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OK about to tear out trans but have some Q's...
http://www.lostjeeps.com/forum/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=76876		 Page 1 of 2
Author:  rwppowerful [ Fri Sep 27, 2013 7:54 pm ]
Post subject:  OK about to tear out trans but have some Q's...
I have a 2005 crd and first thing I did was the ORM, and im looking at building my own catch can set up for the CCV system... I am experiencing shudder on the hwy, and also noticed when looking under the jeep that there is a wet spot under the bellhousing soooo... Parts list so far includes

Torque converter. -$435.50 allmoparparts(dot)com
Trans pump.-376.10 allmoparparts(dot)com Shipping on these two combined to my door is $49.62
Mishimoto transmission cooler with fan PN: MMOC-F $132.17@ amazon(dot)com
Derale Performance Inline Fan Thermostats 13021 $29.97@ summitracing(dot)com
Transgo shift kit PN: 45RFE-HD2 $56.97@ summitracing(dot)com (I know leave out the resistor part in the install)
Wix transmission filters PN: WIX-58846 $34.97@ summitracing(dot)com

The last three if ordered through summit will have free shipping (any order over $99).

My question is does anyone have a parts list that use different part numbers than this and if so WHY the different parts? I also noticed alot of guys pulling the input clutch pack, and pulling it apart. They check the wear on them, but no where I have looked can give me a straight forward (this is what I changed or whatever and why) reason.

Do people quite often replace the clutch pack, or is there some performance mod done inside that I missed somewhere? Thanks for all you guys help!!
Author:  papaindigo [ Sat Sep 28, 2013 8:28 am ]
Post subject:  Re: OK about to tear out trans but have some Q's...
Comments:
1. you need to determine what is producing that wet spot under the bell housing before buying parts and digging in. Could be a) coolant from the EGR cooler running down the back of the Engine or other locations; b) oil from a blown rear main seal; c) tranny fluid. If coolant will taste sweet; if oil will be black; if tranny fluid will be oily and redish.
2. be sure the TC you order is the Euro spec one not just the stock 05/06 OEM one. The former is much stronger.
3. the new tranny pump is PN 68009879AB and you can do much better than $376.10; more like $246. That said it requires a new gasket which you need to make sure is included in the deal.
4. tranny cooler and tstat. If you go this route you need to consider where you will install the cooler and if it will fit. The most common location is on the driver side just behind the grill. How "deep" that cooler + fan is I don't know but it may not fit. There are a variety of other free flow options. Frankly I would not bother unless a) you do a lot of towing in hot ambient temperatures or hilly terrain as the stock cooler does a good job or b) the stock cooler is leaking in which case cutting it out of the system in favor of an aftermarket cooler is much cheaper than an AC condenser replacement.
5. transgo kit. No comment
6. WIX tranny filters. There is a PN issue here I cannot settle. The WIX web site says the kit (2 filters + gasket) is 58843 on the other hand if you type 58846 into the WIX search engine it shows the same stuff as in the 58843 pkg. But if you go elsewhere 58846 sometimes shows as just the flat filter. Bottom line is you need both the flat and spin on filters; gasket or RTV is kind of your choice.
7. clutch pack. I cannot offer much other than if you are in that far it should be inspected but how I have no clue. SunCoast looked at mine when they did the TC install and said they looked "new".

Be sure to use ATF+4 nothing else and be sure to add back as much ATF as comes out.
Author:  Hexus [ Sat Sep 28, 2013 8:49 am ]
Post subject:  Re: OK about to tear out trans but have some Q's...
IDParts has a service kit with Mopar filters and 9 Quarts of ATF for $150.

IDParts also has the Euro Torque Converter for $509.

IDParts also has the bolt set for the Pan for $20, and I would HIGHLY RECOMMEND replacing them.

I would recommend a larger neodymium magnet for the Trans pan.

I would also recommend a Hayden Fan Clutch before you go through the expense and hassle of a Transmission Cooler.

I also recommend LubeGuard Red, Only red.

Clutch Packs do not require inspection, 545RFE is pretty bomb proof honestly.

Transgo Kit - Make sure you install the self cleaning reverse valve properly, make sure you remove the old one first.

The Transmission pan gasket is a pain in the rear, RTV is the way to go honestly.

