Another ProVent/CCV option?

Threeweight · **Joined:** Mon May 14, 2007 5:57 pm **Posts:** 679

While checking out the Jetta TDI boards, I came across a guy making these for VW diesels:

http://forums.tdiclub.com/showthread.ph ... ccv+filter

Any thoughts as to how these would work on our CRD's?

CATCRD · **Posted:** Sun Dec 02, 2007 7:42 pm

I have seen CCVs being made out of compressed air filters. The shop kind with inlet/outlet at the top and a clear bowl with filter element inside. I built one for my BMW and it does catch some goo. The advantage I see over the one you linked is the compressed air ones have centrifugal separation and a sintered or ceramic filter element that fibers won't get sucked out of and into your engine.

http://www.homedepot.com/webapp/wcs/sto ... reNum=8125

Now to find one with 3/4" inlet/outlet. Eh, maybe 1/2" is adaptable.

UFO · **Posted:** Sun Dec 02, 2007 9:46 pm

I made one out of a schedule 40 white PVC tee, and plumbed it with 3/4" heater hose. I thought the hot blowby would end up melting the PVC after a bit, but after a 2000 mile trip it's still working and not deforming. The drain has collected about 4oz of crank oil too. Hopefully now the IC hoses will last until the Samco ones are available.

gmctd · **Posted:** Sun Dec 02, 2007 10:15 pm

Need to be aware of the temperature rating of the acrylic bowls used with those separators - the cheaper versions are rated at 125degF

The gray and blue PVC is rated for hot-water service above 140degF - the white is not

CATCRD · **Posted:** Sun Dec 02, 2007 10:23 pm

gmctd wrote:

Need to be aware of the temperature rating of the acrylic bowls used with those separators - the cheaper versions are rated at 125degF

They are rated to hold 125psi at high temps. We'll never be subjecting them to more than a fraction of a psi, I would estimate. They'll mainly just sit there with little or no stress, so I wouldn't worry about the temp rating.

gmctd · **Posted:** Sun Dec 02, 2007 10:37 pm

Underhood temps near the turbo can avg 300degF in slow traffic- avg turbo snail temp is ~600degF - that acrylic bowl melts way earlier than that - it is spec'ed for service along a wall or in a garage at ambient temps

CATCRD · **Posted:** Mon Dec 03, 2007 5:21 pm

If that were a threat there would be a lot of stuff in the engine bay melting away. The one on my BMW, although not near a turbo, sits at the back end of the cylinder head between the head and the supercharger. It has survived a few years, including a full track day at 100ºF ambient.

gmctd · **Posted:** Mon Dec 03, 2007 5:50 pm

Nothing in the engine bay is acrylic - it's all thermo-plastic compounds, with graphite and carbon - put yer DVM in T\C mode, attach yer Type K thermocouple several places over in that area - an installed EGT guage can be very revealing, when interpolating\correlating associated data - engine idles at ~275degF EGT..............

UFO · **Posted:** Mon Dec 03, 2007 6:12 pm

Well, it obviously wasn't the heat of summer, but that PVC oil vapor cannister I made shows no signs of deformation after 2000 miles of highway driving, and it sits right near the turbo. We'll see, if it melts this summer I'll make a new one from ABS.

chrispitude · **Posted:** Mon Dec 03, 2007 9:17 pm

I posted a message over in the TDI forums. Does anyone live near Newmarket, Ontario? That's where TheTDIWagonGuy is located.

- Chris

Bill.Barg · **Posted:** Mon Dec 03, 2007 10:12 pm

Check out www.matweb.com for good data on plastics properties, like softening temperatures, etc.

There is a lot of variation in properties, even for the same general catagory, such as PVC.

I want my plastic parts to be made from PEEK !

"Maximum Service Temperature, Air 315 °C 599 °F " oh , ya !

Proceed with caution, I figure.

gmctd · **Posted:** Mon Dec 03, 2007 10:52 pm

Peek is good stuff, with good electrical properties, also - think it's the same stuff as Delrin, which ignition distributor caps are made of.

