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Experience !!
http://www.lostjeeps.com/forum/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=69335		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  ando [ Mon Jun 25, 2012 4:10 am ]
Post subject:  Experience !!
Guy's I need some experienced advice (again :oops: )

I'm really happy with this KJ, doing little jobs/mods all the time, and she's coming together really nicely now, but the whole experience is being a little tainted for me by this darn "ticking" noise (have mentioned on here before)

The engine has only covered 83k, and sounds supurb hot or cold for a diesel, no tapping, knocking, blowing etc, idle's really steady hot or cold, no clunking that you would associate with mounts etc, but when upto full working temp ONLY, there is a pretty loud "ticking" noise over the normal sound of the engine running, coming from the rear of the engine (best heard from just behind the front wheels not from front of truck) that rise's and fall's with engine revs, in or out of gear, moving or stationary, and can be heard all the time once its there :evil: ... turn off and let it cool for 20mins, and its gone again next time you start up :evil: ...

Its driving me mad, and I'm worried its gonna be something that require's an engine strip to find/put right £££££££ :?

Its totally heat related in some way, like something expanding with temp or oil getting thinner, and to the rear of the engine around where the gearbox join's ????

I'm changing the gearbox oil this week, but not hopeful thats the culprit as the noise dosent change one bit when you engage a gear etc (manual) ... but its another job off the list :wink:

Any helpful knowledge as to what it might be in that area would be very appreciated !!

Andy.
Author:  Glend [ Mon Jun 25, 2012 8:52 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Experience !!
Pretty hard to help without more information. Some good mechanics have a stephiscope that they can use to listen closely to narrow down noise locations, that might be useful exercise. I see it's a manual, we've had a few clutch related problems on manuals down here, and your getting into the kilometre range where that could start to occur. Does the noise change when you press the clutch in? or release it? Is the noise up high around the back of the head or down low from around the oil pan?
Author:  Billwill [ Mon Jun 25, 2012 1:08 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Experience !!
You can make your own stethe-scope by putting the handle of a large screwdriver to your ear and touch the tip to the engine to try find the source of the noise.

I have had problems before with noisy injectors on petrol vehicles...I do not know if our CRDs could have a similar problem.

Is the frequency of the sound roughly once per revolution or faster/slower?

Could be a noisy tappet? I need to look up if our CRDs use hydrolic tappets...I am sure they do...then a hydrolic lifter could be bad and fails when the oil gets thin. What oil are you using :?

Maybe you are lucky and the noise will go away with the new gearbox fitted...I presume you are doing the clutch at the same time. If so, make sure the flywheel is not machined flat in the process...only light sanding of the surface is allowed! :)

Edit to add: Yes hydrolic tappets are used...the FSM says to remove them, check for scuff marks and clean out any dirt and sludge. The problem is you have to pretty much take the whole engine apart to get to them. Hydrolic tappets in any case usually make a noise when cold and then shut up when full of oil so that is probably not your problem. :?
Author:  user113 [ Mon Jun 25, 2012 9:58 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Experience !!
Might also look for an exhaust leak once everything heats up, they sometimes sound like ticking. Or, just proactively re-torque the exhaust manifold bolts; if that changes the sound, you should probably replace the gasket.
Author:  ando [ Tue Jun 26, 2012 4:37 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Experience !!
Thanks for the replies fella's

Until now I had been thinkin it was something like engine noise being omitted through a split hose, leaking seal/gasket etc, and it still might I guess as you say User113 ?? ... the reason for thinking that was I changed the carb on my motorbike for a bigger, full race one, which meant I could no longer route the CCV hose to the airbox without modification, so in the meantime I vented it to atmosphere with a small cone filter on it, up by the headstock, and the racket coming from it was shocking !!! the mechanical sound of the engine internals wasnt nice ... so that set me thinkin in that direction with the KJ! tho again, its the heat thing that keeps throwing me :?

I'll see how hard it is to get to the exhaust manifold bolts and check them, and get underneath again with a torch and a large screwdriver stuck in my earhole :D

Bill - I'm only changing the g/box oil .. not the g/box itself :wink:
Author:  Billwill [ Tue Jun 26, 2012 6:48 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Experience !!
ando wrote:
Thanks for the replies fella's


Bill - I'm only changing the g/box oil .. not the g/box itself :wink:


My bad, I am very old you know! :oops:
Author:  ando [ Tue Jun 26, 2012 3:27 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Experience !!
Right, after work I went out in the truck to get it upto temp, came back home, left it running while I got underneath with a torch and a large screwdriver .. the ticking deffo SOUNDS like its coming from the gearbox area to me ?? (which was what prompted me to order some Mopar gear oil the other day :wink: ) which I hope to pick up tomorrow

Anyhow, am I right in thinkin that as it was stood there for about 10mins idleing, the engine temp will be regulated by the fan cutting in and out, but the gearbox oil would be cooling down ? .. cus low and behold .. the ticking noise started to get quieter !!! :shock: and had almost gone by the time I switched it off ! I'm quite hopefull now about putting new oil in the box .. but will prob be gutted if it dosent make any differance now :lol:

What do you think guys ? reakon I might have summut, or just wishfull thinkin ?
Author:  ando [ Mon Jul 09, 2012 4:57 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Experience !!
Update, the saga continues :roll:

