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GDE Tune/ MAP Sensor
http://www.lostjeeps.com/forum/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=48155		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  linewarbr [ Mon Nov 30, 2009 11:02 am ]
Post subject:  GDE Tune/ MAP Sensor
Did regular maintenance on the CRD on Friday, so I pulled the MAP sensor to make sure it was nice and clean. I have been running the GDE Tune for 20,000 miles now, and - I am happy to report - the MAP sensor was as clean as it was when I was running ORM and EHM.

I sprayed it with chlorine-free brake cleaner because. . . well, I went to all that trouble to get it out, so I was going to do something with it, right? It was spic and span. Just some info for those who are troubled by the idea that the GDE tune does not 100% disable the EGR valve.
Author:  LocoCRD [ Mon Nov 30, 2009 3:29 pm ]
Post subject: 
Yep any way of reducing the EGR will cut down on the soot component that is soiling the MAP. However neither the SEGR or the GDE tune can do anything about the oil component from the poor factory CCV. Are you no longer using the EHM or some other means of CCV abatement? If not I can't see how the MAP was as clean as when you were running the ORM and EHM, GDE tune or not.
Author:  flman [ Mon Nov 30, 2009 6:41 pm ]
Post subject: 
Why do you need to worry about the oil in the intake? As a previous owner of a couple of TDI's I found disabling the EGR was all you needed to do. The oil never cause a build up, if any thing the detergent in it would help clean the MAP as well as any residue left in the Manifold from the EGR before it was disabled.
Author:  nursecosmo [ Mon Nov 30, 2009 7:29 pm ]
Post subject: 
My EGR has been disabled for more than 60k miles. I've not had any buildup on it since then. It is just wet with oil, which doesn't hurt anything. As far as anyone being concerned about oil building up in the intercooler, remember that there is more than 11200 CFM of hot air blasting through it during WOT. Trust me, there is NO oil pooling in the intercooler or anywhere else in the intake.
Author:  Joe Romas [ Mon Nov 30, 2009 9:37 pm ]
Post subject: 
flman wrote:
Why do you need to worry about the oil in the intake?


I've been told the oil causes deposits to build up on the injector tips :shock:
Author:  LocoCRD [ Mon Nov 30, 2009 10:33 pm ]
Post subject: 
flman wrote:
Why do you need to worry about the oil in the intake? As a previous owner of a couple of TDI's I found disabling the EGR was all you needed to do. The oil never cause a build up, if any thing the detergent in it would help clean the MAP as well as any residue left in the Manifold from the EGR before it was disabled.
Well tell you what, ask any body who runs a Provent or other catch can if they would want the gunk that ends up in it run through their intake, starting at the turbo. You have to remember it is not just oil, but any other moisture that happens to be condensed in the CCV gas. I doubt you'll get anybody to say they would, but as my wife tells me I've been wrong once or twice...today.
Author:  nursecosmo [ Tue Dec 01, 2009 4:15 am ]
Post subject: 
Joe Romas wrote:
flman wrote:
Why do you need to worry about the oil in the intake?


I've been told the oil causes deposits to build up on the injector tips :shock:


But have you seen it. Why would it build up there and no where else in the combustion chamber? Injector tips can get deposits from fuel as well, however modern common rail injectors seldom get any kind of buildup at all. So far no one has reported buildup on any CRD injector tips.
Author:  nursecosmo [ Tue Dec 01, 2009 4:31 am ]
Post subject: 
LocoCRD wrote:
flman wrote:
Why do you need to worry about the oil in the intake? As a previous owner of a couple of TDI's I found disabling the EGR was all you needed to do. The oil never cause a build up, if any thing the detergent in it would help clean the MAP as well as any residue left in the Manifold from the EGR before it was disabled.
Well tell you what, ask any body who runs a Provent or other catch can if they would want the gunk that ends up in it run through their intake, starting at the turbo. You have to remember it is not just oil, but any other moisture that happens to be condensed in the CCV gas. I doubt you'll get anybody to say they would, but as my wife tells me I've been wrong once or twice...today.


