LOST JEEPS :: View topic - Brake Light Housing and No Bulb

Yes, you are correct. The "European" vehicles, not just the KJ, are equipped with VERY bright red rear fog lights. I remember when I was in the United Kingdom for 2 years, I noticed these lights on their vehicles. Considering the amount of dense fog they have, those rear fog lights are a great help at 80+ mph on the M40. I never did figure out why some of them drove that fast in the fog. Just watch the news and see the catastrophic pile-ups on the freeways.

Another tidbit; MatthewHeld re-wired his to have an additional reverse light. That's pretty neat too. It didn't produce the amount of light he had hoped for though. Just remember, your reverse lights are to instruct others that you are backing up (or at least you're in reverse) not to illuminate the area behind you. For that you will have to install a real light on the back of your vehicle. Beware of the local police though, they don't like bright white rear facing lights on the back of vehicles that aren't covered. :wink:

Wayne

darren/wayne wrote:

Wayne

fog light: left rear is the placement for the E-spec fog lamp. That's where my wife's Audis' have been located.
reverse light: rear facing white lights are illegal in many placed if wired for operation other than when the vehicle is in reverse. Also, having white lights above a certain HEIGHT on the vehicle is a no-no in many place. Check with local law enforcement for details. I'm sure they'll let you know what the law says if you ask BEFORE you put them in

dgeist wrote:

Depends on vehicle and what country on where and how many. The KJ has them on both sides, Audi normally has them on both sides, as is BMW and MB, Some Ford, Opels, etc. The Fog light is on the driver's side of the vehicle. So RHD cars would have the fog light on the right and LHD would have it on the left.

jinstall wrote:

dgeist wrote:

huh, I stand corrected. I never noticed it other than on the left while in Europe. I guess I was busy trying to translate the signs and not watching people's fog lights. (and making sure I entered the roundabouts from the correct side while in the UK. Any idea if the e-spec KJs have a different harness or is it like other things (body harness) where they just left a couple pins out at the final plug. Also, do you know if the e-spec KJ has a turn signal lever with an extra stop for that extra light?

Author:	darren/wayne [ Sun Feb 17, 2008 3:18 am ]
Post subject:	Brake Light Housing and No Bulb
Ever noticed that the bottom of the brake light housing is empty (no bulb)? Our Liberty was a toad (pulled behind an RV). The previous owners had a wiring harness ran to the back lights and installed a generic stop/turn bulb socket into the bottom portion of the brake light housing. After removing the base plate for the tow bar and wiring harness we are left with two wholes in the brake light housing. We thought it would be cool to be different. So we bought two GM sockets for 3157 bulbs. Reworked the wholes in the housing and tapped into the light wiring harness. We now have tail lights and brake lights at the top and bottom of the rear lights. I know this is not cutting edge. But it is different and it works great. We took some pictures as we went along if any one is interested.

Author:	Fulltimer [ Sun Feb 17, 2008 3:36 am ]
Post subject:
Sounds interesting. By all means, post some pics. I had thought about finding a round fog light to put in that spot and using it as a backup light. Terry

Author:	WV Jay [ Sun Feb 17, 2008 3:36 am ]
Post subject:
Yeah post 'em up. That's a pretty good idea IMO. The back up light idea would be good to!

