LOST JEEPS :: View topic - Anyone use Mobil1 Synthetic ATF in their CRD tranny?

Isn't all our oils in the CRD synthetics already. I think my dealer said that is why it's so spendy to do tranny, transcase, and front/rear axle changes.

All the atf+4 that I have seen is synthetic.

I find it interesting that Mobil 1 doesn't say "ATF+4" anywhere on the bottle. The only ATF+4 I have found locally is Valvoline, and it claims to be fully synthetic. $4.68/quart at Advance Auto (ouch!).

For many GM, Ford and import vehicles. Approved for use in vehicles specifying:

Dexron III, Dexron IIIE, Dexron

Approved for H specification, the latest GM Dexron III performance level

Mercon, Mercon V

Recommended for Allison C-4 and Caterpillar TO-2 applications

Recommended for Chrysler automatic transmissions

Mobil 1 Synthetic ATF is designed to meet the demanding requirements of modern passenger vehicles. The synthetic base oil composition enables excellent performance even in the severest of operating conditions. It offers outstanding gear shifting and power transfer performance. Versus conventional ATF fluids, the inherently high viscosity index and stability of Mobil 1 Synthetic ATF protects against thermal breakdown at high operating temperatures, while still providing outstanding performance at very low ambient temperatures.

Mobil 1 Synthetic ATF combines high-performance synthetic hydrocarbon base oils and a superior balanced additive system to provide significantly higher levels of performance above conventional fluids. This unique, advanced technology has demonstrated long drain capability, excellent friction retention, and low-temperature capability. Further, it helps to improve overall transmission durability and cleanliness.

Mobil 1 is not compatible with chrysler transmissions specified for ATF+4, this also confirmed by Mobil.

ATF+4 is a full synthetic made to spec for chrysler by valvoline, Chrysler made an arrangement a year or
2 ago to allow valvoline to sell this spec under the valvoline brand.

Just stay with Chrysler/Valvoline ATF+4 as the additive package is key to some of the chrysler designs.

Amsoil claims to have an ATF+4 spec, but since the ATF+4 chemical spec is not public knowledge I would pass on that.

The price of ATF+4 is better or competitive to other synthetic oils, around here anyways.

-Gabe

Synthetic truly has no advantage in engines, it will however excell in applications where higher temperatures are
a factor, turbines or like in the desert when you get a hole shot in your radiator. you have a better chance of your engine
staying running back to the base.

-Gab

You know, its amazing what you find sometimes, when you start looking.

Apparently "ATF+4" is a DC proprietary formula. Chrysler started mandating its use to maintain warranty coverage in most of its transmissions back in 2000. Until September of 2005, they refused to release its specifications or permit anyone else to make or sell it, meaning that the only place you could get it was from your friendly DC dealer. They also apparently instituted a program under which, in order for a dealer to buy ATF+4 in "bulk" containers for shop use, the dealer also had to buy specified amounts of other bulk oils from DC.

ILMA, a trade organization of independent lubruicant manufacturers, raised a stink with FTC, claiming that the refusal of DC to permit anyone else to make or sell ATF+4 was a violation of the Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act, because it effectively required you to have your transmission service done by a dealer to maintain warranty coverage. They also complained about the bulk oil program, claiming that tying the purchase of bulk ATF+4 (available only from DC) to purchases of other bulk oils (available from independent manufacturers/dealers) constituted an illegal restraint of trade.

Probably in response to the ILMA complaint, starting in September, 2005 DC began licensing others to make ATF+4. Anyone who makes ATF+4 under license must pay DC $1 per gallon for the priviledge.

After reading all this I have become of the opinion that Mobil 1 ATF will work fine in a Jeep transmission or transfer case. ExxonMobil recommends its use in Chrysler transmissions. They are probably just unwilling to pay DC $1 per gallon so they can call it ATF+4.

Go to http://www.ilma.org and do a search for "ATF+4" if you want some interesting reading. The news release from 2005 about the licensing program is at http://ilma.enewsletterpress.com/news/default.aspx?IID=63.

