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Aftermarket Radiator?
http://www.lostjeeps.com/forum/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=33515		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  SCOTT'S-05CRD [ Sat Jun 21, 2008 11:20 am ]
Post subject:  Aftermarket Radiator?
Recently have had overheating problems in my '05 CRD while pulling a trailer in the desert South West (NM, AZ, So Cal). I have 110,000 miles on my Jeep, and have done all services regularly. Just had a full system flush and fill at 100,000 miles with the Timing Belt. Never seen this problem before except towing in the heat. Believe the Radiator is undersized for the heavy thermal load I am putting on the system in the extreme heat here in the South West.

I anyone aware of an aftermarket radiator that provides better cooling capacity for the extreme conditions?
Author:  warp2diesel [ Sat Jun 21, 2008 11:57 am ]
Post subject:  Engineer your own, it is simple
First stop by the sporting goods shop and pick up a human silhouette target. Next draw a jar of beans on the target go to the range and put a lot of holes in it until you feel really good.
Now that the bean counter is out of the picture, don't let the bolt on choices limit you. The only limiting factors is the amount of room you have to fit in the largest radiator that will go. Pull out the stock radiator and measure the available space. Note where the pipes connect and go to the local junk yard and look at some trucks with copper/brass radiators and find the type of end tanks that will work. Don't be afraid to relocate the pipes where you attach the hoses. If the tanks have a radiator cap, solder on a copper plate. Hold the tanks in place and figure out the size of core you can cram in with the maximum number of rows. Order the core and put it together. Now you have a mega radiator. The only reason plastic/aluminum radiators are used is to cut costs.
If doing the junk yard tank mods is not acceptable, go to your radiator shop and look into having a bigger or thicker core crimped onto your existing tanks. Make sure you have either option pressure tested, play it safe.

I did this trick when I put the 354 Perkins turbo into my '73 Chevy. I only needed the electric fans when I had the AC on when it was up to 120f and hauling a load. How did the '73 get factory air? I swapped it out of a '74 2wd Blazer, did the fire wall mod and it worked great even when converted to 134A.
Author:  SBosco [ Sat Jun 21, 2008 12:13 pm ]
Post subject: 
Before you go through that drastic of a change, I would try some cooling additives first. I recently added the Royal purple brand "purple ice" but Redline also makes similar additives called "water wetter" and "diesel water wetter".

I will let you know if I notice any difference, but I am not in as hot of a climate and do not frequently pull heavy loads. I also just added it to a 50/50 mix of dexcool. Purple Ice states on the bottle that using a higher water to coolant ratio with purple ice increases it's effectiveness.
Author:  gmctd [ Sat Jun 21, 2008 2:34 pm ]
Post subject: 
Clean the detritus from the condenser, c\a cooler, and radiator fins, ensure the aux towing fan is functional, then unplug your viscous coolant heater...................
Author:  DOC4444 [ Sat Jun 21, 2008 4:26 pm ]
Post subject:  Radiator
GM,

I thought the viscous heater clutch only engages below 35 deg F. (I take the relay out in the winter, but put it back in the summer in case my wife has to go the dealer unexpectedly. One less thing to catch their eye regarding the waranty.) If so, what might be gained by disconnecting in the summer?

DOC
Author:  warp2diesel [ Sat Jun 21, 2008 7:00 pm ]
Post subject:  Another thing to check
Since the upper hose is not at the top, there is an air bleed off in the top of the right tank. Make sure you dont have a big bubble in the radiator that reduces the coolant exposed to the colling fins.

When I looked at the width of the tanks I noticed that the core was thinner. A good radiator shop can install a thicker core with more rows of tubes just in case some one really needs more cooling capacity.
Author:  Threeweight [ Sat Jun 21, 2008 7:30 pm ]
Post subject: 
Have you done the ORM mod, or SEGR mod? Both will dramatically reduce the thermal load on your cooling system without doing anything to the radiator.
Author:  ATXKJ [ Sat Jun 21, 2008 8:03 pm ]
Post subject: 
on the biggest space you can measure - Summit has universal Aluminum radiators.

http://store.summitracing.com/egnsearch.asp?Ntt=radiator+universal&N=700+400001+115+4294839040&NeXID=5&Ntk=KeywordSearch
Author:  fastRob [ Sat Jun 21, 2008 10:49 pm ]
Post subject:  What, Where is the Condenser, C/A cooler, Viscous Heater?
gmctd wrote:
Clean the detritus from the condenser, c\a cooler, and radiator fins, ensure the aux towing fan is functional, then unplug your viscous coolant heater...................


