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Carbon fiber and high temperature epoxy CAC hoses
http://www.lostjeeps.com/forum/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=55441		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  Squeeto [ Tue Sep 07, 2010 1:03 pm ]
Post subject:  Carbon fiber and high temperature epoxy CAC hoses
I am still hoping for stainless steel CAC hoses to be designed, built, bought, sent to me :wink:

What do you think of carbon fiber and high temperature (500 F) epoxy CAC hoses?
We could probably build these ourselves.
Author:  flman [ Tue Sep 07, 2010 5:34 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Carbon fiber and high temperature epoxy CAC hoses
Squeeto wrote:
I am still hoping for stainless steel CAC hoses to be designed, built, bought, sent to me :wink:

What do you think of carbon fiber and high temperature (500 F) epoxy CAC hoses?
We could probably build these ourselves.


OTR trucks use aluminum tubes with silicone connectors, and they are not know for blowing out.
Author:  Squeeto [ Tue Sep 07, 2010 6:22 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Carbon fiber and high temperature epoxy CAC hoses
flman wrote:

OTR trucks use aluminum tubes with silicone connectors, and they are not know for blowing out.

I was hoping that this would progress but as soon a thread starts on this idea, it ends. I don't have the tools to bend 2 inch aluminum pipe, that is why I was thinking carbon fiber.
Author:  flman [ Tue Sep 07, 2010 6:33 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Carbon fiber and high temperature epoxy CAC hoses
Squeeto wrote:
flman wrote:

OTR trucks use aluminum tubes with silicone connectors, and they are not know for blowing out.

I was hoping that this would progress but as soon a thread starts on this idea, it ends. I don't have the tools to bend 2 inch aluminum pipe, that is why I was thinking carbon fiber.


So go find some one that does mandrel bending, would be alot less money then carbon fiber. The cost of carbon fiber would buy you many sets of Samcos or OEM hoses, over the life of the Jeep you would never see the pay back of carbon fiber.

Or you could do the EHM and the heat of the turbo would never cause the hose to rip in that spot where it always tears :ROTFL: :ROTFL: :ROTFL:
Author:  warp2diesel [ Tue Sep 07, 2010 7:10 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Carbon fiber and high temperature epoxy CAC hoses
Carbon fiber may be hard to clean out the inside to keep from dusting out your engine, you may need to coat the inside like you would fiberglass. Aluminum you just need to flush out with brake cleaner or other solvent and be done. Stainless needs to be passivated with acid to remove any surface iron that may flake off. Citric Acid, Phosphoric acid, or Nitric Acid will work. Citric acid is easy to get and use since it is used in Soda Pop even safe to drink, Phosphoric acid is used in products like Naval Jelly and other uses, Nitric Acid is commonly used to make explosives, so you may want to think twice about using Nitric Acid unless you like talking to Federal Law Enforcement and love trying to explain to them what you are doing with Nitric Acid. I am not saying you can't convince them you are legitimate, but why waste your time dealing with the Feds just to save a few seconds in the passivation process.
Aluminum dissipates heat but Stainless Steel absorbs heat, since you want to cool the charge air down, aluminum is a better choice and weighs less.
Author:  tjkj2002 [ Tue Sep 07, 2010 9:46 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Carbon fiber and high temperature epoxy CAC hoses
Having them molded out of some sort of plastic composite would be the best as it will not absorb as much underhood heat like stainless or aluminum will and cost alot less then carbon fiber.

I use a composite plastic intake tube which I then wrapped with header wrap,great for keeping heat in so it also is great for keeping heat out and my AIT temps went down a full 25-40 degrees after wraping it with header wrap and the composite tube alone dropped the AIT temps 10-15 degrees alone over the OEM setup.
Author:  salden77 [ Tue Sep 07, 2010 9:46 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Carbon fiber and high temperature epoxy CAC hoses
I would think the turbo would sound much better hard piped :rockon:
Author:  Squeeto [ Wed Sep 08, 2010 7:45 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Carbon fiber and high temperature epoxy CAC hoses
warp2diesel wrote:
.. you may need to coat the inside like you would fiberglass.


