LOST JEEPS :: View topic - In-Hose Thermostat Question

When you say drift down a bit can you be a bit more specific. A needle width or a tic mark on the gauge or some such. I'm running the stock tstat and Kap's fixed fan and under the right circumstances I'll see a bit of a drop in temp when stopped at a light but it's only about 1/2 needle width or say from 190-175 F give or take. Just enough to see but not much.

When you put in the in-line tsat you would have lost a bit of coolant and induced some air into the cooling system. That system is self purging with respect to air; as the engine warms up it pushes air/coolant out the tstat housing degassing port into the coolant tank and then sucks coolant back from the tank as the engine cools which is why you had to add coolant to the tank. I suppose it's possible that the purging cycle could have caused a bit of different tstat performance which would stop once all the air is out of the system.

Author:	TestDriver [ Tue Apr 24, 2012 10:38 am ]
Post subject:	In-Hose Thermostat Question
I drove my newly acquired CRD for some 800 miles this past weekend and I only got 19.7 mpg. On the long drive home from acquisition, between 75 and 85 indicated mph (optimistic by about 6%), the temp needle never got close to to the halfway mark and stayed just above the quarter mark. I had read a lot of posts here about the thermostat issues and decided to install a Renault version but the local parts houses did not stock one and it would be two days until they'd get it in. So, I bought this; http://www.autozone.com/autozone/parts/ ... 1633_93207 It's a common thermostat for 2.3L Fords. I made a small housing (I have machining capabilities at home) for it last night and installed it but did not drive it till this morning. The gauge went up to almost half mark and stayed there unless I slowed down. It seems to be working good and hopefully, my mpg will go up. My question is, what is the actual opening diameter of the Renault thermostats? The one I put in has about a 24 to 26mm opening and it almost occupies all the space available. I have to believe a thermostat used on Ford 2.3L engines is capable of flowing at least as much as one used on a 2.2L Renault but I'm wondering if I'll have to do something about this come hot summer days. Thanks

Author:	geordi [ Tue Apr 24, 2012 12:54 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: In-Hose Thermostat Question
If your temp comes down at idle with that thermostat installed, your fan clutch is costing you money in fuel mileage. 20mpg highway is DISMAL, there is something obviously not right with that CRD, but I think you may have found it with the thermostat. The colder these engines are, the less efficient. Our engines DO run cold, that is the benefit of a diesel, and they run colder at idle to the point where they won't generate enough heat idling at low ambient temps to keep the interior warm after an hour or two. (Yes, I have done this) I actually am running my CRD right now with NO engine-mounted fan right now, and I have the Renault in-hose thermostat installed. The temp rises to a needle-width left of dead center, and stays there. I'm also dragging around a 3000 lb generator these days, and STILL have no temp issues without any fan. These are amazing vehicles sometimes. You could have waited the day without any risk to your CRD, but machining your own housing sounds kinda fun. For right now, what I suspect is happening is that your fan clutch has failed LOCKED, rather than failing open like most CRDs have. You can test this theory without risk by driving without a fan for a couple days, and keep an eye on the temps. You have an electric fan that is only commanded to power on by the computer when it senses the AC head pressure or system temp is too high, so you DO still have another cooling fan for protection. To remove the fan, you will need a 36mm wrench and a 16 inch flat bladed screwdriver. Jam the screwdriver into one of the holes in the pulley behind the fan on the driver's side of the center, and maybe tap it in a little bit with a mallet. Don't get crazy, you need to get it out again, but you NEED that leverage. Have a helper hold that screwdriver while you put the 36mm wrench on the fan nut and HIT IT HARD with that mallet. Once it is loose, you can unlock the shroud from the two 10mm nuts just under the hoses on each side (One on each side) and work it around and over the hoses. You shouldn't need to disconnect any hoses to get it out, but it MUST come out with the fan at the same time. A replacement clutch is available from HAYDEN (Search the forum) and you can then get the MUCH BETTER plastic fan from a 3.7 gasser KJ which will move the same amount of air, IF it ever is needed.

Author:	turbobill [ Tue Apr 24, 2012 1:54 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: In-Hose Thermostat Question
Here is a a post on a simple tool I built with a grinder and a vise out of a soft iron rod I had laying around. Since you are into metal work you can probably come up with a more sophisticated design but this one works great and turns the fan removal job into a one man job, no problem. The big trick is to lock the pulley so the fan nut can be broken loose. This tool, or one like it, will solidly lock the pulley with minimum hassle. Post subject: Dreaded fan removal made easier If you have any questions give PM me. Oh, also put anti seize on the threads before installing the new fan to ensure the next removal is easy.

Author:	TestDriver [ Wed Apr 25, 2012 1:56 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: In-Hose Thermostat Question
Well, yesterday, driving home with temperatures in the high 50s to low 60s, the needle stayed just left of center during all conditions. This morning, with indicated temperatures in the 31 to 32 range, it again showed a tendency to drift down a bit but not as much as yesterday. The Tstat install caused me to loose enough coolant so as to set off the low coolant warning and I topped it off last night. Could this have been the reason it drifted more yesterday than today? I'm considering the fan removal strategy and may do that tonight.

