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The studder is back...WTF
http://www.lostjeeps.com/forum/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=19253		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  no-blue-screen [ Mon Apr 02, 2007 8:24 pm ]
Post subject:  The studder is back...WTF
Well, the studder is back and I can't for the life of me figure out what is causing it. I have cleaned MAF, MAP sensor, replaced air filter, and replaced fuel filter. Almost 15k on it and the only thing I can think of is the EGR. It just doesn't feel as zippy as it used to and doesn't have hardly any power on the hills. I guess it may be another trip to the dealer. Anyone have any other ideas?
Author:  DarbyWalters [ Mon Apr 02, 2007 8:40 pm ]
Post subject: 
Unplug the MAF and see if that clears it up. If it does it is probably your EGR or CCV. You will know right away if it drives much better...try priming the fuel filter if that does not work.
Author:  MOSFET [ Mon Apr 02, 2007 8:55 pm ]
Post subject: 
I thought that air in the fuel system was the main culprit.
Author:  no-blue-screen [ Mon Apr 02, 2007 8:57 pm ]
Post subject: 
DarbyWalters wrote:
Unplug the MAF and see if that clears it up. If it does it is probably your EGR or CCV. You will know right away if it drives much better...try priming the fuel filter if that does not work.


Thanks darby, I primed it again after I replaced the Fuel filter today. The old one was pretty dirty...but....it still isn't running good at all....I am worried it is the EGR. The map sensor was completely soot loaded after 5k miles and I cleaned that last week and no change.

I am just pissed because I started a new job that requires traveling to different offices about three weeks ago....I need a reliable vehicle...I am going to have to pay for another rental if I take it back to the dealer. This just plain sucks.
Author:  huxrules [ Mon Apr 02, 2007 10:02 pm ]
Post subject:  do the off road mod
I did the ORM and so far no shudder. Sometimes it feels like it wants to but it doesn't. Also as for air in the fuel: One day I was driving around and the libby started to shake every time at 55. I pulled over and reprimed the filter. It did nothing and the libby shook the rest of the day. So who knows- I just know it seems more resistant with the ORM.
Author:  no-blue-screen [ Tue Apr 03, 2007 10:55 am ]
Post subject:  Re: do the off road mod
huxrules wrote:
I did the ORM and so far no shudder. Sometimes it feels like it wants to but it doesn't. Also as for air in the fuel: One day I was driving around and the libby started to shake every time at 55. I pulled over and reprimed the filter. It did nothing and the libby shook the rest of the day. So who knows- I just know it seems more resistant with the ORM.


It's strange too because the last few days...it seems to run best when first started in the morning.....then...once I leave work...it starts running like crap on the way home...until it sits all night again. It doesn't make sense.....this morning it ran pretty well....but my milage is way down now....I am all the way down to half tank and only 220 miles on the trip meter.
Author:  spoonplugger1 [ Tue Apr 03, 2007 11:38 am ]
Post subject: 
Kind of makes sense the runs better cold stage, the ORM program isn't all the way locked in and running till the engine warms, etc. Than we have the ORM interfacing with the diesel's control box thing going on also.
Author:  no-blue-screen [ Tue Apr 03, 2007 12:33 pm ]
Post subject: 
Well, I made a trip to another office today and I ran the A/C as well. It isn't running as bad today for whatever reason....I guess the new fuel filter had to break in. After replacing the fuel filer yesterday....I noticed that it had a lot more power today...so maybe my fuel filter was partially clogged. When I pulled up here just a bit ago...I popped the hood to make sure I didn't see anything wet around the fuel filter housing....and I didn't...so it doesn't look like I have a leak at the filter housing. When I get home later today...I really want to inspect the rest of the fuel lines to see if there are any leaks there...while it isn't running as bad...it still bucks every now and agian.

On a side note, one thing I did notice is when I had my trans pan bolt fixed...they had to reseal the pan...which of course meant draining out all the old fluid and putting new in. Now I noticed on the paperwork they put 7 quarts back in....didn't i hear somewhere that our tranny takes 9 quarts? The other day I did a hot check and it was on the lower hole in the hot range....I have an extra two quarts of ATF+4 "with shudder guard". What do you all think...should I try to add a quart and see if things improve? With all I have done...I am now really on the fence on whether this is tranny relatd or fuel related.