:2cents:
Author:  rwppowerful [ Sat Sep 28, 2013 11:19 am ]
Post subject:  Re: OK about to tear out trans but have some Q's...
Hmmmm I was told by a tech at a jeep dealer that the "AA" version of the pump was the latest revision. About the TC, are they (the euro and the previous style) under the same part numbers? I thought the euro had a different part number. allmoparparts(dot)com PN: RL037142AA for the euro? I found guys on here installing that version, and when cross referenced to IDparts it shows the euro torque converter-$509. So whats the difference if any?

I checked the leak it is oil so ill be replacing the rear main seal, but I figured while the trans is out id replace the pump assembly as well with the newer upgraded one. I dont see this as a big deal. I will be checking into the fluid/filter combination from IDparts I want a trans cooler for towing/off roading purposes, but will include a switch to turn it off in case of a mildly high water crossing. (electric fans will shatter to bits if they are on when hitting water)

Why replace the pan bolts? That is the oddest thing ive ever heard. lol No disrespect intended, but if you give me good reason for doing so I will consider it. I know to check the pan mating surface for warping from the torque of the bolts, hammer it back to allow a good sealing surface

I also found two different measurements online for the dimensions of the trans cooler I want to use, so I used the biggest dimensions. It looks like it will barely fit in the space next to electric fan. I may have to do a little trimming here and there to the surrounding
plastics, but should work. If I open the box and am surprised by one that is bigger I may do something unorthodox like mounting in in the big void between the driveshaft and drivers side frame rail. We shall see...

I have a small stack of VERY strong magnets im going to be placing all over the pan to try and catch whatever I can.

Thanks for the input guys any and all help is greatly appreciated, and keep it coming!!
Author:  papaindigo [ Sat Sep 28, 2013 12:24 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: OK about to tear out trans but have some Q's...
Regarding the pump both "AA" and "AB" are listed not to mention "C, D, and E". Chrysler has decades of experience adding suffixes to PNs for the least little change but the parts usually interchange. As far as I know the original pump is no longer stocked so any new pump you get should be the new model that uses a different gasket than the old pump.

As I understand it there were 2 OEM torque converters for the 05/06 KJ CRD. An early model, which died almost immediately, that had some sort of plastic part and a later model (after the first few hundred vehicles) that was better but still not the best hence the F-37 recall. The "Euro" was fitted to 07 models (Export market only hence the Euro name) and is the strong torque converter that DCJ should have used in the first place. That "R" PN you mention is the Euro PN for a TC rebuilt to Euro specs (stronger springs IIRC). Consensus is if you are doing a TC replacement go stronger than 05/06 OEM and get at least the Euro if not the SunCoast. I tossed the comment out originally because your first post did not say whether you were getting a Euro or the weaker 05/06 OEM replacement.
Author:  rwppowerful [ Sat Sep 28, 2013 1:41 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: OK about to tear out trans but have some Q's...
I agree with you 100%, but my question is do you think I should check the cheaper one (allmoparparts(dot)com) to see if they can provide me with a manufacture date or do you think it is the proper one to buy? I contacted them, and come to find out they sponser on alot of different forums, so I asked if there was a forum member discount or military discount, and he told me they cannot offer such a discount as the parts are only 10% over dealer COST, as to why the parts are already a big savings.

There was a guy on ebay selling an (AD) pump for $150 but I got scared away because of the newer designs/updated numbers or what have you. Made me think something was "improved" on for the sake of the PN change...I couldnt find any info online as to what the differences were though.

Here are the links
Torque converter
http://allmoparparts.com/oemparts/RL037142AA
Pump
http://allmoparparts.com/oemparts/RL009879AE

Im really digging the prices on their site....
Author:  papaindigo [ Sat Sep 28, 2013 2:47 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: OK about to tear out trans but have some Q's...
Keep in mind that my notes on this topic are saved from past forum chats and have not been personally verified by me (I went the SunCoast and Transgo pump kit route and SunCoast did the work) but I'm pretty sure of accuracy as I've not seen any posts to the contrary.

Torque converter - original Euro PN was 68037142AA but I've not seen anyone able to get a NOS (new old stock) unit in quite some time. What's available is a rebuilt unit PN RL037142AA or sometimes R8037142AA. The only known good other option is SunCoast (http://www.suncoastconverters.com/) although some have tried other units with as best I can tell spotty success. geordi did have a good unit built for him by someone in downstate FL but it was someone he knew IIRC. Random added thoughts on a TC a) they are heavy so shipping cost should be factored into the price as shipping can be significant, b) you would have to double check with Corey at IDParts but IIRC their $509 price is actually $409 after core refund, c) if I am reading IdParts checkout correctly the TC qualifies for free shipping to you but I don't know what the deal is on return shipping although if you are in the MA vicinity you might be able to just drop by. Bottom line is you need to get an apples to apples $ cost to compare the allmoparparts and IDparts prices once shipping to you, shipping core back, and core refund are all factored in. I do know IDparts is 100%+ behind their parts be good and right.

