F37: DCX email reply to concern about torque...any comments?

greiswig · **Posted:** Wed Jan 17, 2007 1:56 am

What email address are we to use? The Customer Assistance email link on the "Contact Jeep" web site?

retmil46 · **Posted:** Wed Jan 17, 2007 2:03 am

DarbyWalters wrote:

I finally sent an email to Jeep tonight also. Tired of just waiting for them to "DO THE RIGHT THING" and give us a Diesel Specific TC and better Transmission Pump to keep the fluid where it needs to be.

We need a TC with stall speed in the 1200-1300 range. I think? that the stock TC in the CRD has a stall speed of about 1650-1700. Instead of reducing the torque and putting in a TC with a stall speed that is higher than 1800...the stall speed of 1200-1300 will apply the TC at a lower torque range than the 295# @ 1800. This way you don't need to reduce torque and you get to use the whole torque curve.

Talked to my tranny guy today. After talking with his business associates, he agrees with the 1200 rpm stall speed. Said that 1500 was too much on the high side for max torque at 1800 rpm.

Another member of the list e-mailed me today. He performed the brake stall test 3 times, and got the same result each time - 2400 rpm. He has NOT had F37 done, but did have his TC replaced in the months prior to F37. Considering the dealership involved, both of us feel their is a chance they simply slapped a V6 TC in and called it good.

Mine is a May '05 build, and has had nothing done but the filter replacement done by the above mentioned tranny shop. At the latest, I'll get out this weekend and do the brake stall test on mine. If it comes out to 2400 rpm as well, I'm going to be one pissed-off SOB - it means we have a jury-rigged V6 TC in our beasts.

Hair_MD · **Posted:** Wed Jan 17, 2007 8:51 am

Can someone pm me Sam's email because i have a couple of questions.

Thanks

RTStabler51 · **Posted:** Wed Jan 17, 2007 9:21 am

action wrote:

Is there any chance that instead of spending days and days emailing and internet bi!ching that you could all just drive and enjoy your vechicle? I mean do you really miss the F37 torque that much? If so sell the darn thing and be done with it....good luck finding a similar replacement because no other manafacturer has stepped up to the plate thus far to offer a similar product in North America.

If you did your research you would have known that Chrysler has a LONG history of shi!!!y transmissions, I full well knew this when I bought my Jeep and if my tranny dies, I will not be surprised, but I have warranty so I wont loose sleep.

Anyway, enough of this rant...if your that pissed sell the darn truck to somone who will appreciate and enjoy the sound, power and even the smell of a very nice and very unique diesel vechicle.

I spent the extra cash on the diesel engine option for towing 3500lb cars in something my other half could drive. I knew being a first year there would be issues as their is with any first run of a specific vehicle. However, the half assed attempts to address the problem was not expected, especially the reduction in performance. If the torque reduction is ONLY during shift points, etc, I have no issues as Ford does that too. However, if the reduction is across the band, then we all should have issues with that.

DarbyWalters · **Posted:** Wed Jan 17, 2007 9:31 am

For action: If you are happy with a sub par transmission and an unreliable vehicle...good on ya'

For everyone else: The torque reduction is not the real issue. Small or not, it is not going to fix the problem. The TC is the main problem and the F37 seems to be a bandage fix to make the majority of CRDs make it past warranty. It is not an acceptable way to do business and does not give us (CRD owners) the reliable DIESEL JEEP that we purchased and were represented to be getting.

bbo · **Joined:** Fri Sep 30, 2005 5:17 pm **Posts:** 382

Hair_MD wrote:

Can someone pm me Sam's email because i have a couple of questions.

Thanks

customerassistre@daimlerchrysler.com

please post any results you may get ( I know this is a generic email ... sad to say)

action · **Posted:** Wed Jan 17, 2007 10:26 am

DarbyWalters wrote:

For action: If you are happy with a sub par transmission and an unreliable vehicle...good on ya'

For everyone else: The torque reduction is not the real issue. Small or not, it is not going to fix the problem. The TC is the main problem and the F37 seems to be a bandage fix to make the majority of CRDs make it past warranty. It is not an acceptable way to do business and does not give us (CRD owners) the reliable DIESEL JEEP that we purchased and were represented to be getting.

