean Counters and show them up for the stupid fools they are, Nano-cent Wise and Dollar foolish.

The warranty replacement filter head will go on mine on 1/04/08 as planned, when it dies, a better filter head with all the bells and whistles will be bolted on, there are many choices. If I need to turn on my phase converter and fire up my milling machine to make the filter head out of a block of aluminum, so be it, I have done it before. Cost Benefit Analysis is something most gear heads totally understand, but even bean counters with a PHD can't grasp or ever comprehend!

Steve :!:

chadhargis · **Posted:** Wed Jan 02, 2008 3:40 pm

Just picked up mine today. Nice shiny new filter head and connector on it. Even a new fuel filter.

I'll run with it until it's out of warranty, then I'll put on a Racor.

DarbyWalters · **Posted:** Wed Jan 02, 2008 4:23 pm

We are talking about diesel being pushed out as a bubble...with air. It is not a stream of raw fuel...but a small amount at a time mixed with air and forced out a small aperature...and then contacted by a spark/current. That does make it a possible fire hazzard...almost a little glow plug unto itself. Either way it should not be happening at all for many reasons.

BiodieselJeep.com · **Posted:** Thu Jan 03, 2008 12:48 pm

Golly, with the extra cold weather, I sure wish I had an functioning fuel heater on my filter to help with operation of my vehicle.

TOO BAD JEEP HAS THEIR COLLECTIVE F*$%ING HEADS UP THEIR F*$%ING A$$ES!!! :evil:

Sorry, needed to vent. I think I'm going to have to install a blow-by valve over the part of my brain that deals with CRD issues.

gmctd · **Posted:** Thu Jan 03, 2008 1:19 pm

Winter blend fuel is treated to -40degF north of the 'it don't snow much, down here' line.

BTW - its sunny and high 40's here today - a far cry from the high 60's earlier this week.............

warp2diesel · **Posted:** Fri Jan 04, 2008 5:38 pm

How I got my new Filter head with a new fuel filter today.
1) When I was less than 1/4 mile away I pulled the 10 amp fuel primer fuse and dropped off the Liberty CRD.
2) They saw the leak at the heater plug, wrote it up, replaced the assembly, washed my Liberty CRD and gave me back my keys and Chrysler LLC will pay the bill

.
3) I could not resist telling the service administrator what the symptoms were before it started leaking how it always had air in the fuel head that I would purge on a regular basis. How the air pocket caused the heater to get too hot and cause the leak and how the engine would stumble a little bit from air leaks. I also could not resist telling him that the Grand Cherokee CRD will never have the problem since it has a fuel pump in the tank instead of trying to suck fuel out of the tank, He grinned.

5) For some strange reason the dealer Riverfront Chrysler Jeep North Aurora, IL had two filter head assemblies in stock. :shock:

6) I drove out of sight, opened the hood and popped the fuse back in. :wink:

7) They never caught on that I had an electric fuel pump :!:

Steve

UFO · **Posted:** Fri Jan 04, 2008 5:49 pm

warp2diesel wrote:

How I got my new Filter head with a new fuel filter today.
1) When I was less than 1/4 mile away I pulled the 10 amp fuel primer fuse and dropped off the Liberty CRD.
2) They saw the leak at the heater plug, wrote it up, replaced the assembly, washed my Liberty CRD and gave me back my keys and Chrysler LLC will pay the bill

.
3) I could not resist telling the service administrator what the symptoms were before it started leaking how it always had air in the fuel head that I would purge on a regular basis. How the air pocket caused the heater to get too hot and cause the leak and how the engine would stumble a little bit from air leaks. I also could not resist telling him that the Grand Cherokee CRD will never have the problem since it has a fuel pump in the tank instead of trying to suck fuel out of the tank, He grinned.

