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Stability Control Failure Caused Accident
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Author:  TopDog [ Sun Jun 03, 2007 7:47 pm ]
Post subject:  Stability Control Failure Caused Accident
:!: My wife has been driving the Liberty ('06 CRD Limited) while I've been on my motorcycles. Today is the first day that we got a good, steady rain. My wife is coming off an entrance ramp when the idiot lights for ABS, traction, and stability control come on. Too late, she's sent into a lurid fishtail and into the guardrail. Damage to the left front corner and wheel.

Has anyone else had this failure? With my Jeep already going in the shop 6 times for a screwed up power window, I am NOT a Jeep fan anymore.

Any suggestions on bringing this up to the dealer? Chrysler/Cerebus Corp? What questions should I be asking? Thanks in advance!
Author:  jason thompson [ Sun Jun 03, 2007 8:03 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Stability Control Failure Caused Accident
TopDog wrote:
:!: My wife has been driving the Liberty ('06 CRD Limited) while I've been on my motorcycles. Today is the first day that we got a good, steady rain. My wife is coming off an entrance ramp when the idiot lights for ABS, traction, and stability control come on. Too late, she's sent into a lurid fishtail and into the guardrail. Damage to the left front corner and wheel.

Has anyone else had this failure? With my Jeep already going in the shop 6 times for a screwed up power window, I am NOT a Jeep fan anymore.

Any suggestions on bringing this up to the dealer? Chrysler/Cerebus Corp? What questions should I be asking? Thanks in advance!



I am not a man of fancy words so please dont take this the wrong way
all the fancy traction control devices and other things can not control road conditions
if those conditions are wet ,mainly standing water and the jeep hydro palnes then nothing will help ,sure better tires may have prevented it
but once it happens thats it
The only thing that can judge road conditions is the driver

I dont blame goodyear for the fact that my wife was driving and sliped off of a root and into a tree
the road conditions dictated that she needed to be further to the right
I also dont "blame" my wife I simply look at it as stuff happens
maybe you should too?

The damage sucks but stuff happens what can ya do?
Author:  TopDog [ Sun Jun 03, 2007 9:14 pm ]
Post subject:  Reread!
Dude, reread my post. I'm not trying to asses blame. BUT the electronics nannies failed. The power window continues to fail (6 trips to dealer already!), other items have failed. With all the failures I feel like I'm beta testing this Liberty. The question I am asking is has anyone else had the malfunctions and how should I proceed with Chrysler.
Author:  Donnie [ Sun Jun 03, 2007 9:28 pm ]
Post subject: 
Never had a problem, and I doubt it would help if someone was going fast enough to slide around an exit ramp. I know your furious right now, but if they all came on doesn't that mean they work?
Author:  robert46123 [ Sun Jun 03, 2007 9:54 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Stability Control Failure Caused Accident
jason thompson wrote:
TopDog wrote:
:!: My wife has been driving the Liberty ('06 CRD Limited) while I've been on my motorcycles. Today is the first day that we got a good, steady rain. My wife is coming off an entrance ramp when the idiot lights for ABS, traction, and stability control come on. Too late, she's sent into a lurid fishtail and into the guardrail. Damage to the left front corner and wheel.

Has anyone else had this failure? With my Jeep already going in the shop 6 times for a screwed up power window, I am NOT a Jeep fan anymore.

Any suggestions on bringing this up to the dealer? Chrysler/Cerebus Corp? What questions should I be asking? Thanks in advance!



I am not a man of fancy words so please dont take this the wrong way
all the fancy traction control devices and other things can not control road conditions
if those conditions are wet ,mainly standing water and the jeep hydro palnes then nothing will help ,sure better tires may have prevented it
but once it happens thats it
The only thing that can judge road conditions is the driver

I dont blame goodyear for the fact that my wife was driving and sliped off of a root and into a tree
the road conditions dictated that she needed to be further to the right
I also dont "blame" my wife I simply look at it as stuff happens
maybe you should too?

The damage sucks but stuff happens what can ya do?


+1
Author:  tjkj2002 [ Sun Jun 03, 2007 9:56 pm ]
Post subject: 
Donnie wrote:
Never had a problem, and I doubt it would help if someone was going fast enough to slide around an exit ramp. I know your furious right now, but if they all came on doesn't that mean they work?
X2
Author:  DarbyWalters [ Sun Jun 03, 2007 9:58 pm ]
Post subject: 
I think the answer you are looking for is "we have not run across complete ABS, ESP, ROM, BA, TC failure". What I mean to say is I have never heard of this yet. The lights come on when something causes them (ESP, ect.) to engage. Like Jason said, they could all be working correctly, but if you are already hydroplaning they will have no effect. I hope your wife is OK! I don't know if the dealership can tell if a malfunction occurred thru downloading anything.
Author:  robert46123 [ Sun Jun 03, 2007 9:59 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Reread!
TopDog wrote:
Dude, reread my post. I'm not trying to asses blame. BUT the electronics nannies failed. The power window continues to fail (6 trips to dealer already!), other items have failed. With all the failures I feel like I'm beta testing this Liberty. The question I am asking is has anyone else had the malfunctions and how should I proceed with Chrysler.


For the power window, if you've taken it to the same dealer 6 times I'd find another dealer that can fix it right. Obviously that one is stumped.

