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NJ Pine Barrens – ever been there?
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Author:  scoobysnax [ Mon Sep 24, 2007 11:00 am ]
Post subject:  NJ Pine Barrens – ever been there?
I’m thinking of heading down there in a few weeks and I want to know what I’m in for? I have a stock Liberty with 235/70/16 tires. No lockers, no tow hooks, full size spare. I would be heading down there with 2 other guys. One has a ‘94 stock Wrangler also with pretty small tires (I think they are even worse, maybe the 215/65/15 combo?) and the other has a VW Touareg with the air suspension. He’s got all the factory options but no aftermarket stuff (he might have front a rear lockers from VW.)

The only things we’ll really have in our bag of tricks are tow straps and an air pump, a shovel and my good looks.

So will we be in over our heads? I’ve read that there is lots of water and lots of mud but I’ve also heard that you can drive around 95% of those traps. We’ll probably turn around for the other 5% if it’s deeper than the tops of our axles.

Should we not even bother if we’re just stock or will we be fine so long as we’re practical and use good judgment? Finally, how are the trails laid out, are they marked at all? Is there a trail map I can buy somewhere?
Author:  David Jr [ Mon Sep 24, 2007 7:20 pm ]
Post subject: 
I've been wheeling out there for many years and never got stuck once. Yes you can drive around the "puddles" but where's the fun in that? I have not encountered a puddle yet that could stop my Libby. Virtually all of it is packed sand with some loose sand here and there but if you drive through that wisely it won't stop you.

As far as trail maps, go to the ranger station at Four mile Circle in Southampton, Burlington County. They should have them. I've never needed them myself, i used USGS Maps that i got at a local map store. Also use google Maps in Satellite view.

One stop i recommend is Apple Pie Hill, near Chatsworth in Woodland TWP. There is a fire tower on the hill that provides a great view of South Jersey. You are allowed to climb the tower so long as you don't try to burn it down. You can see Atlantic City and Philly from there on a clear day.

oh BTW, tell you buddy with the VW to keep the local tow truck drivers number on speed dial, he's gonna need it. :lol:

2. No Alcohol.
Author:  MULE [ Mon Sep 24, 2007 10:45 pm ]
Post subject: 
I'm sorry, I just have to reply. The Pine Barrons will not be like an off road adventure through Central Park. Tow straps with no tow hooks? Don't forget your snorkle, mask and fins. You'll need them to find a spot to hook the straps to, under the water. While the water slowly seeps inside your Jeep. Water? Not talking just puddles here! Sure, there are bi-passes around most tough spots. But as David sez, where's the fun! Tow hooks are basic equipment. The Pine's are very beautiful though, lots of sand trails, the best Jersey has to offer. But be prepared! Check out this website for a good look at off roading in the Pines. N.J. has their Jeep Jamborrees down there. Been to two of them. www.jeeptales.com Click on past events, click on Pine Barrons 06. When you go, have fun, be safe, get back to NYC in one piece. And most of all.... Respect the Pines.
Author:  scoobysnax [ Tue Sep 25, 2007 11:24 pm ]
Post subject: 
I’m asking the questions now so I don’t get in over my head later. I thank you for your answers and the Jeep Tails site offered some helpful info (and pics/videos) but I also hope you’re not thinking I’m planning on running in there thinking I can tackle anything in a stock jeep, again that’s why I’m asking the questions in the first place. Yes I realize it’ll be a little more than Central Park, thanks for pointing that out.

The fun in bypassing a “puddle” is that you’ll make it to the other side. If I don’t have tow hooks right now (or a lift/lockers/aggressive tires/etc) it would be foolish of me to run into a deep water trap with no exit plan once I’m stuck.

The post from that website mentioned that it had rained for a few weeks prior to the running. Has anyone gone after it’s been dry for a while? Can I assume that all of the large water hazards would just become deep mud holes with little to no standing water? Or would I find more sand and less mud? Are there still ways to go around all this stuff or at some point will I have to take the plunge so to speak?

Regarding the sand, are we talking deep loose sand which I have dealt with before in access paths to beaches or this a new sand on top of mud that’s a bit more like quick-sand when you have 4,000 lbs spread out on 4-wheels?

Are the trail ruts something a stock Liberty can handle or will I be dragging my underbody?