Acrylic and polycarbonate has upper operating temp limit of 275degF

Bill.Barg · **Posted:** Mon Dec 03, 2007 10:58 pm

from matweb

Delrin

Maximum Service Temperature, Air 82.2 °C 180 °F

PEEK is one of those very expensive, aerospace materials. I doubt there are any car parts made with it.

chrispitude · **Posted:** Fri Dec 07, 2007 8:31 pm

chrispitude wrote:

I posted a message over in the TDI forums. Does anyone live near Newmarket, Ontario? That's where TheTDIWagonGuy is located.

- Chris

Hi folks,

I've been in contact with Mike (TheTDIWagonGuy) who is the fellow who made the very popular VW TDI CCV filter in the thread above. He's quite interested in helping the CRD community out and creating a CCV filter designed specifically for our CRDs. In fact, he's tried registering on LostKJ so he can join in this discussion thread, but it's been several days and his registration has not been approved yet. (Forum moderators, are you around?

)

He lives in Newmarket, Ontario. If any CRD owners are willing to take a trip to his house so he can size up the engine bay and test-fit some potential filter configurations, we could get things rolling quickly. I've sent him some pictures of the engine bay, but it's much easier to figure out orientation and hose routing in person. Please PM me if you are interested, and I'll put you in touch with him via email.

Thanks!

- Chris

raceinfan · **Posted:** Fri Dec 07, 2007 10:24 pm

tell this gentlman to registar again I may have accidently deleted him taking care of the spam, we've been getting bumbared lately, I'll keep my eye out for him & allow him access

TheTDIWagonGuy · **Joined:** Fri Dec 07, 2007 11:00 pm **Posts:** 3

Well I am registered now!

Just to let everybody know that I have built hundereds of the filters for the TDI's and they work very well. I am hoping to be able to get in touch with a local Liberty CRD owner to see what I can fit in there. I hope to be able to make them larger than the ones for the VW's.

After cleaning out my intake (after the EGR) that was reduced to about 50% of the original diameter after one hundered thousand km or 60 thousand miles I decided to make a CCV filter. It is unbelievable how hard that "asphalt" is to get out of there and the mess you make doing it.

I see some talk about melting points. Just to let you know there are no worries about it melting as mine has been next to my engine for about two years now.

Feel free to pm or email me if you have any questions.

Cheers!
Mike

0311_DoC · **Posted:** Sat Dec 08, 2007 11:10 pm

TheTDIWagonGuy wrote:

Well I am registered now!

Just to let everybody know that I have built hundereds of the filters for the TDI's and they work very well. I am hoping to be able to get in touch with a local Liberty CRD owner to see what I can fit in there. I hope to be able to make them larger than the ones for the VW's.

After cleaning out my intake (after the EGR) that was reduced to about 50% of the original diameter after one hundered thousand km or 60 thousand miles I decided to make a CCV filter. It is unbelievable how hard that "asphalt" is to get out of there and the mess you make doing it.

I see some talk about melting points. Just to let you know there are no worries about it melting as mine has been next to my engine for about two years now.

Feel free to pm or email me if you have any questions.

Cheers!
Mike

so let us know what you have in mind. Where you at so we can get someone out your way hopefully. I wanna hear and know more of what you did for the TDi community...

UFO · **Posted:** Sun Dec 09, 2007 12:02 am

That filter is very similar to what I built, only mine has a drain rather than a long large diameter body. Nice to know they last.

gmctd · **Posted:** Sun Dec 09, 2007 12:25 am

Those all appear to mount on the front side of the engine, on the opposite side from the exhaust and turbo, right - only constant air flow thru the radiator across the PVC?

Higher temp PVC is available, in the non-white colors, if necessary.

chrispitude · **Posted:** Sun Dec 09, 2007 9:33 am

0311_DoC wrote:

so let us know what you have in mind. Where you at so we can get someone out your way hopefully. I wanna hear and know more of what you did for the TDi community...

Hi 0311_DoC,

TheTDIWagonGuy is in Newmarket, Ontario. I'm hoping we can find a CRD member who is willing to make the trip so he can have a look at the engine bay's layout. Even an engine with an EHM or other CCV solution should do the trick.

UFO wrote:

That filter is very similar to what I built, only mine has a drain rather than a long large diameter body. Nice to know they last.

UFO, neat! It's good to know that this solution has worked well for the CRD, and shows that we are on the right track for developing an economical Provent alternative. Can you post some pictures of your unit's design and its installation for us to see?

- Chris

Another ProVent/CCV option?

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