Nope, i'm just comfortable knowing that I did my research and was fullwell aware that DC makes crappy trannies, I threw it into the mix when making my purchasing decision. If I wanted a reliable vechicle I would have bought a Toyota, but bang for the buck, feature for feature its a very good vechicle. As far as reliability goes, my last 5 vechicles were GM, dont get me started on reliability!!! LOL

DarbyWalters · **Posted:** Wed Jan 17, 2007 11:35 am

action wrote:

DarbyWalters wrote:

For action: If you are happy with a sub par transmission and an unreliable vehicle...good on ya'

For everyone else: The torque reduction is not the real issue. Small or not, it is not going to fix the problem. The TC is the main problem and the F37 seems to be a bandage fix to make the majority of CRDs make it past warranty. It is not an acceptable way to do business and does not give us (CRD owners) the reliable DIESEL JEEP that we purchased and were represented to be getting.

Nope, i'm just comfortable knowing that I did my research and was fullwell aware that DC makes crappy trannies, I threw it into the mix when making my purchasing decision. If I wanted a reliable vechicle I would have bought a Toyota, but bang for the buck, feature for feature its a very good vechicle. As far as reliability goes, my last 5 vechicles were GM, dont get me started on reliability!!! LOL

You are just not trying to read and understand any other posts. You are stuck on the fact that you made a good decision based on your criteria...that is good. The problem with your criteria is you are not getting the "bang for your buck" with this TC problem no matter how you set your criteria. You have a diesel engine that is not reaching it's potential because DC did not put a diesel specific TC/Pump to work with it. I think we all think on paper that the CRD is a great vehicle that has no equal in the US at least. The problem comes when the vehicle is not worth the paper it is written on. This is a MAJOR ISSUE and needs to be taken care of by DC...it is that simple.

bbertram · **Joined:** Mon Dec 19, 2005 4:17 pm **Posts:** 144

Got my recall done, I've put on about 2000 kms since then. No shuddering at all, shifts good, behaves like it should. I like it, it made my jeep much better. I also got the EGR valve replaced at the same time, that probably had a little something to do with it. I did notice less power yesterday. Normally I can just climb this mile long hill that gets pretty steep doing 100 kph on cruise and it wont loose enough speed to kick down. Well yesterday it would of kicked down much sooner than normal if I hadn't switched to tow haul mode.

Overall I am happy and have big problems with the jeep right now. A few small ones but its not major, just sway bar bushings making noise and the crappy rear shocks.

GilaMonster · **Posted:** Wed Jan 17, 2007 2:19 pm

action wrote:

DarbyWalters wrote:

For action: If you are happy with a sub par transmission and an unreliable vehicle...good on ya'

For everyone else: The torque reduction is not the real issue. Small or not, it is not going to fix the problem. The TC is the main problem and the F37 seems to be a bandage fix to make the majority of CRDs make it past warranty. It is not an acceptable way to do business and does not give us (CRD owners) the reliable DIESEL JEEP that we purchased and were represented to be getting.

Nope, i'm just comfortable knowing that I did my research and was fullwell aware that DC makes crappy trannies, I threw it into the mix when making my purchasing decision. If I wanted a reliable vechicle I would have bought a Toyota, but bang for the buck, feature for feature its a very good vechicle. As far as reliability goes, my last 5 vechicles were GM, dont get me started on reliability!!! LOL

There are plenty of words to describe you and your rediculous position on this matter, but why digress to you're level. I'm glad you openend your mouth (preverbially via email) and removed all doubt. You've demonstrated who you are and you're overall value to this matter.

Pablo · **Joined:** Thu Feb 02, 2006 10:06 pm **Posts:** 1201

DarbyWalters wrote:

For action: If you are happy with a sub par transmission and an unreliable vehicle...good on ya'

For everyone else: The torque reduction is not the real issue. Small or not, it is not going to fix the problem. The TC is the main problem and the F37 seems to be a bandage fix to make the majority of CRDs make it past warranty. It is not an acceptable way to do business and does not give us (CRD owners) the reliable DIESEL JEEP that we purchased and were represented to be getting.

If you are not unhappy yet, I venture to say that when the highstall TC goes out and trashes your $2000.00+ tranny after the warranty is out you might be singing a different tune. Even if your TC continues to work-- enough will crap out to cause the resale value to go down on this thing.

Even more to the point at why I am a little upset--- if the new tranny pump is crap (which we don't really know from DC, as DC will not even tell us what F37 does-- let alone release specs on parts) we are all screwed because we can NEVER put a real low-stall TC on this until some suitable aftermarket pump comes out. Even the best low stall torque converter requires fluid to be moving to cool it. If I go and put a top of the line 1200 RPM stall TC on this and couple it with a stock pump that does not flow at low RPMs, the TC will still fail. That makes this unfixable-- I can't even fix the thing if I wanted to and am stuck with the shizomatic high-stall TC for the rest of the CRD's life.

urchindog · **Joined:** Sun Apr 23, 2006 4:41 pm **Posts:** 30

Just to let everyone know...even if/when an aftermarket builer developes the right components...the cost will be around $4000 for a total rebuild....if no hard parts have been damaged up up that point. many will not sell only a TC.
i spent $3850 3 yrs ago with DTT for my dodge cummins trans.

bryan

DarbyWalters · **Posted:** Thu Jan 18, 2007 11:15 am

The best scenario (read less expensive) would be an aftermarket TC with the upgraded pump and some kinda TransGo Shift Kit. I think the problem with the pump/ect is that the stock one (original OEM) does not pump enuff at the low rpm where our CRDs need it.

