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Cash For Clunkers Conspiracy?
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Author:  warp2diesel [ Tue Sep 08, 2009 7:56 am ]
Post subject:  Cash For Clunkers Conspiracy?
Truth, what more can I say.


Cash For Clunkers Conspiracy?

by John McElroy



To hear the government tell it, foreign automakers and compact cars were the big winners in the Cash for Clunkers program. The Department of Transportation makes it look like consumers all wanted small fuel-efficient cars, particularly from the import brands.



But an analysis by Edmunds.com tells a very different story. It found that a fair number of Clunker buyers bought pickups and Ford came out as the clear winner in the Top Ten list. Indeed, Edmunds' analysis shows that the government came up with a bizarre way to count Clunker sales and we know now that the DOT counted sales based on the drivetrain in a vehicle, not by its nameplate. For example, the front-wheel drive version of the Ford Escape was counted separately from the all-wheel drive version. As a result, vehicles that only offer one drivetrain came out on the top of the list.



No one in the history of the auto industry has ever counted sales this way, and it's mighty peculiar why the government would choose to do so. Is there some other agenda at work?



Once again, the story is the Detroit Three got there butts kicked by the import brands. The way that Edmunds counted sales shows a very different story from the government's numbers. In its report, Ford captured three of the top four positions. The Toyota Corolla, which is at the top of the government's list, falls to number five on Edmunds' list behind the F-150, which didn't even make the government's Top Ten. The Chevy Silverado didn't make the government's Top Ten either, but it's number eight with Edmunds.



The downside is that all around the country the media hammered home the DOT's version of events. Once again, the story is the Detroit Three got there butts kicked by the import brands.



The other story line that the DOT trumpeted is that consumers traded in their dirty old SUVs and bought fuel-efficient, front-wheel-drive compact cars. Boy, doesn't that just dovetail beautifully with the environmental message the Administration wants to send out about the success of this program? But Edmunds' analysis tells a truer story. It shows that full-size pickups and compact SUVs were popular choices in the Clunkers program.



The explanation I've been given is that the way the DOT counted sales is more in line with the different EPA weight-class categories. But that still doesn't make sense. Again, the auto industry has never reported sales by EPA weight-class.



And there are other problems with the DOT numbers, too. It shows that there were more Clunker trade-ins than new vehicles sold. Think about that a minute. How could people possibly trade in more cars than they bought?



How could people possibly trade in more cars than they bought? But the biggest puzzle of all is why the Detroit Three have not said peep about this. Presumably, GM and Chrysler are afraid to bite the hand of the government that just bailed them out. And maybe Ford is just afraid to stir the pot. But they're doing themselves a great disservice by letting this misperception go unchallenged. And if anyone needs to change perceptions, they do.



Top Clunker Sales According to DOT



1. Toyota Corolla

2. Honda Civic

3. Toyota Camry

4. Ford Focus FWD

5. Hyundai Elantra

6. Nissan Versa

7. Toyota Prius

8. Honda Accord

9. Honda Fit

10. Ford Escape FWD



Top Clunker Sales According to Edmunds



1. Ford Focus

2. Ford Escape

3. Honda Civic

4. Ford F-150

5. Toyota Corolla

6. Toyota Camry

7. Honda CR-V

8. Chevrolet Silverado

9. Hyundai Elantra

10. Honda Accord
Author:  lil black liberty [ Tue Sep 08, 2009 11:00 am ]
Post subject: 
Not supposed to get into politics too deep.. but I will say this I do agree.. Just remember this though Who feeds america? (Oil Companies sell oil to make Gas, Gas goes in your car, Gas is controlled by the government and the auto industry is also ran by the government. When you buy a car you are buying a tri-facta of america. Think about it from this perspective)

Banks give loans (Federally Regulated)
Loan buys Car (Government Mandated)
Car needs OIL and Gas (Again Government Controlled)

