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Guess what I'm picking up!
http://www.lostjeeps.com/forum/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=81892		 Page 1 of 2
Author:  WhitbyKJ [ Tue Apr 21, 2015 12:27 pm ]
Post subject:  Guess what I'm picking up!
(Still waiting for news on the bracket FYI)

Guess what I'm buying tomorrow!!!

Paying 40 bucks for it.

:)

Ps, is there anything you Gus want me to design/make that isn't available yet?
Author:  Rotor [ Tue Apr 21, 2015 12:54 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Guess what I'm picking up!
Front Coilover brackets.
Author:  WhitbyKJ [ Tue Apr 21, 2015 1:43 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Guess what I'm picking up!
Upper or lower?

You guys do realize it prob costs about 50 bucks to turn a regular coilover into one useable on our trucks.

Make a clevis, thread the top. Tread the shaft of the shock. Thread the clevis onto the shock... Weld. Makin the top plate is even easier than that!
Author:  WhitbyKJ [ Tue Apr 21, 2015 1:45 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Guess what I'm picking up!
But no... I'm not buying brackets.

It will need brackets however....
Author:  WhitbyKJ [ Tue Apr 21, 2015 1:55 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Guess what I'm picking up!
Hint: it's used and needs cutting
Author:  Rotor [ Tue Apr 21, 2015 4:03 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Guess what I'm picking up!
used Dana 30 l.p.?

As for the Brackets for front coil overs. I don't think there is much to them and I know a few people have made them. That's why I'm a little surprised no one else besides JBA makes them.
Author:  WhitbyKJ [ Tue Apr 21, 2015 5:41 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Guess what I'm picking up!
Bingo!!

Gonna be making a bracket kit, so you boys at home can enjoy a jy lp30 (that comes with 3.73 gears).

Don't worry, It won't be anything like you've seen.
Author:  WhitbyKJ [ Tue Apr 21, 2015 5:41 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Guess what I'm picking up!
I am aiming for a "bolt on" DIY kit... But no promises.
Author:  tommudd [ Tue Apr 21, 2015 8:48 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Guess what I'm picking up!
Rotor wrote:
used Dana 30 l.p.?

As for the Brackets for front coil overs. I don't think there is much to them and I know a few people have made them. That's why I'm a little surprised no one else besides JBA makes them.



Not worth the R&D for bigger companies to even spend the time on it thats why, simple
Author:  WhitbyKJ [ Wed Apr 22, 2015 7:07 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Guess what I'm picking up!
Sure it is....

The ONLY jeep sold nowadays with the sfa is a wrangler... The rest.. Are ifs.

Even the trucks.

The question boils down to. In ten years, when all the bodies rot off the sfa rigs and all that's left are ifs rigs dominating the market, do you want to be AHEAD of the curve or BEHIND it?
Author:  tommudd [ Wed Apr 22, 2015 8:39 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Guess what I'm picking up!
In our minds possibly but not in the major manufacturers
I was at one company talking to the President of it about lifts etc, (they have a KJ lift but not well put together )
But asked why there wasn't something better for the Liberty world and was told why invest in a market where you may sell 5 a month when they can sell 100s for a JK/ TJ/ Ford Pickups/ etc
The Liberty market is so small that not many want to take the time to do anything at all
10% or less even upgrade their suspensions I'd bet and that includes spacer crappy lifts
Author:  WhitbyKJ [ Wed Apr 22, 2015 12:43 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Guess what I'm picking up!
I think we're both saying the same thing here.

Yes the kj market is small.

But the only vehicles being sold in our class with Ada's are the wrangler.

Look at the ram 1500/2500 (my brother just bought one), the Chevy/gmc 1500/2500, the new Cherokee, the grand Cherokee, explorer, kj, kk, wk, blazer, jimmy, ranger (sort of), I can sit here all day... They are ifs, some even ifs.

For me to design a bracket for each one, would probably cost 30 bucks and a trip tithe wreckers, per vehicle.