I still have a lot to learn on this baby.
Will someone help me out?
Author:  tulsa [ Sat Jun 21, 2008 10:58 pm ]
Post subject: 
Are you sure the coolant temperature was as hot as the gauge said? There have been reports of false temperature spikes on the dash gauge.

Lewis
Author:  Joe Romas [ Sun Jun 22, 2008 7:31 am ]
Post subject:  Re: What, Where is the Condenser, C/A cooler, Viscous Heate
fastRob wrote:
gmctd wrote:
Clean the detritus from the condenser, c\a cooler, and radiator fins, ensure the aux towing fan is functional, then unplug your viscous coolant heater...................


I still have a lot to learn on this baby.
Will someone help me out?


The AC's condenser unit is ahead of the radiator. The Viscous heater is on the passanger side of the engine and has what looks like a AC clutch on it :lol: I once owned a 86 diesel jetta that overheated badly. As a last resort I replaced the head gasket and it got even hotter :oops: While pondering my delema I was pressure washing the engine and by chanch I got the radiator. The amount of bug bodies that came out was unbelievable as they were out of site between the condensor and radiator :wink: The next problem was how to get it to warm up :shock:
Author:  ATXKJ [ Sun Jun 22, 2008 8:34 am ]
Post subject: 
be real careful about pressure washing the radiator -the fins aren't strong - they can bend with water pressure
Author:  Joe Romas [ Sun Jun 22, 2008 9:27 am ]
Post subject: 
ATXKJ wrote:
be real careful about pressure washing the radiator -the fins aren't strong - they can bend with water pressure


Very true. My pressure washer is capable of removing paint from a car :shock:
Author:  Pablo [ Sun Jun 22, 2008 2:27 pm ]
Post subject: 
If you want to avoid spending money, there are a bunch of things you could try before fitting a different radiator.

The ORM/SEGR helps the temps. It reduces the load on the coolant system. I have heard some people say by up to 60% as the hot exhaust gas is not going back into the engine.

Do you have a scanguage or a ODBII scanner to make sure it is the water temp that is overheating and that it is not load from the trans temp? I am not sure but think the factory gauge has some interesting ideas about what overheating is and is not. I often wonder what it reads-- It seems to go up when the water temp stays about the same according to the Scanguage and my trans temp indicator on the dash is going way up. Taking it easy drops the trans temp and the temp gauge goes back down. So I am not sure it only measures coolant temp, or the trans temp is spiking the coolant temp as well.

If it is the trans temp spiking, I would do an external trans cooler. It is much cheaper than a radiator at any rate. You may also take off the insulation on the hood during the summer and remove the rubber seal where the rear of the hood meets the firewall. The seal simply unsnaps, it is not glued down. You can put both back on later. Once you do this, however, you get to run the ac in recirc or you will pull in very hot air. I have found this reduces temps under the hood (infrared temp gun) by helping hot air escape out the top, You really need to do both, not just one as the insulation gets in the way of the opening created by removing the seal, however. If you are towing it may make a significant difference as that turbo is way hot and that hot air is building up under there.

I have noticed in summer that the turbo takes much longer to cool down, especially with the ac on. I hope you are waiting before shutting it down. In the winter I did not need to wait, but in summer it takes 30 seconds with the ac off before the TOT drops below 500 and a minute or more with the ac on. That is not with a trailer, and around 112 F. Hood louvers and a bigger exhaust maybe in the future for me.
Author:  onthehunt [ Sun Jun 22, 2008 9:26 pm ]
Post subject: 
Quote:
I will let you know if I notice any difference, but I am not in as hot of a climate and do not frequently pull heavy loads. I also just added it to a 50/50 mix of dexcool. Purple Ice states on the bottle that using a higher water to coolant ratio with purple ice increases it's effectiveness.


