It is currently Thu Mar 28, 2024 4:04 pm

All times are UTC - 5 hours [ DST ]




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 8 posts ] 
Author Message
 Post subject: Free bins vs GDE bins
PostPosted: Sat Oct 22, 2016 2:46 am 
Offline
LOST Newbie

Joined: Thu Jul 28, 2016 9:55 pm
Posts: 87
Location: Vernon, BC, Canada
I was just curious how the bins that users have created here compare to the GDE bins? Has anyone compared the changes made in both and also real world experience with both.

Which is the best and safest user created bin for getting maximum MPG?

Thanks.

Justin.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Free bins vs GDE bins
PostPosted: Tue Oct 25, 2016 1:58 pm 
Offline
LOST Member

Joined: Sat Jul 13, 2013 10:18 pm
Posts: 222
Location: Harshaw, WI
I'm curious about this also.

_________________
2005 Jeep Liberty CRD Limited
-Timing belt
-Weeks 1 and 2 EGR delete kits


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Free bins vs GDE bins
PostPosted: Tue Oct 25, 2016 10:23 pm 
Offline
Moderator
Moderator
User avatar

Joined: Sat Aug 24, 2013 11:36 pm
Posts: 7157
Location: Central GA
Without extensive dynamometer testing to compare actual numbers and quantify all the different tunes available both DIY and GDE, any comparison would be purely speculative at this point... All of them have their users who swear by this one or that one being the best available, but at the end of the day price may dictate a drivers decision on what they are willing or not willing to spend to gain similar results..... :juggle:

_________________
Supporting Vendor and Moderator of LOST
05 Jeep Liberty CRD Limited :JEEPIN:
Ironman Springs/Bilstein/Shocks
Yeti StgIV Hot Tune
Week's BatteryTray
No FCV/EGR
Samcos/ProVent
SunCoast/Transgo
Carter Intank-pmp
2mic.Sec.Fuel Filter
Flowmaster/NO CAT
V6Airbox/noVH
GM11 Bld.fan/HDClutch
IronrockArms/wwdieselMount

98 Dodge Cummins 24 Valve


Last edited by WWDiesel on Wed Oct 26, 2016 12:02 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Free bins vs GDE bins
PostPosted: Tue Oct 25, 2016 10:37 pm 
Offline
LOST Newbie

Joined: Thu Jul 28, 2016 9:55 pm
Posts: 87
Location: Vernon, BC, Canada
WWDiesel wrote:
Without extensive dynamometer testing to compare actual numbers and quantify all the different tunes available both DIY and GDE, any comparison would be purely speculative at this point... All of them have them have their users who swear by this one or that one being the best available, but at the end of the day price may dictate a drivers decision on what they are willing or not willing to spend to gain similar results..... :juggle:


Sure, scientific lab based results would be more accurate but there are claims of 10% or more improvement which should be noticeable by someone driving to work the same as they always do, etc. There are important factors other than price such as convenience. Having to send an ECU in to get modified or spend $200 more for a device that may be used only once doesn't seem very logical.

So, what do you or have you run for ECU and what is your real life experience?


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Free bins vs GDE bins
PostPosted: Wed Oct 26, 2016 9:11 pm 
Offline
Moderator
Moderator
User avatar

Joined: Sat Aug 24, 2013 11:36 pm
Posts: 7157
Location: Central GA
justinmc wrote:
Sure, scientific lab based results would be more accurate but there are claims of 10% or more improvement which should be noticeable by someone driving to work the same as they always do, etc. There are important factors other than price such as convenience. Having to send an ECU in to get modified or spend $200 more for a device that may be used only once doesn't seem very logical.
So, what do you or have you run for ECU and what is your real life experience?

Any of the tunes can increase the HP & torque which will require an update of your torque converter to at least a HEMI or Suncoast TC to be able to handle the additional HP & torque. As to mileage; depends on the driver and can he/she keep their foot out of the throttle during acceleration since it runs so good?

I can only speak for myself; I am running the DIY Stage IV Hot Tune and on the interstate holding constant speeds I can squeeze ~37 mpg out of it, but you have to drive it like you got an egg under your foot. And I have repeated this MPG on more than one occasion so I know it is repeatable. Around town, high 20's are the best I have been able to achieve on a consistent basis...

But to be honest, most times I say the heck with MPG and drive it like the little Italian race car that it is! It really likes to be driven with gusto and it feels good to have all that power under your foot!!!!! :-)r

_________________
Supporting Vendor and Moderator of LOST
05 Jeep Liberty CRD Limited :JEEPIN:
Ironman Springs/Bilstein/Shocks
Yeti StgIV Hot Tune
Week's BatteryTray
No FCV/EGR
Samcos/ProVent
SunCoast/Transgo
Carter Intank-pmp
2mic.Sec.Fuel Filter
Flowmaster/NO CAT
V6Airbox/noVH
GM11 Bld.fan/HDClutch
IronrockArms/wwdieselMount

98 Dodge Cummins 24 Valve


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Free bins vs GDE bins
PostPosted: Wed Oct 26, 2016 11:19 pm 
Offline
LOST Newbie

Joined: Thu Jul 28, 2016 9:55 pm
Posts: 87
Location: Vernon, BC, Canada
WWDiesel wrote:
Any of the tunes can increase the HP & torque which will require an update of your torque converter to at least a HEMI or Suncoast TC to be able to handle the additional HP & torque. As to mileage; depends on the driver and can he/she keep their foot out of the throttle during acceleration since it runs so good?