Decided to take a trip down to the nearest Jeep stealership for them to have a listen ... as expected, had to wait 20mins, by which time the truck had started to cool and the ticking noise was only just audible to me, but they could "just" hear it I think, though they said what I thought .. not a lot they can do really as nothing jumped out at them :? (I said thats cus its cooled down like I explained on the phone :roll: )

Anyway, went out yesterday, and it was quite a warm day, so had the AC on full for about 10miles on way home .. pulled onto the drive ... and no ticking !! :shock: ... now what could having the AC running effect ???? as this is obviously heat related, what could the AC have possibly cooled down ???? any idea's ?
Author:  Billwill [ Mon Jul 09, 2012 6:03 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Experience !!
ando wrote:
Update, the saga continues :roll:

Decided to take a trip down to the nearest Jeep stealership for them to have a listen ... as expected, had to wait 20mins, by which time the truck had started to cool and the ticking noise was only just audible to me, but they could "just" hear it I think, though they said what I thought .. not a lot they can do really as nothing jumped out at them :? (I said thats cus its cooled down like I explained on the phone :roll: )

Anyway, went out yesterday, and it was quite a warm day, so had the AC on full for about 10miles on way home .. pulled onto the drive ... and no ticking !! :shock: ... now what could having the AC running effect ???? as this is obviously heat related, what could the AC have possibly cooled down ???? any idea's ?



All I can think of is that with the AC switched on the electric fan in front of the AC radiator switches on and could also cool your engine cooler a bit more than usual.

Maybe your engine was running a bit cooler than usual?

Have you disabled your EGR? You have a water cooled EGR and maybe it is sensitive to the temperature of the coolant? :?
Author:  ando [ Tue Jul 10, 2012 4:11 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Experience !!
Thanx for your reply Bill :wink:

I have been concidering it "may" be EGR related somehow, but its so hard to get to under the intake manifold, I've been tryin to eliminate the things I can access (to no apparent success :roll: ) .. I did unplug the MAF not long back which didnt seem to make a differance, and when it went into the garage for a turbo seal, they plugged it back in which obviously got rid of the CEL

I would try and post a video clip of it, but it wouldnt work I dont think, as the pitch of noise's like this just seem to get swallowed up by the engine noise when played back on computer speakers :(

Wish I could solve this, it makes the engine sound bad sat in traffic etc :oops: makes me feel like hanging outa the window and saying "its not the engine, thats fine!!" ... :-)r
Author:  Joe Romas [ Tue Jul 10, 2012 9:03 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Experience !!
Ando
For giggles and grins turn your Heater/AC to the off position and see if you have the noise. Or try changing the blower speeds and see if the sound changes. Your noise could be as simple as a blower motor or a tree leaf in the blower wheel.

Joe :wink:
Author:  Billwill [ Tue Jul 10, 2012 1:31 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Experience !!
I know on my 2002 CRD I had a rattle that sounded like it was coming from the steering wheel or the console or something just in front of the console inside the engine bay. I spent months trying to fix it and took it in to the agents for a normal service.

They found the one CAC hose was loose and the wastegate on the turbo was rattling....the early CRDs like mine use a wastegate. Turns out it was the rattling wastegate.....being a RHD Jeep the turbo sits basically in front of the driver and the noise went straight through the console. :(
Author:  ando [ Tue Jul 10, 2012 4:06 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Experience !!
Joe - to date, nothing changes the noise other than temprature :( .. cold=no noise .. working temp=rattley ticking :evil:

Bill - my earlier thoughts were always turbo related, but I've since had it completely removed when it had a couple of seals replaced, so not really concidering it now :? .. I'm still not convinced this isnt EGR related at the mo ???
Author:  maxf15 [ Fri Nov 30, 2012 4:17 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Experience !!
ando wrote:
Joe - to date, nothing changes the noise other than temprature :( .. cold=no noise .. working temp=rattley ticking :evil:

Bill - my earlier thoughts were always turbo related, but I've since had it completely removed when it had a couple of seals replaced, so not really concidering it now :? .. I'm still not convinced this isnt EGR related at the mo ???



Ando - I'm having the exact same issue. But the ticking is loud enough to be heard with the window down at a stoplight. What did you find on yours? Unfortunately, mine sounds like a sticky lifter or valve because the ticking gets faster with rpms. I'm hoping its something else though.
Author:  dkenny [ Fri Nov 30, 2012 8:01 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Experience !!
if its fuel system related..this might help..not fix or cure

put a quart of 2cycle oil in with the diesel full..a full tank would for diesel would be good.

run it for a while..30-60 mintues...has the noise changed..

if it did its fuel related..most likely injectors

if you don't want to try 2 cycle oil use a gallon of biodiesel..

just an idea

-dkenny

I notice when my truck ( i know a different engine) is running more dino diesel than biodiesel..I don't know about the jeep since my wife drives it all the time..
Author:  warp2diesel [ Fri Nov 30, 2012 10:33 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Experience !!
user113 wrote:
Might also look for an exhaust leak once everything heats up, they sometimes sound like ticking. Or, just proactively re-torque the exhaust manifold bolts; if that changes the sound, you should probably replace the gasket.


One guy in OZ had a bad EGR pipe that blew out and had the noise you describe.
Give it a check.
Author:  Hexus [ Sat Dec 01, 2012 12:04 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Experience !!
YOUTUBE is also your friend. Get a video of the noise and link it here for all of us.

That will get you a lot more responses.
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