Hope you remembered to add proper amount of sca's to the coolant, about 3.2ppm. You do know even GM has stopped using dex-cool. Many lawsuits and some real good reading on dex-cool is avaliable.
Author:  tjkj2002 [ Sun Jun 22, 2008 9:34 pm ]
Post subject: 
You should not use Dexacool(OAT coolant),not even after a complet flush,in your CRD,if anything it is better to run the old green stuff(IAT coolant,has silicats) over Dex.Newer Chrysler's(and Fords) where engineered to run with HOAT coolants with high silicates which Dexacool/universal coolants does not have,thus you can damage cooling system components using the wrong coolant.
Author:  SCOTT'S-05CRD [ Mon Jun 23, 2008 11:02 am ]
Post subject: 
Had the Timimg Belt done by the Dealer that I have been using. They also did the flush and fill, so I am fairly confident the job was done right. By the way, I went through 4 different Dealers until I found one that was competent wroking on the CRD. And I've had my share of problems (Three Torque Converters and new HO Trans Pump, Cracked Fuel Filter Housing, Bad EGR Valve, Two bad TCM Modules, Stripped Oil Pan Plug (2 times, once by a "Five Star" Dealer while I was travelling), and so much other I just can't remember anymore). But I still love this thing, and I've gotten 110,000+ miles on it, with no sign of it quitting since all the other STUFF (insert different word) has been fixed. I will hook up my OBD II Scan Tool (bought this because I got tired of mystery Check Engine Light) once I get home again, and see what it reads. I'm just going to drive nights in the Desert, until I hit cooler temps. I will get the Radiator power washed here in So Cal before I start my trip back to PA.

Will let everyone know what I find out.

And thanks to everyone for your input and advise.
Author:  danoid [ Wed Jun 25, 2008 11:31 am ]
Post subject: 
The dasboard gage for engine temperature is about as honest as the fuel gage and shouldn't be interpreted as a linear reading of coolant temperature. If it's in the middle, coolant temperature is within 'normal' operation. When it starts to go to 3/4 you are approching about 210°-215°. Around this point your hydraulic fan should kick in occasionally. When I'm towing my camper (no need to post the picture again - trust me it's big) my hydraulic fan cycles on and off and I consider that normal. You should be able to hear the roar, if you don't, get the fan clutch inspected.

If that isn't enough and your coolant temp is still increasing, around 230° you will hear a chime from the dashboard (and maybe a light I don't remember) and around 235° you will notice decreased engine power. About now you should start thinking about backing off.

If you don't, the engine will for you to protect itself.

Things I've done to help are:

Low pressure powerwash of the front end. Keep hosing all the heat exchangers from front and rear and underneath until the runoff water is clear. It's amazing how much dust and dirt can accumulate in there.

Keep the torque converter locked at all possible times. If you're towing below 50 mph or can't maintain lockup in 4th gear, hit OD off to lock the torque converter and keep the transmission in third. This is an immediate 10% benefit in driveline efficiency (less engine power needed) and probably about an 80% reduction in heat generated by the transmission.

Remove engine cover. No proof if this helps, but it certainly can't hurt underhood airflow.

Remove the seal strip for the back of the hood. This is a double edged sword and again no proof if it helps. The upside is you'll get better airflow for the radiator. The downside is that the cabin air intake (the base of the windshield) is now bathed in hot air, increasing your need for air conditioning. I think a better solution is some functional hood louvers but I haven't done that yet.
Author:  RedStapler [ Thu Jun 26, 2008 6:08 am ]
Post subject: 
Threeweight wrote:
Have you done the ORM mod, or SEGR mod? Both will dramatically reduce the thermal load on your cooling system without doing anything to the radiator.


I 2nd that.

I had my KJ at the dealer last week for a free detail (long story) and I plugged in the air sensor. I noticed the fan clutch coming on much more until I unplugged again it this morning.

In the class 8 world when EGR 1st became standard in 2002 all sorts of parts under the hood were getting cooked by the much higher temps and failing prematurely.
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