Now if DC would give "us" the option to fix it ourself and get a rebate of $2500 cash...I would be happy :lol:

Instead of DC wasting time with the bandage which has to be costing them near that with parts/labor/car rental/ect., they could save themselves a lot of time and trouble in this way. Let "us" find a remedy...they get some good customer relations doing something no other maker has ever done...and they will have a tranny that works with the Diesels of the future. "Hey, I can dream!" I would pay any extra for a bullet proof tranny that delivers better mpg to boot.

urchindog · **Joined:** Sun Apr 23, 2006 4:41 pm **Posts:** 30

yes that would be the least expensive....but it makes us owners the monkey in the middle. if you do a partial component upgrade....DCX will not honor the warranty and neither will the component builder, you can't expect them to warranty the problems(dcx design problems) that are behind the TC. The aftermarket will warranty if you do a complete rebuild, if it ever comes available.
this is why DCX is only doing the "customer satisfction updates" no further warranty past the original base warranty agreement. What DCX has done is very poor business relations, but they figure its only some % part of 11k vehicles, definatly their cheapest way out.
This leaves us with a couple options...hope maybe that trans and other problems can be solved via the aftermarket at some time in the future..our cost.
dump the vehicle at a large cost...our cost. these situations are what litigation are for...again our cost, weather it be buy back or force DCX to repair them properly. or buy the extended warranty for 2k at least that will get you to 100k

I WILL NEVER BUY ANOTHER DCX PRODUCT......i've owned 5 over the last 10 yrs

DadsDiesel · **Posted:** Thu Jan 18, 2007 11:53 am

DarbyWalters wrote:

The best scenario (read less expensive) would be an aftermarket TC with the upgraded pump and some kinda TransGo Shift Kit. I think the problem with the pump/ect is that the stock one (original OEM) does not pump enuff at the low rpm where our CRDs need it.

Now if DC would give "us" the option to fix it ourself and get a rebate of $2500 cash...I would be happy :lol:

Instead of DC wasting time with the bandage which has to be costing them near that with parts/labor/car rental/ect., they could save themselves a lot of time and trouble in this way. Let "us" find a remedy...they get some good customer relations doing something no other maker has ever done...and they will have a tranny that works with the Diesels of the future. "Hey, I can dream!" I would pay any extra for a bullet proof tranny that delivers better mpg to boot.

darby,
That is a hoot! I seriously doubt it is costing DC anywhere near $2500 to do the pitiful work. I'm sure the dealers get hosed too.
But like you said, it's nice to dream.

I do have a question though, is the TC failing if the Libby is pulling or wheeling?? Or are they failing just doing the "grocery getter" routine?

DarbyWalters · **Posted:** Thu Jan 18, 2007 11:55 am

urchindog wrote:

I WILL NEVER BUY ANOTHER DCX PRODUCT......i've owned 5 over the last 10 yrs

Wonder if they even care?

I seem to remember in the 1980's that the US Government ( for the people, by the people...hey, we are the people ) bailed them out of bankruptcy...it is time to pay us back.

DarbyWalters · **Posted:** Thu Jan 18, 2007 11:56 am

DadsDiesel wrote:

I do have a question though, is the TC failing if the Libby is pulling or wheeling?? Or are they failing just doing the "grocery getter" routine?

They are failing under normal use...cheap parts...cheap result.

urchindog · **Joined:** Sun Apr 23, 2006 4:41 pm **Posts:** 30

DarbyWalters wrote:

urchindog wrote:

I WILL NEVER BUY ANOTHER DCX PRODUCT......i've owned 5 over the last 10 yrs

Wonder if they even care?

I seem to remember in the 1980's that the US Government ( for the people, by the people...hey, we are the people ) bailed them out of bankruptcy...it is time to pay us back.

ya buddy....I'll bet Daimler does'nt care...they are decreasing warranties, especially on the CRD!! while GM and others are increasing them to gain market share against the likes of toyota. What was that flushing sound i hear...oh that was the last DCX product i'll ever buy!!

as for the big 3....its actually the big 2, i'm thinking only one of those will survive

F37: DCX email reply to concern about torque...any comments?

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