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Dr-Performance
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Author:  BlackLibertyCRD [ Fri Feb 17, 2006 9:05 pm ]
Post subject:  Dr-Performance
Has anyone tried this promance chip. If so does it do what it claims?

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/DR-PERFO ... 3770QQrdZ1
Author:  fireman1028 [ Fri Feb 17, 2006 10:18 pm ]
Post subject: 
there are quite a few posts about it.
Do a search and it should answer most of your questions.

Allen
Author:  pipefactory [ Sat Feb 18, 2006 9:26 am ]
Post subject: 
Have had one on my CRD for about 300 miles. Does exactly what they claim as far as I can tell with mine. I'm not sure about the fuel mileage yet as we have had a lot of cold weather up here in Wisconsin and mine does a lot of idling. It realy helps pulling my 5x8 trailor. I unhooked it to go to the dealership and didn't like the way it felt without it.






http://www.cardomain.com/ride/2254161
Author:  pierce1979 [ Sat Feb 18, 2006 12:29 pm ]
Post subject: 
So what's better, this or the digi tuner? What is easy to install? What is the safest for the CRD? lots of questions :)
Author:  pipefactory [ Sat Feb 18, 2006 3:17 pm ]
Post subject: 
Predator took 3 minutes to install. Just unplug the fuel rail sensor & plug the predator between the sensor and the harness. They say the computor doesn't know it's there. So far so good for mine. Also you can wire in a toggle switch to turn it on and off real easy.




2005 CRD Black
Plow & 9500# Winch
Front Hitch
Custom Fabed 2" Receiver Licence Plate Bracket
3" billit lift
245/75-16" Bridgestone Rivo's.
Predator Performance Module.
Wifes
2004 Jeep Liberty Columbia Addition.
Front Hitch
3" lift. Built by Me
Author:  oldnavy [ Sat Feb 18, 2006 4:33 pm ]
Post subject: 
So does this work by increasing rail pressure? I am not sure I like that idea or not, I'm not crazy about increasing boost pressure either. I like the idea of increasing fuel, the duration of the fueling seems like the best to me because I'm not real up on Common Rail diesel.
Author:  pipefactory [ Sat Feb 18, 2006 6:59 pm ]
Post subject: 
Here is the simulation on what takes place with the module. I like the idea that it gets a total burn and not sending flames past

http://www.kmdieselperformance.com/predator.html
2005 CRD Black
Plow & 9500# Winch
Front Hitch
Custom Fabed 2" Receiver Licence Plate Bracket
3" billit lift
245/75-16" Bridgestone Rivo's.
Predator Performance Module.
Wifes
2004 Jeep Liberty Columbia Addition.
Front Hitch
3" lift. Built by Me
Author:  BlackLibertyCRD [ Sat Feb 18, 2006 8:44 pm ]
Post subject: 
Good to hear it increase performance. I hear it suppose to pulse the injectors to get longer or more complete burn which sounds nice to me. Adding more fuel or rail pressure really concerns me on what could happen to the injectors or the life of the engine. Please keep all of us posted of the results for this seems that this could be a very good mod for the CRD.
Author:  pipefactory [ Thu Feb 23, 2006 9:54 pm ]
Post subject: 
I hooked up the on/off toggle switch to my predator module today. Works good now I can test to see if there is a differance in mileage with and without.


2005 CRD Black
Plow & 9500# Winch
Front Hitch
Custom Fabed 2" Receiver Licence Plate Bracket
3" billit lift
245/75-16" Bridgestone Rivo's.
Predator Performance Module.
Wifes
2004 Jeep Liberty Columbia Addition.
Front Hitch
3" lift. Built by Me
Author:  BlackLibertyCRD [ Thu Feb 23, 2006 11:43 pm ]
Post subject: 
Great, I can't wait for the results. :mrgreen:
Author:  BlackLibertyCRD [ Sun Feb 26, 2006 6:23 pm ]
Post subject: 
Look like I be getting one after all. Seller accepted my best offer of $399 that is so much better price than direct from Dr performance.


http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayI ... AMEWA%3AIT
Author:  pipefactory [ Sun Feb 26, 2006 10:10 pm ]
Post subject: 
BlackLibertyCRD wrote:
Look like I be getting one after all. Seller accepted my best offer of $399 that is so much better price than direct from Dr performance.


http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayI ... AMEWA%3AIT


Let me know when you get yours hooked up. I'm only engaging it for towing. I'm too adicted to the throttle to leave it on all the time.
Author:  retmil46 [ Sun Feb 26, 2006 11:32 pm ]
Post subject: 
According to the articles in TDR issues 47 and 48, the Predator is a pressure box, it will raise fuel pressure. When they tested the Dodge Cummins Stage 3 version, it raised rail pressure so high it pegged the installed factory pressure sensor.

