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PostPosted: Sun Jan 14, 2007 12:31 pm 
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RFCRD wrote:
Drewd wrote:
Why is ether so bad? I know that older 18 wheel trucks had ether injection to help with cold starts. I'm thinking that if you only use a little (very short squirt), it could only help. Too much could cause a runaway problem I suppose.

I also heard that ether can cause some glow plugs to swell and make removing them difficult. Any truth to this?

It's a problem if used in excessive amounts. It can be a problem with glow plug equipped engines because it can prematurely ignite when it contacts the hot glow plugs. There are ways to safely use ether but it takes experience. The key with glow plugs is to use it as a last resort after attempting to crank the engine allowing oil to circulate. Use only in very small amounts (just enough to start the fire), especially if introduced past the intercooler. The swelling glow plugs is a myth.


Glow plugs can swell when they fail, and they are a royal pain to remove when swelled, but it has nothing to do with ether AFAIK. Probably a bit of chicken and egg going on there. Failed glow plugs forcing the use of ether is probably the actual sequence of events. I wouldn't ether any glow plug diesel without disconnecting the plugs first.

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 Post subject: There are actually two issues here
PostPosted: Mon Jan 15, 2007 4:39 pm 
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This thread has evolved into two discussions.

First: Fuel
When temperatures drop to about 20 F., unwintererized #2 Diesel is going to start to have gelling problems. Gelled fuel means plugged fuel filters which means no fuel supply to the engine. Winterized #2 (actually a mixture of #1 and #2) is generally good to about -20 F., depending on the blend. Below -20 F., #1 is usually called for. At about -40 to -50 F. (and I lived in a place years ago that regularly got this cold), even #1 will start to gel. In that case, many diesel owners opted to use Jet A. Now, I doubt that would even be legal now, and it tended to be very hard on engines because of its lack of lubrication properties. These days, there are a lot of fuel additives (e.g., Powerservice) available to prevent gelling, as well. By the way, a lot of off-road diesel equipment and big over-the-road diesel trucks have fuel heaters in their fuel tanks to prevent fuel gelling.

Second: Actual starting.
The key to getting a diesel to start is to get the temperature in the combustion chamber high enough to initiate combustion. Crank the engine long enough and friction and compression will eventually get the combustion chamber temperature high enough to ignite the fuel. In cold weather, though, the battery may be dead or the starter overheated before this happens. As an example, I can remember when the old Caterpillar dozers used a gas pony engine to crank the diesel (I mentioned this in an earlier post). The diesel had no glow plugs. The operator would start the pony engine, then engage a clutch to allow the pony engine to turn over the diesel. On well below zero mornings, the pony engine might have to turn over the diesel for 15 or 20 minutes before the diesel would fire on compression--then maybe 4 or 5 minutes more before then diesel could run on its own. Noisy, smoky, and cumbersome--you bet! That's why glow plugs came along--to heat the combustion chamber enough that combustion would initiate quickly. Finally, block heaters. They help two ways. First, they raise the temperature of the entire engine, so the glow plugs are working with a combustion chamber that is already warmer than the ambient temperature. Second, the engine oil is warmer (and probably a little thinner) which makes less work for the starter and battery. The side benefit is that the engine reaches operating temperature more quickly and the heater warms quicker.

I've owned diesels for longer than I would like to admit. With a strong battery and ungelled fuel, most diesels should start without a block heater down to about -20 F. Below that, access to a block heater is a darn good idea. Though extended idling is not good for any engine, if I was stuck somewhere in -20 F. or lower temperatures for more than a couple of hours without access to a block heater or heated garage, I might be tempted to let the vehicle idle.

PS--Where I live it has been dropping below 0 F. just about every night for over a week. No issues starting the CRD--I've plugged it in for 2 hours on only one very cold night.


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 15, 2007 8:20 pm 
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I found out the hard way also that it will take some doing to start at -30. I did it one morning and after about 20 seconds of starter assisted running it finally went, on its own. Just got the owners manual and it says you can run the starter for 25 seconds. Easier to plug it in if you can.


Too true - a heated garage is even better!

Just wondering if you run 0w-30? As a side note - even cranking mine for about 30 seconds in the quasi-run mode, it wouldn't start. If I remember correctly diesels have to turn a minimum RPM before they will start (even with glow plugs), in my case I'm pretty sure the oil was to thick to allow the starter to get the engine to that RPM. BTW I have a 92 cummins that I have started at -35C without being plugged in, however that was with 0w-30 and only after a day of sledding in the Rockies. If I keep the standard 15w-40 in it, no starting below about -18C!

In Canada (Alberta anyway) the diesel we get starting in about September is blended to have a gel point around -45C. They do this by stripping out more of the parrafins (wax) to keep the pour point and gel point low for winter. The problem is that parrafins = calories, which is why winter diesel gives you less power and less MPG. You can feel the performance difference when they start selling summer diesel.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Jan 15, 2007 9:34 pm 
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I would not use ether on this engine even as a last resort. The glow plugs are ceramic(which will not swell) and have a super fast heat up time. The chance of detonation is high imho. The head is aluminum which will not tolerate the super high stress loads that ether imposes. Plus the chance of shattering the glow plugs is also there. If you are using ether, I would make sure the glow plugs are disabled at a minimum.

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