These companies are afraid!! They get into a groove, make some money and fear change. It's.not just the offroad market that is like that, everywhere is. Like my civi job, we know what works and we have ideas about improving things, but fear the unknown.

I don't fear the unknown. I have nothing to lose.

The IRO swap for example, totally happened by accident . What do ya know? People want it.

Again, with the steel axle I just picked up, from it I will gain worlds of knowledge (that I will share) and possibly propel others, more skilled than myself to create something stronger. Like an ifs long travel kit with a dana44? People could be running full widths before you know it.

Simple problems/simple solutions. It's up to people like you and I (Tom), and every other member of LOST to start making noise. Out there somewhere is a brainwave strong enough to change the minds of these people that own these multi million dollar shops to start stamping out the parts we need. We just gotta draw up what we want and prove to the. That there is a market.

Theoretically if we pooled our resources, and our brain power we could come up with HUNDREDS of aftermarket products for the kj.

Stand up and be proud, my little kj has made it over and through every obstacle onlookers said it couldn't. Except for the beaver dam... It was complicated.
Author:  WhitbyKJ [ Wed Apr 22, 2015 1:06 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Guess what I'm picking up!
Sorry my spelling sucks ^

I had to rewrite this post three times to make it as neutral as possible.

Here goes and I apologize if I offend company owners that may be on looking.

With the liberty market only having a couple of manufactures making parts, that means there isn't a whole lot of competition. Without the competition in the market, business owners can charge what they want for a product, regardless of manufacturing cost.

Example: 12,000 cad dollars for a long arm sfa kit. That will buy me a jk.

Example: 1450 usd for two coilovers and a spanner? That will buy me half a DIY sfa kit.

I understand the basic principles (you get what you pay for, capitalism, and market competition, product manufacturing labour, profit margins etc)

Again, not trying to offend anybody here nor steal money or cause harm in any way. These companies are charging SO much for these products because there is no competition. It's kinda like supply and demand. I actually agree in principle with the prices of some of this equipment, because it coincides with good capitalistic values, the fundamentals on which both our countries were born.

But likewise .. With the wranglers.. Every mom and pop is making a kit, so the price dives down. To roughly 100 dollars an inch, give or take different quality options. But they sell, why they sell?? Because people understand sfa.

If we make people understand ifs the way we do, the KoH's do, then we'll be laughing. We the end user won't be paying a thousand dollars for an inch of lift .

Again, I'm not trying to screw anyone over, and I'm not trying to offend anybody... AND if you feel this post is inappropriate feel free to remove it. I just know that out there somewhere there is an investor willing to take us (the liberty) on.
Author:  Rotor [ Wed Apr 22, 2015 1:25 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Guess what I'm picking up!
tommudd wrote:
In our minds possibly but not in the major manufacturers
I was at one company talking to the President of it about lifts etc, (they have a KJ lift but not well put together )
But asked why there wasn't something better for the Liberty world and was told why invest in a market where you may sell 5 a month when they can sell 100s for a JK/ TJ/ Ford Pickups/ etc
The Liberty market is so small that not many want to take the time to do anything at all
10% or less even upgrade their suspensions I'd bet and that includes spacer crappy lifts


No market? Liberties sold at twice the rate as TJ's did, and are 1/4 the price now.
Author:  tommudd [ Wed Apr 22, 2015 1:38 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Guess what I'm picking up!
Rotor wrote:
tommudd wrote:
In our minds possibly but not in the major manufacturers
I was at one company talking to the President of it about lifts etc, (they have a KJ lift but not well put together )
But asked why there wasn't something better for the Liberty world and was told why invest in a market where you may sell 5 a month when they can sell 100s for a JK/ TJ/ Ford Pickups/ etc
The Liberty market is so small that not many want to take the time to do anything at all
10% or less even upgrade their suspensions I'd bet and that includes spacer crappy lifts


No market? Liberties sold at twice the rate as TJ's did, and are 1/4 the price now.


