Looking to buy a KJ

Offroad Assault · **Joined:** Sun Dec 02, 2007 8:40 pm **Posts:** 2

Hi, as stated I looking to buy. found a few to make a deal on. may go to the USA to get one though. I am from Canada. Winnipeg Manitoba which is 60 miles north of the USA/Canada border right above ND. I could use a good 4X4.

I test drove one and was impressed. I owned a 87 XJ and when I was done I had 33" MTRs on it with a 2" budget lift major fender trimming with fender flares. worked good but needed gears, wanted more flex, rear locker at a minimum.

With my previous experience I want to do a KJ up way differently. Here were my plans and rational BASED ON WHAT I HAVE READ HERE. (not yelling just emphazizing). I have not read enough but I have a few questions with my research so far.

1. I plan on getting gears bearing kits and lockers front and rear. first. just purchased so it is sitting here ready to be installed after I get my lift.

2. Planning my lift - will be easier when I get the truck. I plan on going sky high. 4" at minimum. I have seen Jeepin Al's kit only. I can see a subframe drop to be very advantagous for more than just drivelines. I feel roll over resistance is important in a trail rig. that will be done with BS or wheels and the subframe drop. If the motor has a mechanical fan (that is how much I dont know about KJ's) then it will be gone and an electric will go in its place.
I want to go likley 6"s but perhaps 4"s. I was looking at what I have read. this is what I came up with. if you did 2" subfame drop. After studying the lift kits by Jeepin AL's I have determined that I will study it hard as to which way to go. 4" or 6" before buying. If I have the gearing for 33" then I will try for it. flex is important to me as well. funny how sway bar disconnects are not included. maybe Al will thow them in.

3. tires - you guessed it. 33" MTR's that is the goal. and likley 5" BS from what I have read. I want the tires to stick out a bit more but you have to be concerned about wheel bearings and tire wearing right with BS.

Misc. plans - if I get to it Stereo. I want Bostons. I have a set of boston Rally's 6.5 compoent set for the front. and 767's for the rear that I plan on putting in the back like the new cherokee's did or seen in TJ's. then in the rear doors I am going to try subs in each. just little ones to add some extra punch. I am looking for a good combo for sound so doors may not be the best place for subs but I think it can be done. for what I want for bass it should be fine. nothing crazy. new head unit is a must and I hope there is amp stuffing ability under rear seat. I dont want to take up my rear compartment with a box and I am not interested in pretty looking display of audio equipment. just not my thing. Solid sound! that is my thing.

Questions -
1. DANA30A front. I assume that we have this diff. what does the "A" mean?
Jeepin Al has gears and lockers listed in rear axle parts. but D30 parts are there? this is front diff parts are they not? They also list D30 gears but they are stating not for D30A? this is my biggest problem right now.

2. What is the most that a subframe drop has been done? I am looking at no more than 2"'s

3. any other way to go 6". I would prefer 4" if 33's will fit for a low center of gravity, and I like 33" vs 31's for offroading. but I imagine since I have been talking 33" and BS off 5" or greater that a few of you might be grinching. enlighten me. what are the weak points? what can I do about it? what are the rub issues? I want to do a metal bumber front and back by the way as well so that will help with tire room. is that enough for the 4" lift?

4. I am doing locker rear and front. I will have the selectrac in my liberty as that is what I am looking for. the locker front some may say go posi but I am ready for locker. I know their will be daily driving noises but I am up for that. see how long the CV joints will last with that and 33's. any real life experiences with this set-up?

so Tires and rims $1500
Lift $2300 for 4" or 3600 for 6"
Lockers (power trax) and gears $1800
Bumpers $1500
Stereo $1500 for head unit, subs, and amps (I have the speakers already)

fun putting it all in!? $shitttt my pants 8600.

all that into a vehicle with 60,000 miles. good reality check. that is the most important lesson I have learned when you envision what you want add it all up. not sure if I should do it? how happy will I be? I already know I love 33"s and MTRs, I love a good stereo. no issues there.
how well will it perform lifted, can the drive train handle 33" and a locker in the front? Will the steering rack handle 33"? I heard of BJ problems but I think that is lift related issues versus upsized tires?

OK if you read all of this then your a commited Jeeper and I really appreciate your time and now your guidance. I have a lower level build plan if there is too many issues. Cost is one. Can I justify this build....LOL.

Dje Ryu · **Posted:** Mon Dec 03, 2007 10:48 am

I thought Al did include swaybar disco's? The A in D30A stand for aluminum. That's what the housing is made of, however it has a longer pinion than a D30. Al knows that though so I'm sure his stuff is for the D30A.

As for the rest, someone else will have to answer most of that. However, I've read that the D30A doesn't like tires bigger than about 32"

FastTRX · **Posted:** Mon Dec 03, 2007 11:29 am

Dje Ryu wrote:

As for the rest, someone else will have to answer most of that. However, I've read that the D30A doesn't like tires bigger than about 32"

Yes...keep in mind that "Aluminum" D30A is weak and can't take the added weight of anything bigger than a 32" offroad. You will more than likely do fine with 33's on the road (daily driving) but if you take off road you may want to be careful. I cracked mine with 255/70s.