Author:	papaindigo [ Wed Apr 25, 2012 3:14 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: In-Hose Thermostat Question
When you say drift down a bit can you be a bit more specific. A needle width or a tic mark on the gauge or some such. I'm running the stock tstat and Kap's fixed fan and under the right circumstances I'll see a bit of a drop in temp when stopped at a light but it's only about 1/2 needle width or say from 190-175 F give or take. Just enough to see but not much. When you put in the in-line tsat you would have lost a bit of coolant and induced some air into the cooling system. That system is self purging with respect to air; as the engine warms up it pushes air/coolant out the tstat housing degassing port into the coolant tank and then sucks coolant back from the tank as the engine cools which is why you had to add coolant to the tank. I suppose it's possible that the purging cycle could have caused a bit of different tstat performance which would stop once all the air is out of the system.

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Author:	TestDriver [ Wed Apr 25, 2012 4:01 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: In-Hose Thermostat Question
papaindigo wrote: When you say drift down a bit can you be a bit more specific. A needle width or a tic mark on the gauge or some such. I'm running the stock tstat and Kap's fixed fan and under the right circumstances I'll see a bit of a drop in temp when stopped at a light but it's only about 1/2 needle width or say from 190-175 F give or take. Just enough to see but not much. When you put in the in-line tsat you would have lost a bit of coolant and induced some air into the cooling system. That system is self purging with respect to air; as the engine warms up it pushes air/coolant out the tstat housing degassing port into the coolant tank and then sucks coolant back from the tank as the engine cools which is why you had to add coolant to the tank. I suppose it's possible that the purging cycle could have caused a bit of different tstat performance which would stop once all the air is out of the system. It was falling back to almost the quarter mark. This morning, it only fell down about one and a half ticks. I'm still learning this thing. Hopefully, it stops moving at all with the fan removed.

Author:	ATXKJ [ Wed Apr 25, 2012 8:00 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: In-Hose Thermostat Question
Okay and while the scan gauge worked - the gauge starts moving at 100F and the 1st tick is 135F and I still think there's more of an issue than the Thermostat did you read the Noob guide? http://www.lostjeeps.com/forum/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?p=604519#p604519

Author:	TestDriver [ Wed Apr 25, 2012 11:29 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: In-Hose Thermostat Question
ATXKJ wrote: Okay did you read the Noob guide? http://www.lostjeeps.com/forum/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?p=604519#p604519 I have read the noob guide. One of the next things I'll check is the MAP sensor. I had not checked it yet since it has been previously replaced and it's got something called an "Edge Trailjammer" tuner as well. However, I don't know if this tuner is as adept at neutralizing the EGR as others seem to be so, a quick peek is in order. The PO had the EHM but removed it because there was some leakage. I looked into the turbo inlet and there is some oil there but not any worse than other turbo diesels I've seen.

Author:	geordi [ Thu Apr 26, 2012 12:10 am ]
Post subject:	Re: In-Hose Thermostat Question
The Edge Trailjammer is a "cheater chip" that does exactly NOTHING about the EGR. It "fools" the computer into supplying more turbo and fuel pressure by supplying the computer with lower readings than are actual. I do not like the idea of using devices like that without having external gauges. Our turbo operates too close to the mechanical safety limits to make me comfortable to use something like that anymore. I did have one of those trailjammers once... And I sold it after my turbo failed and took the engine with it. Do I think the chip had anything to do with the turbo failure? I can't honestly state one way or the other if the thing was even in use when the turbo failed... So I don't know for sure.

Author:	ATXKJ [ Thu Apr 26, 2012 8:24 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: In-Hose Thermostat Question
I had an Edge for a while - always ran in 'economy' 'power' kicked the engine into limp mode - probably a fuel head issue that I didn't understand at the time.

Author:	TestDriver [ Thu Apr 26, 2012 11:23 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: In-Hose Thermostat Question
I filled up again today. Millage is getting better with the calculated average now over 21mpg. However, that was with 200+ highway miles of running with a cold engine and now only driving city miles so, it's definitely looking better. I think I'll end up selling off the Edge device and put the money towards a GDE tune. Temps are showing a pattern of normal during daylight and dropping a bit at idle during the freezing morning commute. I'll plug in the block heater tonight and see if it helps with the morning commute temps. I've still not had a chance to remove the fan but I'll have a break this weekend to do so.

Author:	liberty2.8 [ Fri Apr 27, 2012 2:55 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: In-Hose Thermostat Question
Never had a problem with the trailjammer and I always ran it in economy mode (center position) as well. It really gave it a good boost in power compared to stock. My average MPG was 20-21 but when on long roadtrips of 400+ miles, I got about 27MPG.

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