I can only speak for myself; I am running the DIY Stage IV Hot Tune and on the interstate holding constant speeds I can squeeze ~37 mpg out of it, but you have to drive it like you got an egg under your foot. And I have repeated this MPG on more than one occasion so I know it is repeatable. Around town, high 20's are the best I have been able to achieve on a consistent basis...

But to be honest, most times I say the heck with MPG and drive it like the little Italian race car that it is! It really likes to be driven with gusto and it feels good to have all that power under your foot!!!!! :-)r


Is that MPG calculated by hand or from the Jeep's electronic display? If that's hand calculated on a full tank I'll be surprised because that's 740 miles for a 20 gallon tank! The EVIC estimates are great but they're not accurate in the real world.

I already drive without extreme acceleration for the most part but sometimes like you say it's fun. :)

Justin.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Free bins vs GDE bins
PostPosted: Mon Nov 07, 2016 5:30 pm 
Offline
LOST Addict
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jun 04, 2013 1:21 pm
Posts: 2137
Location: Utah
Yeah, its hard to compare the two from a performance/mpg perspective, but I would guess that the GDE tunes are probably far more comprehensive than what most of the DIY tunes offer. They know what and where all the maps are in the tune and have the equipment to test/verify their changes have the intended effect. You can be certain that they are well tested and do what they say. Thats why they cost money.

Although we have a pretty good understanding of how the tunes are laid out and what each map does, there are still certain things that are outside of our understanding. Its easy to turn up the fueling, but things like turbo VNT control, injection timing, # of injection events and crap like that are still a bit unknown.

An example I am still trying to figure out is how exactly the tune uses the VNT control maps. There are 3 of them and there is no clear indication(to me) when each one is used and why. You can edit the boost map and request more boost, but if the VNT maps dont allow enough vane angle then you wont hit that boost. They work together, where basically the Boost map is the target and the VNT map is the upper limit of % duty cycle the ECU can apply to the VNT control system. If you exceed the boost target then the VNT vanes will back off and lower boost, but if you are below the boost target and the ECU is already applying the maximum duty cycle allowed for that RPM/Throttle, then it wont increase the vane angle to hit the boost. If I wanna increase boost at 3600 RPM, which VNT map do I change and if I change all 3, what are the side effects? I dont fully know. It may select the map based on coolant temp, air temp, ambient air pressure, etc etc etc.

I choose to go with a GDE tune even after the whole MPPS self tuning thing was discovered, and even though I am pretty proficient at tuning now, I still would buy a GDE tune if I had to do it all over again.

_________________
2006 CRD - GTB2056 turbo by Dieselguy86, Eco Trans Tune, Lift Pump, Week's, HDS Tstat, Racor Filter, ARP's, OME 790's+Top Plate, JBA 2.5", JBA UCA, Moab's+265/75R16, ARB Bull Bar, 4.10's, TrueTracs


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Free bins vs GDE bins
PostPosted: Mon Nov 07, 2016 8:20 pm 
Offline
LOST Newbie

Joined: Thu Jul 28, 2016 9:55 pm
Posts: 87
Location: Vernon, BC, Canada
mass-hole wrote:
Yeah, its hard to compare the two from a performance/mpg perspective, but I would guess that the GDE tunes are probably far more comprehensive than what most of the DIY tunes offer. They know what and where all the maps are in the tune and have the equipment to test/verify their changes have the intended effect. You can be certain that they are well tested and do what they say. Thats why they cost money.

Although we have a pretty good understanding of how the tunes are laid out and what each map does, there are still certain things that are outside of our understanding. Its easy to turn up the fueling, but things like turbo VNT control, injection timing, # of injection events and crap like that are still a bit unknown.

An example I am still trying to figure out is how exactly the tune uses the VNT control maps. There are 3 of them and there is no clear indication(to me) when each one is used and why. You can edit the boost map and request more boost, but if the VNT maps dont allow enough vane angle then you wont hit that boost. They work together, where basically the Boost map is the target and the VNT map is the upper limit of % duty cycle the ECU can apply to the VNT control system. If you exceed the boost target then the VNT vanes will back off and lower boost, but if you are below the boost target and the ECU is already applying the maximum duty cycle allowed for that RPM/Throttle, then it wont increase the vane angle to hit the boost. If I wanna increase boost at 3600 RPM, which VNT map do I change and if I change all 3, what are the side effects? I dont fully know. It may select the map based on coolant temp, air temp, ambient air pressure, etc etc etc.

I choose to go with a GDE tune even after the whole MPPS self tuning thing was discovered, and even though I am pretty proficient at tuning now, I still would buy a GDE tune if I had to do it all over again.


I was thinking of doing a byte comparison between the two but I don't have a GDE bin yet. Have you tried comparing your OEM bin and the GDE bin? Feel free to PM me to talk more about this and share any thoughts you may have.


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 8 posts ] 

All times are UTC - 5 hours [ DST ]


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 12 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group. Color scheme by ColorizeIt!
Logo by pixeldecals.com