Excellent responses here! After reading and learning, I will not use Mobil1 ATF in the tranny or transfer case. My main reason is because of warranty. Because the mobi1 ATF isn't ATF+4, then I would void the warranty for the parts that I put it in (ie. tranny and transfer case). What troubles me is that they put on there that it is "recommended for Chrysler vehicles". Recommended by who? Certainly not DC since they specifically require ATF+4. This is the main reason I asked this question is because sometimes they do a little too much marketing and leave the consumer confused

Author:	no-blue-screen [ Mon Aug 14, 2006 2:22 pm ]
Post subject:	Anyone use Mobil1 Synthetic ATF in their CRD tranny?
Hi all, Anyone here use Mobil 1 Full Synthetic ATF in their CRD? I am thinking with all the transmission issues, I might benefit in changing to a higher grade trans fluid. It says that it is recommended for Chrysler transmissions. Anyone else using this? If so, comments? http://www.mobiloil.com/USA-English/Mot ... c_ATF.aspx

Author:	spoonplugger1 [ Mon Aug 14, 2006 4:39 pm ]
Post subject:
Isn't all our oils in the CRD synthetics already. I think my dealer said that is why it's so spendy to do tranny, transcase, and front/rear axle changes.

Author:	grywlfbg [ Tue Aug 15, 2006 5:48 pm ]
Post subject:
I'm planning to change to Amsoil synthetic ATF when I hit 30K miles. Oil brand discussions aside, changing tranny fluid is the best way to keep your tranny running for a long time. Aside from the weird TC problems people are having - I'm just talking standard wear and tear here, especially if you do a lot of towing.

Author:	oldnavy [ Tue Aug 15, 2006 7:00 pm ]
Post subject:
spoonplugger1 wrote: Isn't all our oils in the CRD synthetics already. I think my dealer said that is why it's so spendy to do tranny, transcase, and front/rear axle changes. Only sysnthetic oils in CRD from factory is rear differential and engine oil, the front differential does not come with synthetic oil for some reason. I have heard that the MOPAR tranny fluid we use in the Jeep is synthetic, but I have know way of knowing for sure. I have switched the transfer case to Mobil 1 synthetic fluid and will do the same for the tranny at it first service.

Author:	onthehunt [ Tue Aug 15, 2006 7:21 pm ]
Post subject:
All the atf+4 that I have seen is synthetic.

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Anyone use Mobil1 Synthetic ATF in their CRD tranny? http://www.lostjeeps.com/forum/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=11412	Page 1 of 2

Author:	oldnavy [ Tue Aug 15, 2006 7:24 pm ]
Post subject:
onthehunt wrote: All the atf+4 that I have seen is synthetic. I have looked at the bottle (have one in the garage) and will look again after supper, but I didn't see anything saying it was synthetic. That said it smells and taste (don't ask) the same as Mobil 1 synthetic fluid, but that is far from a definitive test answer.

Author:	no-blue-screen [ Tue Aug 15, 2006 9:41 pm ]
Post subject:
Well, if it doesn't say it is synthetic plainly on the front of the bottle...it probably isn't. I mean heck...even Rotella T with it's hydrocracked Group III base can call itself fully synthetic....so if they don't say it is sythetic on the front....I wouldn't trust it. I was really curious about Mobil 1 Synthetic ATF because it claims to be a multi-vehicle formula which is for Chevy and Ford...but "recommended" for Chrysler transmissions as well.

Author:	SCKJCRD [ Tue Aug 15, 2006 10:15 pm ]
Post subject:
I find it interesting that Mobil 1 doesn't say "ATF+4" anywhere on the bottle. The only ATF+4 I have found locally is Valvoline, and it claims to be fully synthetic. $4.68/quart at Advance Auto (ouch!).

Author:	no-blue-screen [ Tue Aug 15, 2006 10:23 pm ]
Post subject:
SCKJCRD wrote: I find it interesting that Mobil 1 doesn't say "ATF+4" anywhere on the bottle. The only ATF+4 I have found locally is Valvoline, and it claims to be fully synthetic. $4.68/quart at Advance Auto (ouch!). Same here....you think 4.68 hurts...try $6.49 per qt for the Mobil 1 juice.