There's a few members on here that have/still run 33's and have done fine. I'm not sure how often they wheel..but just know that the risk associated with a larger tire is there. Not to mention you'll have to do ALOT of trimming to fit them without rubbing. (they'll probably always rub..just not as bad)

Good luck finding a KJ and have fun building it up once you get it. Welcome to L.O.S.T.

Offroad Assault · **Joined:** Sun Dec 02, 2007 8:40 pm **Posts:** 2

On this page of his site
http://jeepinbyal.com/detail.aspx?ID=120
it says this -
_____________________________________
Product Name: Motive Gear Ring & Pinion
Product ID: D30456

Category: Rear Drive Axle Components

Description:
Dana 30 4.56 ratio ring and pinion set

These parts do not fit Front Axle Dana 30A
Price: $233.65

__________________________________

I am just making sure I can make a gear and locker change to the front diff. By your response I believe that there is front gears and lockers. I wonder if they need to be a reverse cut. anyone on here did gear change on there Liberty?

and when you say the d30A does not like 33/s I wonder why? does the case split open? edit Fast TRX answered it before I posted.

K so it cracks up. anything stronger out there?
Also my guess is that those running open front diff. are having better success. I am currently thinking of a used D30 with out vacuum disconnect custom shortened and replacing the d30a? anyone already researched this option?

dirtykj · **Posted:** Mon Dec 03, 2007 12:00 pm

The "A" in D30A is for aluminum, and it tends to grenade when the tires get sudden traction. I have seen this happen first-hand on a nondescript sandy incline (I hasitate to call it "hill").

If you have the budget for it, think about All-J's SAS job. It's not really a kit as there are parts that have to be fabbed up but the end result is amazing. You can search for arbseth's photos in this forum to see his nth-degree lift kit + SFA + gigantic tires. Made a regular 4"-lifted KJ look tiny in comparison.

tommudd · **Posted:** Mon Dec 03, 2007 2:45 pm

no gears available for anything lower than 4.10s for the front ,another reason there is no use going way high with larger tires, dont have the gearing for it.

Tom

BeepBeepJeepJeep · **Posted:** Mon Dec 03, 2007 11:17 pm

tommudd wrote:

no gears available for anything lower than 4.10s for the front ,another reason there is no use going way high with larger tires, dont have the gearing for it.

Tom

So put a 4.7L under the hood :twisted:

bugnout · **Posted:** Mon Dec 03, 2007 11:39 pm

There are some 4:10 gears for the D30A in the for sale section if your interested. Good price, and they are not easy to come by since you have to buy them from Dana/Spicer. No one else makes them for the D30A

http://www.lostjeeps.com/forum/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?t=27145

Uffe · **Posted:** Tue Dec 04, 2007 9:11 am

I have a question regarding the IFS setup of a standard KJ.

Does the front diff burst easily on sandy inclines (hills) if the tyre suddenly grabs ???

So I don't want to do any hill driving at all then?

bugnout · **Posted:** Tue Dec 04, 2007 10:28 am

Uffe wrote:

I have a question regarding the IFS setup of a standard KJ.

Does the front diff burst easily on sandy inclines (hills) if the tyre suddenly grabs ???

So I don't want to do any hill driving at all then?

The one I witnessed, occured when the driver was trying to climb a 30 degree rock wall. The left front wheel had no traction, was in the air and spinning. The driver was giving his KJ some gas so that he could advance up the rock wall. When the wheel that had no traction, spinning freely in the air, suddenly got traction, the diff broke.

I had just climbed the same rock face and did not suffer any damage. This problem seems to happen when you get a wheel off the ground or really loose traction on one front wheel and then suddenly regain traction. After I saw first hand how easily it broke, I added a steel collar to my diff in the input shaft area. I don't know if it will prevent this, but makes me feel better.

Uffe · **Posted:** Tue Dec 04, 2007 3:01 pm

Thats also some of the worst stuff you can do to a car. Was he giving it the beans or just tapping the gas pedal?

I sat in a Nissan Patrol MK 3.3TD which shat its side axle (the one going between diff and knucklejoint) while powering up a hill and hitting a lump of earth at full power.

Video Guy · **Posted:** Tue Dec 04, 2007 3:30 pm

bugnout wrote:

Uffe wrote:

I have a question regarding the IFS setup of a standard KJ.

Does the front diff burst easily on sandy inclines (hills) if the tyre suddenly grabs ???

So I don't want to do any hill driving at all then?

This problem seems to happen when you get a wheel off the ground or really loose traction on one front wheel and then suddenly regain traction.