Is the ESP broke now? (Assuming the Liberty is drivable) How do you know it malfunctioned in the first place? When ESP senses slip it flashes to let you know it's been activated. Could it be that's what you wife saw. Honestly, if your wife was going into a fishtail I'm amazed she even noticed the lights. No matter how good ESP is (and it's awesome as my wife raves about it), it's still possible to slide off the road in slippery conditions. Where you with her when it happened? I'm not calling your wife a liar, but she could have been confused.

I really don't know what you expect from us. If you think there's a problem with wife's Liberty and it's ESP I'd contact the dealer about it after the body shop gets done with it.
Author:  USPLibby [ Sun Jun 03, 2007 10:00 pm ]
Post subject: 
I might look at the tires too, especially if you have the stock Goodyears.
Author:  Donnie [ Sun Jun 03, 2007 10:02 pm ]
Post subject: 
Yeah, I remember sliding in the snow during a harsh break because of someone pulling out in front of me. All sorts of lights starting flashing in the gauge and scared me even more :).
Author:  myjeepwalks [ Sun Jun 03, 2007 10:26 pm ]
Post subject: 
Did she say how fast she was going? This one on ramp near me is super slick in the rain anymore than 15mph and you're sliding into the guardrail. Maybe some idiot a few cars before her went through there leaking some type of fluid all over the road? Dont care what kind of ABS or ESP you have it wont help with that? Just a thought.
Author:  Maximum Carnage [ Sun Jun 03, 2007 10:35 pm ]
Post subject: 
USPLibby wrote:
I might look at the tires too, especially if you have the stock Goodyears.


Hate those tires! I don't have the ABS for which I don't mind. But I would like to see pics of the accident...
Author:  Jeepjeepster [ Sun Jun 03, 2007 10:48 pm ]
Post subject: 
Sorry about your trouble and Im glad the wife it ok, but many vehicles do not have ESP and we never hit guard rails. Unless the system locked up certain wheels and CAUSED the wreck, then it has nothing to do with the system not stopping your wife from hitting the guard rail(even if the lights were on and the system was not working).

I know this will offend you, but it sounds to me like its you wifes fault. Not the jeeps. Please try not to take that in the wrong fashion, but I know you will since its your wife..

please think before you make a thread saying the Jeep caused the wreck. Of course things do fail and cause wrecks(ball joints being one of them), but a light coming on the dash doesnt mean the jeep MADE her wreck..

Again, please keep an open mind and do not get offended by what Ive said.. Im just expressing my opinions..

Also, if you read the owners manual it says the ESP system cannot over come the laws of physics..
Author:  jason thompson [ Sun Jun 03, 2007 10:54 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Reread!
TopDog wrote:
Dude, reread my post. I'm not trying to asses blame. BUT the electronics nannies failed. The power window continues to fail (6 trips to dealer already!), other items have failed. With all the failures I feel like I'm beta testing this Liberty. The question I am asking is has anyone else had the malfunctions and how should I proceed with Chrysler.




I feel your pain
when we first got our '03 we could not drive in the rain ,and we live in south Louisiana, it would not go just spin the wheels ,that sucked
after much debate and fighting with DCX and Goodyear we got 5 new tires
we how ever do not have ESP or stuff like that but we do have our share of minior problems
we have a rear seat that just stays down because when it is up it rattles ,dealer could only make it stop for a few dys at a time
and I took it to 3 different ones
The ABS light will come on if you slam on breaks some times or if the sensor gets wet/muddy
Traction control and stability control lights come on when they are active ,I think
Knowing that I would bet that the ABS sensor was wet causing a malfunction and ABS may not have been working
how ever the other 2 were this would answer why the lights came on
Like I tell my wife
You drive the car the car should never drive you it can not see what is down the road only respond to the current conditions

Again this sucks for you I know but stuff ahppens
Author:  Tokyojoe [ Sun Jun 03, 2007 11:14 pm ]
Post subject: 
Lemon law seems to be awfully close or already in effect.
Author:  Northbee [ Mon Jun 04, 2007 7:58 am ]
Post subject: 
If the lights came on - the system worked! Traction control lights mean that the system is actually working.

So there seems to be no error there!

But traction control can't overcome the laws of physics!

Thank god your wife is ok - but I think she was too fast for the kind of curve, the road condition and the tires mounted .... the mixture of all these factors caused the crash.
Author:  DarbyWalters [ Mon Jun 04, 2007 12:30 pm ]
Post subject: 
I just found this TSB for 3.7L Commanders and might be the same for KJs:

TSB 18-028-07 FLASH: 3.7L - Momentary Premature Activation Of The Traction Control System.
Author:  elephantrider [ Mon Jun 04, 2007 12:49 pm ]
Post subject: 
MOOSE !!!

Did you see this ? Its a little late now, but maybe some piece of mind that your not crazy in the head !
Author:  Big D [ Mon Jun 04, 2007 5:06 pm ]
Post subject: 
Hope everyone involved is ok.

When they hook up the computer, they can tell you whether all the systems functioned correctly. They do fail but in very, very rare cases.

As a side note, no amount of computing power can change the laws of physics. All thou the systems are there to stop it from happening, it is still possible to reach a point beyond where the computer can bring the vehicule back under control.
Author:  JimJ [ Mon Jun 04, 2007 7:29 pm ]
Post subject: 
Was your 06 part of the F50 ABS control module recall. Quote from recall notice:

The problem: The software programmed into the ABS control module on your vehicle (vin :XXX) may cause the rear brakes to lock up during certain braking conditions. This could result in a loss of control and cause a crash without warning.
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