Author:	oldnavy [ Tue Aug 15, 2006 10:51 pm ]
Post subject:
From Mobil's website: Quote: For many GM, Ford and import vehicles. Approved for use in vehicles specifying: Dexron III, Dexron IIIE, Dexron Approved for H specification, the latest GM Dexron III performance level Mercon, Mercon V Recommended for Allison C-4 and Caterpillar TO-2 applications Recommended for Chrysler automatic transmissions Mobil 1 Synthetic ATF is designed to meet the demanding requirements of modern passenger vehicles. The synthetic base oil composition enables excellent performance even in the severest of operating conditions. It offers outstanding gear shifting and power transfer performance. Versus conventional ATF fluids, the inherently high viscosity index and stability of Mobil 1 Synthetic ATF protects against thermal breakdown at high operating temperatures, while still providing outstanding performance at very low ambient temperatures. Mobil 1 Synthetic ATF combines high-performance synthetic hydrocarbon base oils and a superior balanced additive system to provide significantly higher levels of performance above conventional fluids. This unique, advanced technology has demonstrated long drain capability, excellent friction retention, and low-temperature capability. Further, it helps to improve overall transmission durability and cleanliness. I think it is a Group IV full synthetic from what the bold section states.

Author:	gd5092 [ Thu Aug 17, 2006 10:27 pm ]
Post subject:
Mobil 1 is not compatible with chrysler transmissions specified for ATF+4, this also confirmed by Mobil. ATF+4 is a full synthetic made to spec for chrysler by valvoline, Chrysler made an arrangement a year or 2 ago to allow valvoline to sell this spec under the valvoline brand. Just stay with Chrysler/Valvoline ATF+4 as the additive package is key to some of the chrysler designs. Amsoil claims to be ATF+4 compatible, but since the ATF+4 chemical spec is not public knowledge I would pass on that. The price of ATF+4 is better or competitive to other synthetic oils, around here anyways. -Gabe

Author:	oldnavy [ Thu Aug 17, 2006 10:31 pm ]
Post subject:
gd5092 wrote: Mobil 1 is not compatible with chrysler transmissions specified for ATF+4, this also confirmed by Mobil. ATF+4 is a full synthetic made to spec for chrysler by valvoline, Chrysler made an arrangement a year or 2 ago to allow valvoline to sell this spec under the valvoline brand. Just stay with Chrysler/Valvoline ATF+4 as the additive package is key to some of the chrysler designs. Amsoil claims to have an ATF+4 spec, but since the ATF+4 chemical spec is not public knowledge I would pass on that. The price of ATF+4 is better or competitive to other synthetic oils, around here anyways. -Gabe Ok a question for you. Does this apply to the transfer case also?

Author:	gd5092 [ Thu Aug 17, 2006 10:39 pm ]
Post subject:
Transfer case I would say ditto, there's no advantage using anything else. the specification also calls for ATF+4. Engine oil, well they call for a synthetic, and since there's a Turbo in there which problably does not always gets the cool down it needs I would stick with that as well. I always liked the Mobil 1 Delvac, simply because it priced right and is made to stay true to the spec for the life of the oil, i.e it stays a 5W40 for between intervals amongst others, including an antiwear (ZDP) package which is sacrificial, i.e it gets used up during it's life. Synthetic truly has no advantage in engines, it will however excell in applications where higher temperatures are a factor, turbines or like in the desert when you get a hole shot in your radiator. you have a better chance of your engine staying running back to the base. -Gab

Author:	oldnavy [ Thu Aug 17, 2006 11:28 pm ]
Post subject:
gd5092 wrote: Synthetic truly has no advantage in engines, it will however excell in applications where higher temperatures are a factor, turbines or like in the desert when you get a hole shot in your radiator. you have a better chance of your engine staying running back to the base. -Gab Oh contre(?) good sir, one nice thing is the base oil does not go to crap like Group I, II, III oils do. That and I like my 10k mile plus oil changes in everything I have owned for years now. Anyway I always figured if gas turbine requires it to just run any reasonable time then, then it was good enough for my cars.