Author:	darren/wayne [ Mon Feb 18, 2008 9:39 pm ]
Post subject:	How I did it ...
The bottom portion of the stock brake light is actually a reflector. If you put a light in there it will light up also. My lights already had wholes from the previous owner. You will have to drill your own wholes relevant to the size of the light socket you chose. If your light socket has "locking tabs" you will have to use a dremel tool or similar item to cut the notches for the tabs. I bought the GM 3157 bulb socket at my local parts store (#85881) $10 for both. Next you will have to choose how to wire your new light. You can splice into your stock tail light harness which is right there or if you have an after-market receiver hitch, you may choose to splice into that wiring. I chose the stock wiring harness. Be sure to wrap and insulate the wires really good after you finish splicing. I soldered my wires and then insulated each of them with liquid electrical tape, wrapped each individually with regular electrical tape and then wrapped all excess wire together with electrical tape. The wires on my socket are labeled on the back of the socket: A, B, G. "A" connects to the BRAKE LIGHT "B" connects to the TAIL LIGHT "G" connects to the GROUND WIRE Color coding for MY 2006 Liberty: DRIVERS SIDE: RED=Tail Light WHITE W/BROWN TRACER=Brake Light WHITE W/GRAY TRACER=Reverse BLACK=Ground WHITE W/GREEN TRACER=Turn Signal PASSENGER SIDE WHITE W/ORANGE TRACER=Tail Light WHITE W/BROWN TRACER=Brake Light WHITE W/ GRAY TRACER=Reverse BLACK=Ground WHITE W/ORANGE=Turn Signal Look closely at your tail light wiring harness connector. There are 5 wires. 2 on one side and 3 on the other. The 2 are your tail and brake lights, and the 3 are the reverse, ground, and turn signal. MY PASSENGER SIDE CONNECTOR HAD TWO WIRES WITH THE SAME COLOR CODE! If you have any doubt, use a voltmeter to identify which wire goes to which bulb. Button everything up and this is what it should look like. Feel free to post comments. Wayne

Author:	kolesy [ Mon Feb 18, 2008 9:46 pm ]
Post subject:
Sorry man but images no worky. Mike

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Author:	darren/wayne [ Mon Feb 18, 2008 9:52 pm ]
Post subject:
I got them up. My iMac uses different commands and menu's than the PC instructions listed in the FAQ section. So I had to play around with it to get it to work. Enjoy, Wayne

Author:	Rush345 [ Mon Feb 18, 2008 11:12 pm ]
Post subject:
If you want bright I would reccomend LED, there was a recent artical as to using LED's for brakes backup light and even their introduction into head light houseing now compared to several years ago, As I understand it Turn signals or any flashing light is not as of yet user freindly for replaceing some factory bulb http://www.detnews.com/apps/pbcs.dll/ar ... 1148/rss25 this makes for an interesting read, many onboard have discussed this again and again. So I as of yet have not a stand on the subject till then I'll pass on all the 411 I can and be happy for advice on a subject new to me.

Author:	matthewheld [ Tue Feb 19, 2008 11:30 am ]
Post subject:
I thinks that's a pretty cool, cheap mod. Looks different at night. Didn't cost much but labor. And you you're a Mac person like me - that's even cooler than the mod! I just bought the parts to do your mod - what do you think about rewiring the factory harness and making the top lens the brake/tail light, the bottom lens the turn/tail light, and wiring the original turn signal as an additional backup light? I've been trying to figure out how I'm going to mount backup lights to the vehicle, and this is not going to provide nearly the amount of light I want in the rear, but it would effectively double what we have now.

Author:	darren/wayne [ Thu Feb 21, 2008 12:11 am ]
Post subject:
Actually, if I'm not mistaken, the 3157 bulb is a Stop/Park/Turn bulb. It SHOULD be possible to wire the bulbs so that the top and bottom lights will provide all three functions. And then you could pig tail the two "clear" lens sockets to function as Reverse lights. Just replace all bulbs with clear bulbs. Remember: In real life, the bottom lens is just a little bit dimmer than the top one. The top one has sort of a magnifier/better reflector. The bottom one has a reflector but the lens is more of a reflector (from the outside in). You are going to really have to do your homework on figuring out what wire does what. I did screw up on mine and soldered the wire on before ensuring it's function. I had to re-do one of the lights. Check first, then connect the wires permanently. Sounds like a great idea! With all the distracted drivers out there nowadays, the more light you have back there informing others of your intentions, the better!! Keep us informed, Wayne

Author:	WV Jay [ Thu Feb 21, 2008 12:16 am ]
Post subject:
Yeah that should definately get their attention. Nice work!