How do they affect timing and duration, when it's only plugged into the fuel rail pressure sensor? They're using a method called pressure fooling. The module keeps sending a lowball pressure signal to the ECM, even after it's jacked fuel pressure as high as it can go. When the ECM keeps seeing this low pressure signal, the ECM then alters duration and timing to match what it's programming says will still inject the correct amount of fuel at the correct time given the pressure signal it's being fed. They're tricking the ECM into adjusting duration and timing.

If they were truly CONTROLLING duration and timing, their box would also plug into the camshaft and crankshaft position sensors, and into the injectors themselves at a minimum, or at least into the data link port where it can see all the sensor inputs into the ECM. Take a look at Banks, Edge, and TST Products. Check out their install instructions, which have pictures of the wiring harnesses with their setups. They're plugging into nearly every sensor on the engine.
Author:  oldnavy [ Mon Feb 27, 2006 9:50 am ]
Post subject: 
Mitch I hate to say this, but I think you might be wasting your breath here. The reason probably the Predator like devices sells so well is the ease of install of a pressure booster, the people adding these devices generally have little or no diesel experience or much in the line of general mechanical skills and are looking for an easy way to add power for as little dollar investment as possible and have succumbed to sales hype.

I have probably said more then I should and will have upset some as they will take my comments as a personal slam, although it is not intended that way by no means.
Author:  Guest [ Mon Feb 27, 2006 10:03 am ]
Post subject: 
oldnavy wrote:
Mitch I hate to say this, but I think you might be wasting your breath here. The reason probably the Predator like devices sells so well is the ease of install of a pressure booster, the people adding these devices generally have little or no diesel experience or much in the line of general mechanical skills and are looking for an easy way to add power for as little dollar investment as possible and have succumbed to sales hype.

I have probably said more then I should and will have upset some as they will take my comments as a personal slam, although it is not intended that way by no means.


I would thing these things are a pretty dangerous risk to take on a perfectly working brand new engine for the U.S. market. I know I'm WAY too chicken to ever try ANY computer performance modification reguardless of how many sensors there are. RISKY!!!
Author:  RTStabler51 [ Mon Feb 27, 2006 10:40 am ]
Post subject: 
oldnavy wrote:
Mitch I hate to say this, but I think you might be wasting your breath here. The reason probably the Predator like devices sells so well is the ease of install of a pressure booster, the people adding these devices generally have little or no diesel experience or much in the line of general mechanical skills and are looking for an easy way to add power for as little dollar investment as possible and have succumbed to sales hype.

I have probably said more then I should and will have upset some as they will take my comments as a personal slam, although it is not intended that way by no means.

Navy, I am new to diesels, but have done my share in the gas engine world....what performance module would you recommend that is being made or going to be made for the CRd? PM if need be. Thanks!

Also, how are they claiming better gas mileage if all they are doing is dumping more fuel into the engine? Wouldn't htat decrease mileage?
Author:  omniphil [ Mon Feb 27, 2006 11:26 am ]
Post subject: 
The ebay add says it adds 60HP? That seem kinda high?
Author:  retmil46 [ Mon Feb 27, 2006 1:35 pm ]
Post subject: 
There's probably nothing wrong with using some pressure boost, as long as it's within the factory limits for the engine. For example, say at 60 mph cruise factory fuel pressure is running at 8000 psi, the box bumps it up to 10,000 psi, and the max limit is 29,000 psi, there shouldn't be any negative effects.

However, from what I understand, the only time you'd normally see rail pressure anywhere close to this 29,000 psi limit is when the engine is trying to make full factory HP, ie WOT acceleration and/or heavy duty towing. Max rail pressure is something the engine would rarely see, under normal driving conditions it would run considerably less.