Wouldn't a locking or limit-slip differential in the front pumpkin be effective in preventing this? If the loose wheel isn't spinning, there'd be no sudden traction. For a long time, I have wanted to install a Detroit Truetrac in the rear axle, but for offroad "insurance," it seems like putting it in the font would be better. It's always nice to have more pull in the dirt.

Would the Truetrac DTL-912A585 fit in the D30A? Summit Racing shows this part for the 2001 Cherokee Dana30, 27 spline.

bugnout · **Posted:** Tue Dec 04, 2007 5:50 pm

Uffe,
No he wasn't getting into anymore than I was, just bad luck. When I climbed it, I tried that line a couple of times, but kept backing off cause the front wasn't climbing. I ended up changing my line just a little to get both wheels on the rocks before I gave it gas. sometimes you can goose it a little to get over a rock, but this time the front left wheel caught hard and we heard the big snap.

Video Guy,
Yes I think a locker might make it less likely to damage the diff, both wheels spinning at the same speed will keep the Pinion gear from climbing the Ring gear when the wheel gets traction and breaking the housing. I have Selectrac, don't want to loose fulltime 4wd so I don't want a LSD, I'm going to put an ARB in my front pumpkin sometime after the new year.

FastTRX · **Posted:** Wed Dec 05, 2007 12:02 am

Uffe wrote:

Thats also some of the worst stuff you can do to a car. Was he giving it the beans or just tapping the gas pedal?

I sat in a Nissan Patrol MK 3.3TD which shat its side axle (the one going between diff and knucklejoint) while powering up a hill and hitting a lump of earth at full power.

The guy he's talking about happened to be me... :wink:

I wheeled the same lines as anyone else that day...and I didn't think we pushed the limit too far for the KJ. I did the same line stock a mere 5 months before that trip...it just turned out to be a bad day. I think alot of factors contribute to the diff breaking and w/ around 98K logged on my 02' and me being the second owner...it may have just spent its time. The aluminum housing is VERY weak and it just takes the right amount of force in the right area to let it go. It can happen to the best...and it has.

It's just what you have to deal with if you wheel the KJ. You'll always have that erie feeling in the back of your head before you hit the trail. Make good decisions, have a good spotter, and don't over do it and you'll be fine.

I may have been a little hard on the petal, but suprisingly I've done harder lines with more gas and never had the problem. I dont recall being on the gas when the tire dropped but I was until the front lifted...then I believe I backed out. But then again I dont remember. Bugnout was watching from outside the vehicle...

FastTRX · **Posted:** Wed Dec 05, 2007 12:05 am

bugnout wrote:

Uffe,
No he wasn't getting into anymore than I was, just bad luck. When I climbed it, I tried that line a couple of times, but kept backing off cause the front wasn't climbing. I ended up changing my line just a little to get both wheels on the rocks before I gave it gas. sometimes you can goose it a little to get over a rock, but this time the front left wheel caught hard and we heard the big snap.

Video Guy,
Yes I think a locker might make it less likely to damage the diff, both wheels spinning at the same speed will keep the Pinion gear from climbing the Ring gear when the wheel gets traction and breaking the housing. I have Selectrac, don't want to loose fulltime 4wd so I don't want a LSD, I'm going to put an ARB in my front pumpkin sometime after the new year.

For the record...you'll have the baddest, best KJ in the Midwest when you get everything you've talked about done to your CRD. The lockers front and rear will be mean enough.... :twisted:

Agh...I want a CRD!!!! :cry:

InCommando · **Posted:** Wed Dec 05, 2007 2:33 am

Just my 2 cents:

I really think that you are starting with the wrong vehicle for the mods you are planning. Read through a few hundred posts here and be objective. Those seriously off-roading the KJ with success are pretty much those who are very mechanically talented and can deal with the myraid of issues themselves, or can spend cubic dollars to do the same.

I am not saying anything that is not in other posts, like the post about Wrangler owners dogging the KJ, and the KJ owners responding. The KJ has its fine points & uses. But it was not designed to be a 4-door Wrangler.

Even bone stock, I worry like crap about that junk front end everytime I take mine to play. It really sucks the fun out of it.

Uffe · **Posted:** Wed Dec 05, 2007 6:03 am

Thanks for chiming in guys.

I'm a little curious, what did the repair cost you? Parts is what I'm mostly interested in.

Btw - we don't get to climb any rocks in denmark, we just don't have any. Rocks is probably the worst you can do if you lift one of the wheels, but if it's slippery there should be no problem as the tyre might just skid around when it kicks downwards.

Earth and sand would be worse if the wheel is spinning fast, as it grabs the tyre better. It might be a little softer on impact but it will grab hold of the tyre very effectively.

See here's another reason to drive highway tyres, you got no grip and won't destroy as much

swmpthg · **Posted:** Sat Dec 08, 2007 9:02 pm

im selling my 2003 kj renegade.. asking 14,000 for it but i could wor with you a little.. check out some pics of it on here.. just look for swmpthg with 5.5 inch lift and 33's

Looking to buy a KJ

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