So what I'm getting at is when you buy a car it goes so to speak in a three part pyramid with the government being top tier. Goes like this Government - Oil/Gas Companies - Auto Industry. Not only do you pay taxes twice but you pay it alot more than you think and also you're giving the government more money when you buy a car. The auto industry is in bed with the oil/gas companies which are in bed with the government.. I'm just waiting for the day it goes Health Insurance - Doctors - Government.. Then we will achieve this Socialist ideal of Communist America.. I mean Russia :roll: :lol:
Author:  TAHOE [ Tue Sep 08, 2009 12:28 pm ]
Post subject: 
It really doesn't matter to me about what cars made the top ten, everyone including the govmt has their own opinions/results. My retired mother, who watches plenty of news channels, told me the other day, all those people who got the 3500 or 4500 for their clunkers have to file that on next years taxes as a capital gain..... how many people didn't know about that one????
So they give it too ya up front, then get some of it back on the back end...wonderful gov'ment at work!
Author:  Diggerfreek [ Tue Sep 08, 2009 12:32 pm ]
Post subject: 
Image
Author:  jeepskate [ Tue Sep 08, 2009 12:34 pm ]
Post subject: 
OK, since we're all about facts, here's one straight from the government's official CARS program website:

Is the credit subject to being taxed as income to the consumers that participate in the program?

NO. The CARS Act expressly provides that the credit is not income for the consumer.

That's for federal taxes. You *might* have state sales tax on the amount of the credit. Depends on the state.

Here's the link to the FAQ: http://www.cars.gov/faq#category-06
Author:  Fulltimer [ Tue Sep 08, 2009 1:27 pm ]
Post subject: 
There is a "Big Brother" behind everything if you look hard enough. Maybe your right. I didn't read it yet. I just laughed. I will read it later, I only have about 1 minute before I have to get to the dentist. Maybe the filling has a tracking device for the government in it! :shock:

Terry
Author:  Albert [ Tue Sep 08, 2009 1:38 pm ]
Post subject: 
Warp......interesting stuff. I am still digesting it.

But in general, I don't subscribe to the theory of everything being a conspiracy. I think that you can twist figures around to make them come out to any result you desire. This is done all the time by all goverments, corporations, etc..

This does spin a new view of the C for C results though, and I believe a more truer picture of what actually happened.

Just my opinion.
Author:  lil black liberty [ Tue Sep 08, 2009 1:49 pm ]
Post subject: 
I agree with Albert as well, but considering we are emerging into a "new" america shouldn't we have politics that are about truth and justice? Not Corruption and Greed?
Author:  ATXKJ [ Tue Sep 08, 2009 8:29 pm ]
Post subject: 
you should never attribute to conspiracy that which can be explained by incompetence and bureaucracy

it's only September - the Government is still counting paperwork -

I wouldn't expect a final total until end of the year.


Okay maybe I should be less cynical
Actually 538 did a statistical analysis - the failure was that only a small percentage of 'American' cars even qualified for the program - so if anything they actually over performed vs the number of cars that qualified.
http://www.fivethirtyeight.com/2009/08/ford-is-also-trading-in-its-clunkers.html
Author:  TAHOE [ Tue Sep 08, 2009 9:59 pm ]
Post subject: 
jeepskate wrote:
OK, since we're all about facts, here's one straight from the government's official CARS program website:

Is the credit subject to being taxed as income to the consumers that participate in the program?

NO. The CARS Act expressly provides that the credit is not income for the consumer.

That's for federal taxes. You *might* have state sales tax on the amount of the credit. Depends on the state.

Here's the link to the FAQ: http://www.cars.gov/faq#category-06


I just went on what my mom told me, obviously I stand corrected
I'm not clicking on that link....I remember a recent post about the cars website give the government permission to your computer if they so chose to???
Author:  L.O. [ Mon Sep 21, 2009 11:25 am ]
Post subject: 
Hot darn!! Another government conspiracy! Time to fuel up those black helicopters and tune in Glenn Beck.
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