That's the big unknown, how high and for how long do these boxes jack the pressure up? Another unknown, where does the fuel pressure on the CRD run at for various conditions, even before you add on one of these boxes?

TDR tested 10 different modules, 6 of them were strictly pressure boxes, and 2 others used pressure along with other methods (timing and/or duration). Of the 6 pressure only boxes, none of the manufacturers would even say how high their modules would raise pressure. Only the two that used pressure along with other methods, Banks Six Gun and one other, stated flatly that their boxes would limit the pressure increase to well below the factory max spec, unless the factory programming actually called for this pressure under certain conditions, and had built in safeties such as EGT limiting and tranny slip.

IMHO, if the manufacturer/distributor can't or won't tell you how high their box will jack up pressure and for how long, and/or that it limits pressure to XXXXXX psi below factory max, I'd look elsewhere.

Also, before I'd consider adding one of these, I'd invest in something like the MPD monitor from TS Performance, where one of the displayed readings is fuel rail pressure, or at least a fuel rail pressure gauge. That way I'd know what the bloody thing was doing to my engine.

Yes, something like the Banks setup is expensive at close to a grand, compared to 300 or 400 bucks for one of these boxes. But then injectors run well over a grand EACH, and I don't want to think what an entire new engine would cost.

Bottom line is, you get what you pay for, and you won't be covered under warranty for any damage caused by adding one of these boxes, no matter what brand or how sophisticated it is. You'll be eating any repairs out of pocket.

I'm not trying to slam anyone for using one of these boxes, it's your vehicle, your money, and your choice. I'd just like to see everyone make that choice with their heads up and eyes open, know the pros and cons of what they're attempting, not just repeating marketing hype from a web page.
Author:  oldnavy [ Mon Feb 27, 2006 6:27 pm ]
Post subject: 
RTStabler51 wrote:
Navy, I am new to diesels, but have done my share in the gas engine world....what performance module would you recommend that is being made or going to be made for the CRd? PM if need be. Thanks!

Also, how are they claiming better gas mileage if all they are doing is dumping more fuel into the engine? Wouldn't htat decrease mileage?
You need to ask yourself if you really need this extra power for Jeep. I can't imagine towing something heavy enough that an extra 60 lbs of torque would be a must, if I did then I think bought the wrong vehicle. The muffler removal and maybe fine tunning the CPU to the best timing and duration, is the best mods in my opinion. That said I haven't bothered to look and see if there is someone doing that kind of work yet with our engine managment system. For my VW's I had the VAG-COM software to fine tune the IP timing and fuel spray duration, which enabled my car to fire on the first compression strock of the fist cylinder, cold weather stars without using GP's at 18* to 20* F and be able to get 56 to 58 mpg cruising at 75 mph. Oh by the way the first thing I did to my VW diesel was lose the 60 lb muffler. Later I put in a set of new injectors and tweaked the turbo boost pattern and had a 135 mph VW NB TDI (90 hp & 150 flb torque stock and 5 spd stick) and still do 800+ mile on a 17 gal tank. Because everything was so finely tuned it still would get mid 50's mpg if you keep the foot out of the throttle.

If however you are just wanting to tinker I would put the money to something more useful like mufflerectomy, and the proper gages like boost and EGT gage, the oil pan is set up for an easy install of temp sensor. Those are the gages that will save you dollars and help you have an engine last your lifetime.

I have a friend who in in the business of chipping diesels, mainly VW's and MB diesels. Anyway he said he may have a program chip (replace stock chip or reprogram stock chip) that will not mess with rail pressure, just timing, fuel duration and turbo response tweaking for the CRD in the near future. He has told me he would like to do mine just to see how it does on the CRD. I told him I wasn't sure I wanted to spend a couple hundred on the wife's Jeep because I seldom drive it, except to fill it up.
Author:  grywlfbg [ Mon Feb 27, 2006 7:51 pm ]
Post subject: 
-<raises his hand from the back>-

This seems like the ideal fix - potentially easier than tapping into all the sensors but I supposed harder to hide if you take it into the dealer.

oldnavy, my Jeep is my daily driver and I also tow a 3,500lb trailer on monthly 500-mile trips during the summer. I would be interested in being a guinea pig for this mod. If it's not cranking rail pressure I don't see how it could hurt and I like to think I'd notice the difference. Would be willing to give feedback and purchase the unit if it works as advertised.
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