CRD Engine "knock". Broken Rockers? Jumped Time? *Updates*

rankom · **Posted:** Tue Oct 20, 2015 7:52 pm

in order to save money on injector testing , remove turbo , and exhaust manifold do not remove oil feed line , get 8 mm bolt and nut from hardware store , install 2 copper washers from original banjo bolt , start engine and tell us from witch exhaust port you see lots of smoke, it will be very loud.

geordi · **Posted:** Tue Oct 20, 2015 7:55 pm

That is silliness. The problem is most likely rockers, the injectors on these almost never go bad while the rockers are a designed-as-such weak point.

No reason to replace head gasket if you don't have a leak, but you should do the ARP studs (you will be staring at the bolts when you get to the rockers) and you should absolutely do the intake elbow and glow plugs at the same time - it makes the reassembly suck a lot less and eliminates the EGR soot. I can set you up with the Yeti tune if you need it, or if you have a GDE, then you may already have the code removed from the system or that can be updated by Keith.

rankom · **Posted:** Tue Oct 20, 2015 8:10 pm

sorry Geordy , i thought guy sad he see white unburned smoke from tail pipe i did know , rockers can do this , but i learn every day tank you again sorry i did know that , so no problem man i was just throwing ideas , sorry again .

geordi · **Posted:** Tue Oct 20, 2015 8:16 pm

rankom wrote:

sorry Geordy , i thought guy sad he see white unburned smoke from tail pipe i did know , rockers can do this , but i learn every day tank you again sorry i did know that , so no problem man i was just throwing ideas , sorry again .

LOL Its all good man, I wasn't jumping on anybody for this! The weather has been cold enough and if the smoke was only at first startup then went away, that pretty much eliminates the smoke as anything other than "it was cold and combustion was crap" from the list of symptoms.

Keep with the ideas though, you never know who may benefit. I don't claim to know anything significant about these things either, I just happen to have guessed right a few times and turned a couple wrenches. I've also learned from how the engines have screwed up.

rankom · **Posted:** Tue Oct 20, 2015 8:30 pm

cool , as much as you hate them rockers , i hate this fuel system ha ha .,, cheers

thermorex · **Posted:** Tue Oct 20, 2015 8:45 pm

I'll repeat the question to the op, what codes are listed from the ecm? This may be very important.

Brasher · **Joined:** Sat Mar 14, 2015 7:02 pm **Posts:** 80

Okay, I got my Creader VI+ in today. I am now able to read codes on my Jeep (apparently most autoparts scan tools don't support ISO 9141)

And the verdict is....

P0301 - Misfire Cylinder 1
P0093- Fuel System Leak Detected - Large Leak

So if you stated that it could be an injector sticking open, it seems that you would be correct!

After I read the codes, I rechecked the oil level. Oil level is way above Max and smells like diesel.

I then did the test that thermorex (and maybe others) suggested. I pulled the #1 injector. No more knock! And runs pretty well comparatively.

Sounds like a simple Injector rebuild/replacement may be all that I need.

I'm not sure if it means anything, by my fuel rail pressure was hovering around 5,000psi when it was "idling" with injector #1 plugged in. I didn't check the pressure with #1 unplugged, but I believe I have read elsewhere that fuel rail pressure should be around 7,000psi at idle.

Also, this might explain why my oil pressure sensor died shortly before: fuel in the oil killed it.

All things consider, I'm happy right now.

Brasher · **Joined:** Sat Mar 14, 2015 7:02 pm **Posts:** 80

Ordered a new injector, seals, and clips from Oregon Fuel Injection. I called around, but no one rebuilds these fuel injectors, not even Austin Fuel Injection. The only ones that do aren't Bosch certified.

geordi · **Posted:** Wed Oct 21, 2015 12:55 pm

Well I'm surprised - but happy for you. Pulling the #1 injector is an easy thing, and Atlanta should have plenty of Bosch shops to rebuild it for you locally. Look around where the big trucks hang out for a business like "diesel fuel injection service" or some similar name. They will most likely be the place.

I have 4 spare injectors that I could sell - but I'm not in Savannah at the moment to be able to deliver them to the post office.

I'm surprised you couldn't find anyone to rebuild it! There is a diesel fuel injection service business in Garden City, Ga right near the port (and the airport) that worked on mine last time... Bosch certified and all? Weird. There isn't anything special about these injectors, were you asking about having them rebuild the injectors for a "jeep CRD" instead of "the injectors from my CP3 pump" b/c that may be what they weren't familiar with. As soon as they see the injectors though - no problems.

These are the same injectors used on the big ram trucks, they just have a lot more of them.

Brasher · **Joined:** Sat Mar 14, 2015 7:02 pm **Posts:** 80

I may have not used the correct lingo. What is the price typically for a rebuild? The new injector from OFI will be $450 after core return.