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Author:	SCKJCRD [ Fri Aug 18, 2006 1:26 am ]
Post subject:
You know, its amazing what you find sometimes, when you start looking. Apparently "ATF+4" is a DC proprietary formula. Chrysler started mandating its use to maintain warranty coverage in most of its transmissions back in 2000. Until September of 2005, they refused to release its specifications or permit anyone else to make or sell it, meaning that the only place you could get it was from your friendly DC dealer. They also apparently instituted a program under which, in order for a dealer to buy ATF+4 in "bulk" containers for shop use, the dealer also had to buy specified amounts of other bulk oils from DC. ILMA, a trade organization of independent lubruicant manufacturers, raised a stink with FTC, claiming that the refusal of DC to permit anyone else to make or sell ATF+4 was a violation of the Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act, because it effectively required you to have your transmission service done by a dealer to maintain warranty coverage. They also complained about the bulk oil program, claiming that tying the purchase of bulk ATF+4 (available only from DC) to purchases of other bulk oils (available from independent manufacturers/dealers) constituted an illegal restraint of trade. Probably in response to the ILMA complaint, starting in September, 2005 DC began licensing others to make ATF+4. Anyone who makes ATF+4 under license must pay DC $1 per gallon for the priviledge. After reading all this I have become of the opinion that Mobil 1 ATF will work fine in a Jeep transmission or transfer case. ExxonMobil recommends its use in Chrysler transmissions. They are probably just unwilling to pay DC $1 per gallon so they can call it ATF+4. Go to http://www.ilma.org and do a search for "ATF+4" if you want some interesting reading. The news release from 2005 about the licensing program is at http://ilma.enewsletterpress.com/news/default.aspx?IID=63.

Author:	RFCRD [ Fri Aug 18, 2006 2:10 am ]
Post subject:
SCKJCRD wrote: You know, its amazing what you find sometimes, when you start looking. Apparently "ATF+4" is a DC proprietary formula. Chrysler started mandating its use to maintain warranty coverage in most of its transmissions back in 2000. Until September of 2005, they refused to release its specifications or permit anyone else to make or sell it, meaning that the only place you could get it was from your friendly DC dealer. They also apparently instituted a program under which, in order for a dealer to buy ATF+4 in "bulk" containers for shop use, the dealer also had to buy specified amounts of other bulk oils from DC. ILMA, a trade organization of independent lubruicant manufacturers, raised a stink with FTC, claiming that the refusal of DC to permit anyone else to make or sell ATF+4 was a violation of the Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act, because it effectively required you to have your transmission service done by a dealer to maintain warranty coverage. They also complained about the bulk oil program, claiming that tying the purchase of bulk ATF+4 (available only from DC) to purchases of other bulk oils (available from independent manufacturers/dealers) constituted an illegal restraint of trade. Probably in response to the ILMA complaint, starting in September, 2005 DC began licensing others to make ATF+4. Anyone who makes ATF+4 under license must pay DC $1 per gallon for the priviledge. After reading all this I have become of the opinion that Mobil 1 ATF will work fine in a Jeep transmission or transfer case. ExxonMobil recommends its use in Chrysler transmissions. They are probably just unwilling to pay DC $1 per gallon so they can call it ATF+4. Go to http://www.ilma.org and do a search for "ATF+4" if you want some interesting reading. The news release from 2005 about the licensing program is at http://ilma.enewsletterpress.com/news/default.aspx?IID=63. Get used to it, DC is big into proprietary parts too. Wait until you need an EGR, flow control valve, or some other gadget for this engine when the warranty expires. The software fiasco, which is finally going into a recall, is a strong clue as to DC's approach to maintaining exclusive control over this product.