The shuddering happens at all speeds and is most apparent on the highway. Come on guys...tell me I am not going crazy here. :(
Author:  KenJennings [ Tue Apr 03, 2007 2:48 pm ]
Post subject: 
Can anyone explain how the Off Road Modification stops the tranny shudder? Before the Mod it used to happen on my CRD continuously between 45 and 55 with or without OverDrive on.

After the Mod I have to TRY HARD to make it act like it wants to shudder. (So, I'm not entirely convinced this version of stuttering is happening for the same reasons.) The only way I can make it stutter/shudder is to: turn off OD, from zero or low speed stomp on the accelerator, once it reaches 45 turn on cruise control and OD and remove foot from accelerator. After the tranny downshifts the CRD will bump about three times and then settle down to its normal, happy self.

Or is there some other factor that induces shudder with the MAF operating which only appears to be like the tranny shudder?
Author:  CHessMaster [ Tue Apr 03, 2007 4:19 pm ]
Post subject: 
KenJennings wrote:
Can anyone explain how the Off Road Modification stops the tranny shudder? Before the Mod it used to happen on my CRD continuously between 45 and 55 with or without OverDrive on.

After the Mod I have to TRY HARD to make it act like it wants to shudder. (So, I'm not entirely convinced this version of stuttering is happening for the same reasons.) The only way I can make it stutter/shudder is to: turn off OD, from zero or low speed stomp on the accelerator, once it reaches 45 turn on cruise control and OD and remove foot from accelerator. After the tranny downshifts the CRD will bump about three times and then settle down to its normal, happy self.

Or is there some other factor that induces shudder with the MAF operating which only appears to be like the tranny shudder?


It was never the transmission/TC in the first place. The original OD on/off shudder was/is definitely a engine surge as proved by the ORM.

I would guess to say that your new surging, as described above, is probably air in the fuel line or a partially plugged fuel filter, most likely air.
Author:  no-blue-screen [ Tue Apr 03, 2007 5:28 pm ]
Post subject: 
Yep, it has to be air because I did the famous mod everyone has been talking about....of course I only tested it "off road" and while it seems to run smoother it is still not right.
Author:  no-blue-screen [ Tue Apr 03, 2007 9:27 pm ]
Post subject: 
Well, I guess I have to take it like a man. Guess what....the new fuel filter wasn't screwed on tight enough. It wasn't leaking fuel, but I guess it was enough to let some air in. Anyway, when I got home from work today I took all the plugs off and slipped my filter wrench on it and gave it some more torque. After that I primed and bled again. As soon as I started it I knew....it was idling so smooth that I couldn't even tell it was running. Also, the power is back :D

So the conclusion I guess is that my original filter was partially clogged causing the poor performance in the first place, then when I put the new one on...I didn't tighten it down enough and air was getting in...who would have thought. Anyway, just wanted to post what I found out. I guess I was pulling my hair out over nothing but I am sure glad I was.

Yes, I am an idiot for not double-checking the filter for tightness.
Author:  Stan Wright [ Tue Apr 03, 2007 10:51 pm ]
Post subject: 
We've all had our blonde moments. :)

Thanks for posting your findings. At least now we know what symptoms a loose fuel filter causes.
Author:  Joe Romas [ Wed Apr 04, 2007 7:20 am ]
Post subject: 
I've not done any off roading yet so I've not tried the ORM :lol: But I'm 99% sure air in the filter is causing the bucking/stutteer thing. It also causes a very long lag starting from a stop in addition to less power. Remember the filter is in a vacume in the fuel system, NOT PRESSURE. Therefore you'll not see fuel leaking unless you have a really bad leak. Of course you'll not be able to see air leaking in :roll: When the amount of air in the filter gets high I suspect it getts into the pump on the engine causing it to cavatate. Sometimes I think the air is somehow purged without having to bleed the system :?: I suspect we all have a fitting, hose, gasket or whatever that in certain conditions like heat or cold, stress on a fuel line or whatever that's allowing air to get in. And based on other's experience I suspection the fuel filter bracket assemblie. Maybe the gasket between the heater and bracket as someone here thinks.
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