Listen to your wife. Why would the moisture which comes out of the CCV be any worse for the turbo or intake than any of the other moisture which gets sucked into the engine. The crankcase condensation which makes it into the intake is only a microscopic fraction of the literally tons of humidity which is drawn into the engine from the atmosphere. one drive on a rainy day gets more water through the turbo than it gets during it's entire life from the CCV. The small amount of oil from the CCV keeps the intercooler and turbo from corroding away. The only thing really harmed by the oil are the CAC hoses. Of course they are not in the least bit protected by having a provent installed as has been well atested here on the forum. If the EGR is left operational then lookout, because the combination of soot and oil makes a nice paste which gets thicker and thicker.
Author:  linewarbr [ Tue Dec 01, 2009 9:42 am ]
Post subject: 
LocoCRD wrote:
Are you no longer using the EHM or some other means of CCV abatement? If not I can't see how the MAP was as clean as when you were running the ORM and EHM, GDE tune or not.


I am running a Mann-Hummel Provent now instead of EHM. Makes me feel greener. . . ? :mrgreen:

flman wrote:
Why do you need to worry about the oil in the intake?


It does cause a potential risk to the integrity of the boost hoses to have the crankcase oil present, with all it's associated additives and acids, etc.
Author:  nursecosmo [ Tue Dec 01, 2009 10:30 am ]
Post subject: 
linewarbr wrote:

flman wrote:
Why do you need to worry about the oil in the intake?


It does cause a potential risk to the integrity of the boost hoses to have the crankcase oil present, with all it's associated additives and acids, etc.


Just as many of those with the provent as those without have had the CAC hoses blow. The provent (and similar) can't remove all of the oil vapor.
Author:  LocoCRD [ Tue Dec 01, 2009 11:50 am ]
Post subject: 
So answer my question then, you pouring that crap back in your intake or motor? Why not if it won't hurt anything? Hell if thats the case why don't you pull off your provent if your tune makes it a redundant system? I just don't see the logic of pumping it throught the intake, having it coating the IC and hoses and pooling at any low points. Have you ever removed your IC and flushed it out? I have and not only was it a pain in the rear but there was quite a bit of sludge in there pre-EHM/provent. Take it for what its worth, although I'll add this disclaimer...I did not stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night nor do I have a GDE tune so I guess I'm not qualified to share my opinion.
Author:  RJM [ Tue Dec 01, 2009 2:38 pm ]
Post subject: 
nursecosmo wrote:
My EGR has been disabled for more than 60k miles. I've not had any buildup on it since then. It is just wet with oil, which doesn't hurt anything. As far as anyone being concerned about oil building up in the intercooler, remember that there is more than 11200 CFM of hot air blasting through it during WOT. Trust me, there is NO oil pooling in the intercooler or anywhere else in the intake.


Sorry man I don't trust your judgement. I have taken mine apart, yes oil does pool in the intercooler! and yes oil does pool in the intake boost hose just before the FCV!
Author:  nursecosmo [ Tue Dec 01, 2009 7:36 pm ]
Post subject: 
LocoCRD wrote:
So answer my question then, you pouring that crap back in your intake or motor? Why not if it won't hurt anything? Hell if thats the case why don't you pull off your provent if your tune makes it a redundant system? I just don't see the logic of pumping it throught the intake, having it coating the IC and hoses and pooling at any low points. Have you ever removed your IC and flushed it out? I have and not only was it a pain in the rear but there was quite a bit of sludge in there pre-EHM/provent. Take it for what its worth, although I'll add this disclaimer...I did not stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night nor do I have a GDE tune so I guess I'm not qualified to share my opinion.


I no longer use a catch can. It was too much of a pain to constantly be checking it, especially in the winter. When My EGR was functional, it did indeed have some pretty disgusting crud building up in the duct work, but once the soot element was removed from the equation, everything stayed nice and wet and the crud was washed out by the oil. Have you looked at your intake since installing your provent? There is still moist oily residue coating the interior surfaces of the hoses and IC. Rubber hoses are still being attacked by said residue, although the new Chrysler hoses seem to hold up much better than the original ones.
Author:  nursecosmo [ Tue Dec 01, 2009 7:51 pm ]
Post subject: 
RJM wrote:
nursecosmo wrote:
My EGR has been disabled for more than 60k miles. I've not had any buildup on it since then. It is just wet with oil, which doesn't hurt anything. As far as anyone being concerned about oil building up in the intercooler, remember that there is more than 11200 CFM of hot air blasting through it during WOT. Trust me, there is NO oil pooling in the intercooler or anywhere else in the intake.