Author:	Joe Romas [ Fri Aug 18, 2006 7:31 am ]
Post subject:
SCKJCRD wrote: You know, its amazing what you find sometimes, when you start looking. Apparently "ATF+4" is a DC proprietary formula. Chrysler started mandating its use to maintain warranty coverage in most of its transmissions back in 2000. Until September of 2005, they refused to release its specifications or permit anyone else to make or sell it, meaning that the only place you could get it was from your friendly DC dealer. They also apparently instituted a program under which, in order for a dealer to buy ATF+4 in "bulk" containers for shop use, the dealer also had to buy specified amounts of other bulk oils from DC. ILMA, a trade organization of independent lubruicant manufacturers, raised a stink with FTC, claiming that the refusal of DC to permit anyone else to make or sell ATF+4 was a violation of the Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act, because it effectively required you to have your transmission service done by a dealer to maintain warranty coverage. They also complained about the bulk oil program, claiming that tying the purchase of bulk ATF+4 (available only from DC) to purchases of other bulk oils (available from independent manufacturers/dealers) constituted an illegal restraint of trade. Probably in response to the ILMA complaint, starting in September, 2005 DC began licensing others to make ATF+4. Anyone who makes ATF+4 under license must pay DC $1 per gallon for the priviledge. After reading all this I have become of the opinion that Mobil 1 ATF will work fine in a Jeep transmission or transfer case. ExxonMobil recommends its use in Chrysler transmissions. They are probably just unwilling to pay DC $1 per gallon so they can call it ATF+4. Go to http://www.ilma.org and do a search for "ATF+4" if you want some interesting reading. The news release from 2005 about the licensing program is at http://ilma.enewsletterpress.com/news/default.aspx?IID=63. Actually there's some kind of law that allows the automakers to have exclusive rights to any "new" type of parts/supplies for 5 years. I first ran into that trying to buy a battery for my then 3 year old 78 rabbit diesel. The counter person at the VW dealer told me about the 5 year thing. Since Chrysler released it for the 2000 models in September of 99 then in September of 05 it would be 5 years. Regarding the transfer case. Older jeeps, use Dexron in their transfer cases with very little problems. So it should be OK. Chrysler came up with the new fluid because they were having so many transmission problems. I wonder how Mobile 1 Dexron would do in our less then poblem free transmissions?

Author:	gd5092 [ Fri Aug 18, 2006 9:54 am ]
Post subject:
I would stick with the specification, you can't go wrong. I did phone Mobil and asked if it could be used in ATF+4 applications, their reply was "No sir it cannot", this was last year. ATF+4 is used in various applications, maybe it was the reason for the Synthetic choice. Synthetic has good high temp oxidation resistance, if you don't run hot temperatures it won't do anything "Extra" The average engine , even at WOT the temp at the rings will not break down regular oil. -Gab

Author:	no-blue-screen [ Fri Aug 18, 2006 10:38 am ]
Post subject:
Excellent responses here! After reading and learning, I will not use Mobil1 ATF in the tranny or transfer case. My main reason is because of warranty. Because the mobi1 ATF isn't ATF+4, then I would void the warranty for the parts that I put it in (ie. tranny and transfer case). What troubles me is that they put on there that it is "recommended for Chrysler vehicles". Recommended by who? Certainly not DC since they specifically require ATF+4. This is the main reason I asked this question is because sometimes they do a little too much marketing and leave the consumer confused

Author:	Reggie [ Fri Aug 18, 2006 5:02 pm ]
Post subject:
no-blue-screen wrote: Excellent responses here! After reading and learning, I will not use Mobil1 ATF in the tranny or transfer case. My main reason is because of warranty. Because the mobi1 ATF isn't ATF+4, then I would void the warranty for the parts that I put it in (ie. tranny and transfer case). What troubles me is that they put on there that it is "recommended for Chrysler vehicles". Recommended by who? Certainly not DC since they specifically require ATF+4. This is the main reason I asked this question is because sometimes they do a little too much marketing and leave the consumer confused Mobil 1 should be fine in the transfer case. BUT to avoid warranty hassles use the ATF+4. O'Rielly Auto Parts carries the Valvoline ATF+4 here in Houston. I picked some up for $3.69 a quart.