How is this done for fiberglass?
The epoxy for carbon is probably harder than the resin for glass.
Author:  warp2diesel [ Wed Sep 08, 2010 8:18 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Carbon fiber and high temperature epoxy CAC hoses
Squeeto wrote:
warp2diesel wrote:
.. you may need to coat the inside like you would fiberglass.


How is this done for fiberglass?
The epoxy for carbon is probably harder than the resin for glass.

They brush it on most of the time, I don't know if it can be sprayed on. Most likely you would put the liquid into the tube and rotate the tube to distribute it onto the inside surface.
The strongest epoxy I have worked with is 17,000 PSI tensile strength. There are fiberglass resins that are about the same tensile strength. The fiber glass or carbon fiber adds to the strength just like re-bar adds to the strength of concrete.

Since you are not working with high pressures using plastic might be the most cost effective. The killer with plastic is the cost of the mold. If you could round up the straight sections and elbows, you could have the connections ultrasonic welded.
Again, you could buy a bunch of Samcos for what it would cost to get the job done unless your are planning to make thousands of them.

One obscure way to make the carbon fiber would be to pour some investment wax into a formed boost hose that is well supported. Cut the hose off the core and use the core to make a mold. Then use the mold to make more cores so you don't destroy a set of boost hoses every time. Then form your carbon fiber over the core and melt the wax out and reuse it.

Good luck.
Author:  Squeeto [ Wed Sep 08, 2010 9:06 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Carbon fiber and high temperature epoxy CAC hoses
Quote:
Carbon fiber may be hard to clean out the inside to keep from dusting out your engine, you may need to coat the inside like you would fiberglass.


Sorry, I meant with what is the fiberglass/polyester resin coated to keep it from dusting the engine.
I assumed you meant that the resin may wind erode into the engine?

I have made fiberglass parts by wrapping sanded (and resin protected) polystyrene (styrofoam) and melting it out after curing with acetone. This is not too hard to do.
Author:  warp2diesel [ Wed Sep 08, 2010 11:40 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Carbon fiber and high temperature epoxy CAC hoses
Squeeto wrote:
Quote:
Carbon fiber may be hard to clean out the inside to keep from dusting out your engine, you may need to coat the inside like you would fiberglass.


Sorry, I meant with what is the fiberglass/polyester resin coated to keep it from dusting the engine.
I assumed you meant that the resin may wind erode into the engine?

I have made fiberglass parts by wrapping sanded (and resin protected) polystyrene (styrofoam) and melting it out after curing with acetone. This is not too hard to do.


Gel coat should seal it up OK.
Styrofoam would work too, guess I was wrapped up in investment casting from my Gunsmith stuff I can still do if my Klingon Wife (Red Head) ever lets me have any time at home. Can't bring that hobby along on the road, all the tools weight too much to put into my checked luggage and parts that look like firearms make the TSA (airline security people) give you strange looks.
Now that I tipped my hand, the best Polyester Resin I have worked with is AccraGlass from Brownells of Montezuma, IA.
I don't know if they export that stuff to Canada, but if you hijacked the specs from their literature, i will bet someone in QC could come up with the same stuff. Brownells got it from the Air Craft industry and it is used to fix broken gun stocks, works great. Once I repaired the place on a twelve string guitar where the tuners mount, worked until my Son's room mate dropped the guitar onto the top of where the tuners mount. The AccraGlass did not fail, but it broke in a new place. Some day I will fix it and give it back to my son, if my Wife ever gives any time. She is yelling now.
Author:  Squeeto [ Thu Sep 09, 2010 12:15 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Carbon fiber and high temperature epoxy CAC hoses
Yelling Klingon Wife :lol:
Actually I have a mixed marriage too :wink:.
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