Author:	matthewheld [ Sat Feb 23, 2008 10:47 pm ]
Post subject:
Well, I just completed one side of your mod to the tail lights. I wired the turn signal as an auxiliary backup light and the bottom reflector as the turn signal and second tail light. The brake/tail lamp remained the same. With two backup lights now, it is brighter; just not as bright as I would have hoped. My initial reaction is that I like the new setup. I'm going up in the mountains to play in the snow tonight, so I'll have a better opinion later. Your coding of the tail wires helped me a lot. Thank you.

Author:	jinstall [ Wed Mar 05, 2008 8:00 am ]
Post subject:
FYI on the e-spec KJ's that is an actual light that goes in there and it is for a rear red fog light that is required on all vehicles. I have photos somewhere but not on this computer.

Author:	darren/wayne [ Wed Mar 05, 2008 12:30 pm ]
Post subject:
Yes, you are correct. The "European" vehicles, not just the KJ, are equipped with VERY bright red rear fog lights. I remember when I was in the United Kingdom for 2 years, I noticed these lights on their vehicles. Considering the amount of dense fog they have, those rear fog lights are a great help at 80+ mph on the M40. I never did figure out why some of them drove that fast in the fog. Just watch the news and see the catastrophic pile-ups on the freeways. Another tidbit; MatthewHeld re-wired his to have an additional reverse light. That's pretty neat too. It didn't produce the amount of light he had hoped for though. Just remember, your reverse lights are to instruct others that you are backing up (or at least you're in reverse) not to illuminate the area behind you. For that you will have to install a real light on the back of your vehicle. Beware of the local police though, they don't like bright white rear facing lights on the back of vehicles that aren't covered. Wayne

Author:	matthewheld [ Wed Mar 05, 2008 2:40 pm ]
Post subject:
FYI - I liked your original mod better. I'm going to rewire to match your original mod, and add the backup lights I really want.

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Author:	dgeist [ Wed Mar 05, 2008 5:33 pm ]
Post subject:
darren/wayne wrote: Yes, you are correct. The "European" vehicles, not just the KJ, are equipped with VERY bright red rear fog lights. I remember when I was in the United Kingdom for 2 years, I noticed these lights on their vehicles. Considering the amount of dense fog they have, those rear fog lights are a great help at 80+ mph on the M40. I never did figure out why some of them drove that fast in the fog. Just watch the news and see the catastrophic pile-ups on the freeways. Another tidbit; MatthewHeld re-wired his to have an additional reverse light. That's pretty neat too. It didn't produce the amount of light he had hoped for though. Just remember, your reverse lights are to instruct others that you are backing up (or at least you're in reverse) not to illuminate the area behind you. For that you will have to install a real light on the back of your vehicle. Beware of the local police though, they don't like bright white rear facing lights on the back of vehicles that aren't covered. Wayne fog light: left rear is the placement for the E-spec fog lamp. That's where my wife's Audis' have been located. reverse light: rear facing white lights are illegal in many places if wired for operation other than when the vehicle is in reverse. Also, having white lights above a certain HEIGHT on the vehicle is a no-no in many place. Check with local law enforcement for details. I'm sure they'll let you know what the law says if you ask BEFORE you put them in

Author:	riptricket [ Wed Mar 05, 2008 8:31 pm ]
Post subject:
i want to make that reflector part ( the bottom of both tails) a brake light, b/c i love the look of the new chevy silvarado tail lights... bearing that in mind... how, where, and what do i tap into to make this work?