Thanks for any insight!
Author:  David Jr [ Wed Sep 26, 2007 6:54 pm ]
Post subject: 
The trails are mostly hard pack sand, very little loose sand, except around the Batsto river area. If it hasn't rained in a while the puddles just dry up, not much mud at all. It will be no problem to go around them if you want/need to. No deep ruts that i know of so you won't be draggin you chassie much. I've seen small cars with stock suspensions negotiate the trails just fine.
Author:  myjeepwalks [ Thu Sep 27, 2007 2:08 am ]
Post subject: 
Lots of fun back there. You can easily spend a day there roaming the trails and unexpectedly spend the night if you get stuck. Trust me it's happened to me since my dumb booty buddies burried their trucks in a stream right off the main trail. When morning came around and the rangers showed up they didn't like that too much and both owners of the trucks got $750 each in fines. Anyway if you dont know how deep the hole is check it out first and stay OUT of the streams!!!! And dont get caught with alcohol. The rangers aren't security guards they are police and they dont take any stinky poo. :wink: The place is huge i've gotten lost before. I hope to get back down there sometime soon. Havent been there since i put my lift on. :x
Author:  David Jr [ Thu Sep 27, 2007 8:02 pm ]
Post subject: 
This reminds me of a very funny incident on Apple Pie Hill many, many years ago :lol:

I was hanging out on the hill in my 75 Dodge Charger watching some idiots in Chevy blazers TRY to climb up the hill on one of the unofficial trails. the trail is pretty steep and you could heard the axles and transfer cases snapping happily away. I drove down to where they were and asked them if they even knew how to drive their trucks, much less climb up the steep trail. They told me if i could do better then i was invited to try. i drove my Charger all the way up that trail to the top of the hill, then got out and offered to teach them how it is really done. After watching their jaws hit the sand, i went down and drove 2 of the Chevys that could still move up that trail and then gave them a lecture on proper hill climbing technique. :lol:
Author:  myjeepwalks [ Sat Sep 29, 2007 2:00 am ]
Post subject: 
David Jr wrote:
This reminds me of a very funny incident on Apple Pie Hill many, many years ago :lol:

I was hanging out on the hill in my 75 Dodge Charger watching some idiots in Chevy blazers TRY to climb up the hill on one of the unofficial trails. the trail is pretty steep and you could heard the axles and transfer cases snapping happily away. I drove down to where they were and asked them if they even knew how to drive their trucks, much less climb up the steep trail. They told me if i could do better then i was invited to try. i drove my Charger all the way up that trail to the top of the hill, then got out and offered to teach them how it is really done. After watching their jaws hit the sand, i went down and drove 2 of the Chevys that could still move up that trail and then gave them a lecture on proper hill climbing technique. :lol:


Nice!!!
Author:  scoobysnax [ Mon Oct 15, 2007 5:57 pm ]
Post subject: 
So I might head over there the in a couple of weeks. I know they got a lot of rain last week (I heard as much as 2-4 inches. Has anyone been there recently that can tell how the trail conditions were? If I’m going to be riding around (getting stuck) in mud all day I’m not sure it makes sense to go. I’ve got a stock ride so I can’t handle too much water and certainly not a lot of mud with my stock tires.
Author:  MULE [ Fri Oct 26, 2007 2:57 pm ]
Post subject: 
I hope you make the trip. Let us know how you did. My first Jeep Jam down in the Pines, I had the stock Goodyear Eagles with no lockers. And, yes, I got stuck. Your Liberty is a capable machine. Don't let all the improvements in Jeeps fool you. Driving technique is a BIG part of getting accross the trail. Learn what YOU can do with your jeep and can"t do. If the ruts cause you to high side, keep a tire out of the rut, It might cost you some tree scratches (Pineland Pinstripes). Water hole too deep? Get out, put boots on and walk it. There are alot of trails and much of it is passable. Have fun!
Author:  myjeepwalks [ Sat Oct 27, 2007 12:32 am ]
Post subject: 
scoobysnax wrote:
So I might head over there the in a couple of weeks. I know they got a lot of rain last week (I heard as much as 2-4 inches. Has anyone been there recently that can tell how the trail conditions were? If I’m going to be riding around (getting stuck) in mud all day I’m not sure it makes sense to go. I’ve got a stock ride so I can’t handle too much water and certainly not a lot of mud with my stock tires.


Was just there last night. Main trails are fine. Once you wander off on side trails that's where the mud is. Bring a gps so you can find your way out. I didn't venture off the main trail because i it was dark and i was by myself. If i got stuck i'd be sleeping there overnight. Did that once before, never again. :wink:
Author:  scoobysnax [ Tue Nov 13, 2007 2:49 pm ]
Post subject: 
So it finally looks like I'll be going there this weekend to do some camping. A few people mentioned no drinking, but I'm assuming that's on the trails right? I can still have a beer around the camp fire at the end of the day right?
Author:  David Jr [ Tue Nov 13, 2007 8:46 pm ]
Post subject: 
one of my jobs involves picking up 8 toters full of cans and bottles at the ranger station at 4 Mile. Based on what i've seen in those toters i'd say you can do that. BTW I work for OTC in the recycling collections dept.
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