BlueLghtning · **Posted:** Wed Oct 21, 2015 1:39 pm

For an injector rebuild locally in Atlanta, check with Turbo Diesel & Electric Systems. They have a location in Forest Park and Marietta - http://www.tdesystems.com/.

My friend runs/owns that company with her family (3rd generation) and her son was one of the injector rebuild techs that did a great job. He's moved on to other things, but I've been told they have a state of the art system.

From my friend's son

Quote:

We are located in forest park. The phone number is 404-361-2222 ask for John Carter and tell him Adam Leipold thought he would be the person to talk to

rankom · **Posted:** Wed Oct 21, 2015 4:19 pm

ok guys , this is how my injector #failed , because previous owner , and me included not knowing this motor, !!! didn't take care air in fuel problem on time , air does not lubricate this expensive injectors !! but we are lucky cp3 pump can take lots of abuse, so please take care of air in fuel problem .

Hexus · **Posted:** Wed Oct 21, 2015 7:49 pm

Air in fuel makes some funny noises, but I have a hard time believe after hearing it run, that the #1 injector was the only issue.

If it is, you are indeed, very lucky sir.

user113 · **Posted:** Mon Oct 26, 2015 12:56 pm

Sounds like you're making good progress.

Brasher · **Joined:** Sat Mar 14, 2015 7:02 pm **Posts:** 80

I'm trying to test the injectors. I bought a new injector already, but I would like to confirm that the #1 injector is actually bad.

Sunday I swapped out injectors 1 and 2. In the process I managed to break one of the little crappy plastic tees on the return fuel spill line. $53 bucks later I have a new one, which came in today. I tried to finish pulling the old one off the car. That's when I managed to break the nipple of the crappy Fuel Return block. Freaking $92 bucks for that piece of crap. Seriously, is there a single durable part on this car?

I saw that many people have broken the same part, and most opt to throw together an assembly of brass tee fittings. Looks like I'll give that a shot.

olypopper · **Posted:** Tue Oct 27, 2015 6:37 pm

Brasher wrote:

I'm trying to test the injectors. I bought a new injector already, but I would like to confirm that the #1 injector is actually bad.

Sunday I swapped out injectors 1 and 2. In the process I managed to break one of the little crappy plastic tees on the return fuel spill line. $53 bucks later I have a new one, which came in today. I tried to finish pulling the old one off the car. That's when I managed to break the nipple of the crappy Fuel Return block. Freaking $92 bucks for that piece of crap. Seriously, is there a single durable part on this car?

I saw that many people have broken the same part, and most opt to throw together an assembly of brass tee fittings. Looks like I'll give that a shot.

Welcome to being your own warranty station! :mrgreen:

Brasher · **Joined:** Sat Mar 14, 2015 7:02 pm **Posts:** 80

Finally got to a point where I can test the injectors.

Verdict: No change. Still "knocking" on cylinder 1 when the injector is plugged in. I'm guessing at this point I have broken rockers or some sort of valve issue, possibly on the exhaust side keeping the exhaust valves closed and forcing the expended gases out the intake, creating the "knock". That or a dead rod bearing or wrist pin.

Does anyone have timing belt tools in the Atlanta area? GDE is out at the moment. I would like to try to tackle this this weekend.

geordi · **Posted:** Thu Oct 29, 2015 1:07 am

Brasher wrote:

Finally got to a point where I can test the injectors.

Verdict: No change. Still "knocking" on cylinder 1 when the injector is plugged in. I'm guessing at this point I have broken rockers or some sort of valve issue, possibly on the exhaust side keeping the exhaust valves closed and forcing the expended gases out the intake, creating the "knock". That or a dead rod bearing or wrist pin.

Does anyone have timing belt tools in the Atlanta area? GDE is out at the moment. I would like to try to tackle this this weekend.

Yes... I'm driving through with them tomorrow, but you can't have them - I need them for the trip in Chicago and Kentucky. Sorry.

If you want to tear it down to the rockers and back again to the inner cover, you don't need to have the pins to do that, and I will be back on Wednesday most likely.

Brasher · **Joined:** Sat Mar 14, 2015 7:02 pm **Posts:** 80

Thanks for the offer. Unfortunately if I do it this weekend, I would have to have it done before Monday morning. Sounds like a tall order, but at least I have performed a tear down all the way to pulling the cam sprockets off before.

pjigar · **Posted:** Thu Oct 29, 2015 9:54 am

Timing lock pins can be bought off eBay for $40. I use "fan removal tool" from Napa was counter torque device for the cam sprockets. Not perfect but does the job. The same "fan removal tool" will work for holding the fan pulley in place when you tighten that sucker at 100 ftlb.

CRD Engine "knock". Broken Rockers? Jumped Time? Updates

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