Author:	jinstall [ Thu Mar 06, 2008 9:26 am ]
Post subject:
dgeist wrote: darren/wayne wrote: Yes, you are correct. The "European" vehicles, not just the KJ, are equipped with VERY bright red rear fog lights. I remember when I was in the United Kingdom for 2 years, I noticed these lights on their vehicles. Considering the amount of dense fog they have, those rear fog lights are a great help at 80+ mph on the M40. I never did figure out why some of them drove that fast in the fog. Just watch the news and see the catastrophic pile-ups on the freeways. Another tidbit; MatthewHeld re-wired his to have an additional reverse light. That's pretty neat too. It didn't produce the amount of light he had hoped for though. Just remember, your reverse lights are to instruct others that you are backing up (or at least you're in reverse) not to illuminate the area behind you. For that you will have to install a real light on the back of your vehicle. Beware of the local police though, they don't like bright white rear facing lights on the back of vehicles that aren't covered. Wayne fog light: left rear is the placement for the E-spec fog lamp. That's where my wife's Audis' have been located. reverse light: rear facing white lights are illegal in many placed if wired for operation other than when the vehicle is in reverse. Also, having white lights above a certain HEIGHT on the vehicle is a no-no in many place. Check with local law enforcement for details. I'm sure they'll let you know what the law says if you ask BEFORE you put them in Depends on vehicle and what country on where and how many. The KJ has them on both sides, Audi normally has them on both sides, as is BMW and MB, Some Ford, Opels, etc. The Fog light is on the driver's side of the vehicle. So RHD cars would have the fog light on the right and LHD would have it on the left.

Author:	dgeist [ Thu Mar 06, 2008 10:35 am ]
Post subject:
jinstall wrote: dgeist wrote: fog light: left rear is the placement for the E-spec fog lamp. That's where my wife's Audis' have been located. reverse light: rear facing white lights are illegal in many placed if wired for operation other than when the vehicle is in reverse. Also, having white lights above a certain HEIGHT on the vehicle is a no-no in many place. Check with local law enforcement for details. I'm sure they'll let you know what the law says if you ask BEFORE you put them in Depends on vehicle and what country on where and how many. The KJ has them on both sides, Audi normally has them on both sides, as is BMW and MB, Some Ford, Opels, etc. The Fog light is on the driver's side of the vehicle. So RHD cars would have the fog light on the right and LHD would have it on the left. huh, I stand corrected. I never noticed it other than on the left while in Europe. I guess I was busy trying to translate the signs and not watching people's fog lights. (and making sure I entered the roundabouts from the correct side while in the UK. Any idea if the e-spec KJs have a different harness or is it like other things (body harness) where they just left a couple pins out at the final plug. Also, do you know if the e-spec KJ has a turn signal lever with an extra stop for that extra light?

Author:	jinstall [ Thu Mar 06, 2008 4:49 pm ]
Post subject:
dgeist wrote: jinstall wrote: dgeist wrote: fog light: left rear is the placement for the E-spec fog lamp. That's where my wife's Audis' have been located. reverse light: rear facing white lights are illegal in many placed if wired for operation other than when the vehicle is in reverse. Also, having white lights above a certain HEIGHT on the vehicle is a no-no in many place. Check with local law enforcement for details. I'm sure they'll let you know what the law says if you ask BEFORE you put them in Depends on vehicle and what country on where and how many. The KJ has them on both sides, Audi normally has them on both sides, as is BMW and MB, Some Ford, Opels, etc. The Fog light is on the driver's side of the vehicle. So RHD cars would have the fog light on the right and LHD would have it on the left. huh, I stand corrected. I never noticed it other than on the left while in Europe. I guess I was busy trying to translate the signs and not watching people's fog lights. (and making sure I entered the roundabouts from the correct side while in the UK. Any idea if the e-spec KJs have a different harness or is it like other things (body harness) where they just left a couple pins out at the final plug. Also, do you know if the e-spec KJ has a turn signal lever with an extra stop for that extra light? The e-spec has more wires in the connector, same connector though. Yes the turn signal has an extra position for the rear fog light. It works just like the front fog but just goes up one more time. The one for the 2000 Neon was a direct fit.