Sorry man I don't trust your judgement. I have taken mine apart, yes oil does pool in the intercooler! and yes oil does pool in the intake boost hose just before the FCV!


I should have qualified that statement with saying that there is no pooling which impedes airflow through the system. There is some minor pooling in my own system. In fact it is quite wet with oil, but it has never built up to the point where it impedes flow. There is just too much airflow through the hoses and IC which blows the oil through the system. As long as the EGR isn't adding soot back into the mix, there isn't any sludging occurring. It took many thousand miles for the oil to soften up and wash out the sludge after I disabled my EGR but it did happen. The various catch cans don't stop all oil making it into the intake. They just reduce the amount that makes it through.
Author:  UFO [ Tue Dec 01, 2009 7:57 pm ]
Post subject: 
^^^
Couldn't agree more.
Author:  flman [ Wed Dec 02, 2009 9:34 pm ]
Post subject: 
nursecosmo wrote:
Joe Romas wrote:
flman wrote:
Why do you need to worry about the oil in the intake?


I've been told the oil causes deposits to build up on the injector tips :shock:


But have you seen it. Why would it build up there and no where else in the combustion chamber? Injector tips can get deposits from fuel as well, however modern common rail injectors seldom get any kind of buildup at all. So far no one has reported buildup on any CRD injector tips.


With over 10,000 PSI, I doubt any thing inside the combustion area is gong to build up on the Injectors exterior, I have never heard of it in my entire life.
Author:  RJM [ Thu Dec 03, 2009 1:14 pm ]
Post subject: 
IMO the components of the air intake are designed for air. Take for example the air filter box to turbo hose. If you have been running sans CCV filter you may want to remove and check the underside where the CCV hose is plumbed into it. several have had the oil chew a goodly size hole in it allowing unfiltered air to enter the turbo and engine without the MAF setting a code and going undetected for quite some time. Whats that worth? I dunno. I guess I had to ask myself what else is oil disolving down the line? As far as the filters only removing a portion of the oil, I do agree. I found the that Provent filter once saturated started allowing oil back into the intake track. Along with numerous problems in the winter I got rid of it and designed my own, which to date and after 10000 miles plus has allowed no oil back in. Just my 2bits
remember: "An ounce of Provention is worth a pound of cure" Hee Hee
Author:  RJM [ Thu Dec 03, 2009 1:14 pm ]
Post subject: 
IMO the components of the air intake are designed for air. Take for example the air filter box to turbo hose. If you have been running sans CCV filter you may want to remove and check the underside where the CCV hose is plumbed into it. several have had the oil chew a goodly size hole in it allowing unfiltered air to enter the turbo and engine without the MAF setting a code and going undetected for quite some time. Whats that worth? I dunno. I guess I had to ask myself what else is oil disolving down the line? As far as the filters only removing a portion of the oil, I do agree. I found the that Provent filter once saturated started allowing oil back into the intake track. Along with numerous problems in the winter I got rid of it and designed my own, which to date and after 10000 miles plus has allowed no oil back in. Just my 2bits
remember: "An ounce of Provention is worth a pound of cure" Hee Hee
Author:  RJM [ Thu Dec 03, 2009 1:15 pm ]
Post subject: 
IMO the components of the air intake are designed for air. Take for example the air filter box to turbo hose. If you have been running sans CCV filter you may want to remove and check the underside where the CCV hose is plumbed into it. several have had the oil chew a goodly size hole in it allowing unfiltered air to enter the turbo and engine without the MAF setting a code and going undetected for quite some time. Whats that worth? I dunno. I guess I had to ask myself what else is oil disolving down the line? As far as the filters only removing a portion of the oil, I do agree. I found the that Provent filter once saturated started allowing oil back into the intake track. Along with numerous problems in the winter I got rid of it and designed my own, which to date and after 10000 miles plus has allowed no oil back in. Just my 2bits
remember: "An ounce of Provention is worth a pound of cure" Hee Hee
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