True but yet there are very few that actually ever will be lifted , just because there were 982,605 KJs built doesn't mean that even 1/3 will ever be lifted.
Where as even if TJs had lower production numbers way more of thsoe will be lifted and more things added to them.
The Liberty was/ is / always will be the red headed step child.
Like I mentioned, I have stood and talked face to face with major lift manufacturers and they consider the KJs and even more so the KK line a weak market , period.
Been building and playing with 4WDs a long time and its not a huge market at all compared to other models
Author:  tommudd [ Wed Apr 22, 2015 1:45 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Guess what I'm picking up!
WhitbyKJ wrote:
Sorry my spelling sucks ^

I had to rewrite this post three times to make it as neutral as possible.

Here goes and I apologize if I offend company owners that may be on looking.

With the liberty market only having a couple of manufactures making parts, that means there isn't a whole lot of competition. Without the competition in the market, business owners can charge what they want for a product, regardless of manufacturing cost.

Example: 12,000 cad dollars for a long arm sfa kit. That will buy me a jk.

Example: 1450 usd for two coilovers and a spanner? That will buy me half a DIY sfa kit.

I understand the basic principles (you get what you pay for, capitalism, and market competition, product manufacturing labour, profit margins etc)

Again, not trying to offend anybody here nor steal money or cause harm in any way. These companies are charging SO much for these products because there is no competition. It's kinda like supply and demand. I actually agree in principle with the prices of some of this equipment, because it coincides with good capitalistic values, the fundamentals on which both our countries were born.

But likewise .. With the wranglers.. Every mom and pop is making a kit, so the price dives down. To roughly 100 dollars an inch, give or take different quality options. But they sell, why they sell?? Because people understand sfa.

If we make people understand ifs the way we do, the KoH's do, then we'll be laughing. We the end user won't be paying a thousand dollars for an inch of lift .

Again, I'm not trying to screw anyone over, and I'm not trying to offend anybody... AND if you feel this post is inappropriate feel free to remove it. I just know that out there somewhere there is an investor willing to take us (the liberty) on.



AEV DualSport SC Suspension Lift Kit 3.5" for the JKU

$1,725.00

100 an inch ?? Not with quality kits , now maybe comparing a spacer lift with another but if you are comparing the adjustable coilovers then compare apples to apples, not apples to rotten potatoes .
You'll need to find an investor that has a ton of money and doesn't care about returns.
Doing R&D is not just buying a pair of coilovers and slapping them on. Its finding the right spring rate, right shocks etc to get the over all ride and handling you want.
I've seen the " test subjects" that didn't make the cut at one KJ lift provider :wink:
Author:  tommudd [ Wed Apr 22, 2015 1:47 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Guess what I'm picking up!
WhitbyKJ wrote:
Except for the beaver dam... It was complicated.


They even take out bulldozers, ........don't ask me how I know :ROTFL: :ROTFL:
Author:  WhitbyKJ [ Wed Apr 22, 2015 5:50 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Guess what I'm picking up!
K. Back on track, I got a lp 30 from a wj. It has 3.73 gears. The drivers side carrier bearing is non existent and so are the teeth... They don't even mesh anymore. Picked it up for 40 bucks.

What do I need here??

Cheaper the better please as this is still in its Trial phase.

I was thinking wrecker gears?

Likewise will the kj carrier fit...

I can tackle making it fit into a kj.. No problem.
Author:  tommudd [ Wed Apr 22, 2015 5:58 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Guess what I'm picking up!
What exactly are you wanting to do,
SFA or cut it down to fit where the D30a is currently or ???
Author:  WhitbyKJ [ Wed Apr 22, 2015 10:45 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Guess what I'm picking up!
I think I got it figured out...

The kj is long pinion and the wj/tj/zj and any lp 30 after 1996.5 is short pinion correct?

Just trying to wrap my head around something is all.

Right now, gonna be chopping. Then, once I have gotten my money's worth out of the ifs.. I will sfa.

Unless I chop up a 44 and put custom shafts in it, to fit my beastly 27 spline hubs lol.
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