5) For some strange reason the dealer Riverfront Chrysler Jeep North Aurora, IL had two filter head assemblies in stock. :shock:

6) I drove out of sight, opened the hood and popped the fuse back in. :wink:

7) They never caught on that I had an electric fuel pump :!:

Steve

Very nice. Good job.

CRDLIBERTY · **Joined:** Thu Aug 02, 2007 11:52 pm **Posts:** 72

Just changed out the filter and still have a problem. Called the dealer they said not part of the powertrain warranty ist or isnt it. I then proceeded to call national highway saftey place and submitted a complaint. The failing fuel heater causes the vehcile to stall, did this on the freeway! What is the dam fix

CRDLIBERTY · **Joined:** Thu Aug 02, 2007 11:52 pm **Posts:** 72

Hope they burn in hell

ATXKJ · **Posted:** Fri Jan 11, 2008 8:15 pm

Stock replacement is $150 (you could probably beat that online)
Racor is ~ $150 - and you have to add the temp sensor
but it eliminates the problem.

http://www.lostjeeps.com/forum/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?t=25537&highlight=racor

It's on my ToDo list - but I have the 100K warranty - so not yet.

warp2diesel · **Posted:** Sat Jan 12, 2008 11:12 pm

A guy with a Silver '05 Liberty CRD stopped by my house to chat. I looked at his fuel heater and found burning on the plug and fuel leaking out of it.
I recommended:
1) Go to the L.O.S.T. site and join up.
2) Collect his new filter head under warranty.
3) Install an low pressure electric lift pump.
4) Get his blower motor recall done.
5) Get the ball joint recall done.
6) Unplug the fuse before dropping off the Liberty for the recall work.

I cracked open his vent and pumped out a lot of air in the system and told him a lot of the running problems go back to air leaks into the fuel system. Also I told him that my running problems went away when I installed the lift pump.

Steve

chrispitude · **Posted:** Sat Jan 12, 2008 11:26 pm

7) Obtain the defective filter head and file an NHTSA complaint.

warp2diesel · **Posted:** Sat Jan 12, 2008 11:49 pm

Chrysler LLC is looking at the bottom line. Lest assume that they can hire a Local Flunky Lawyer that can't defend a parking ticket infraction for $150/ hour. The parts sell for $154 and cost $90 and the dealer sticks them for $95 to swap out the filter head.
This appears to be their battle plan:
1) Under the 36,000 mile/3 year warranty, let the dealer make a few bucks call it GOODWILL and don't call the Local Flunky Lawyer.
2) After 36,000/ 3 year warranty have the Local Flunky Lawyer jack the customer around with court room maneuvers and endless continuousness until the customer gives up.
3) Pay a good Lawyer to jack around the NHTSA until they give up, replacing 9,000 of the 10,000 filter heads could cost a chunk of change like $2,250,000. Sometimes lawyers are cheaper!

When my free replacement starts to leak years from now here is my plan that is cheaper than a good Lawyer: http://www.maesco.com/products/racor/r_spn_intro/r_spn_specs/r_spn_specs.html#specchart2

Chances are the electric lift pump I added will make the replacement fuel head last long enough to use the replacement Mopar filter I bought when I found the leak.

Steve :wink:

Drewd · **Joined:** Mon Feb 06, 2006 12:24 pm **Posts:** 902

Sir Sam wrote:

Well here is a question, unplugging the fuel temp sensor causes a check engine light, but does it do anything else?

IE could we unplug the temp sensor, and put a resistor in its place to trick the ECU into thinking that it doesnt need to run the heater, that way we would be able to leave it plugged in to keep it from leaking out the plug, but not have it come on.

This would only work if the ECU does not need a correct reading of the temp from the incoming fuel to run correctly.

I have a 1/2 watt 2200 ohm resister wired into the fuel temperature sensor until my Racor and Omega temp sensor arrive in the mail. It cured the check engine light. My temp sensor was destroyed by stupidity-mine.

SAFETY WARNING: unplug your fuel heater element

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