Corey or Keith at GDE could probably clarify the proper pump number for you or any good Jeep parts manager if you know one as I do. I suspect any 68009879XX pump will be fine; DCJ is notorious for changing XX based on nonsubstantive things like different supplier, different grade bolt, different color paint on the pump. I would note that the allmoparparts PN RL009879AE would appear to be a rebuilt unit based on the RL prefix.
Author:  Hexus [ Sat Sep 28, 2013 5:42 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: OK about to tear out trans but have some Q's...
rwppowerful wrote:
Why replace the pan bolts? That is the oddest thing ive ever heard. lol No disrespect intended, but if you give me good reason for doing so I will consider it. I know to check the pan mating surface for warping from the torque of the bolts, hammer it back to allow a good sealing surface


I twisted two of the heads on the pan bolts off just tightening them down, I'm not sure if someone over-torqued them before, because I wasn't putting them on hard at all, I had to drill and re-tap, and it was a pain in the rear, I replaced all of the bolts after that.

I don't know anyone else that's had a problem like that, but I did, so that's why I said it.

Do what you want, I'd replace them.
Author:  rwppowerful [ Sat Sep 28, 2013 5:52 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: OK about to tear out trans but have some Q's...
^LOL I gotya man. Thanks for the advice! I sent GDE an email about the pump and TC that I found cheap on that one site and this is what he said...

I sent GDE an email and a guy named Keith replied to me saying...
"I installed the TC listed below in a few CRDs and they worked well. Make sure to change both filters. I have not tried the other parts you have listed, but they get good reviews online"


I wont hear anything back from the mopar parts website till the work week.
Now I have to figure out where to go from here.
Author:  arengant [ Sat Sep 28, 2013 6:05 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: OK about to tear out trans but have some Q's...
Hexus wrote:
rwppowerful wrote:
Why replace the pan bolts? That is the oddest thing ive ever heard. lol No disrespect intended, but if you give me good reason for doing so I will consider it. I know to check the pan mating surface for warping from the torque of the bolts, hammer it back to allow a good sealing surface


I twisted two of the heads on the pan bolts off just tightening them down, I'm not sure if someone over-torqued them before, because I wasn't putting them on hard at all, I had to drill and re-tap, and it was a pain in the rear, I replaced all of the bolts after that.

I don't know anyone else that's had a problem like that, but I did, so that's why I said it.

Do what you want, I'd replace them.

x2 on one bolts for me, I twisted just one off but it was a pain to get out.

And stick with MOPAR filter not WIX
Author:  rwppowerful [ Sat Sep 28, 2013 6:20 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: OK about to tear out trans but have some Q's...
I thought the WIX filters were of good quality? What facts do you or others have to support your claims? Do most people just use mopar trans filters?

I also bought an apollo 3/8" one way ball check valve just in case the one in the trans fails like it sometimes seems to do.

Any other advice guys?
Author:  thermorex [ Sun Sep 29, 2013 12:06 am ]
Post subject:  Re: OK about to tear out trans but have some Q's...
Regarding pan bolts, I had no issues taking them down, none was stuck... So if you won't have issues taking them apart, and tie them gently back, originals would work fine. If you want peace of mind, obviously replace them and you will be fine for sure.
Author:  DOC4444 [ Sun Sep 29, 2013 9:55 am ]
Post subject:  Re: OK about to tear out trans but have some Q's...
Mopar filters are least likely to cause drainback issues. Just a few more bucks.

DOC
Author:  rwppowerful [ Sun Sep 29, 2013 11:53 am ]
Post subject:  Re: OK about to tear out trans but have some Q's...
ok well if the drainback issue is all, then im not too worried as Im installing an apollo ball check valve, so I think I will be just fine with the wix filters.

There is no way id buy the combination kit from IDparts, as I have the apollo valve and can get the filters kit for $34.97 as I stated in my first post, and Valvoline ATF+4 can be gotten for $55-60 for a whole case... Id feel very foolish to buy that $150 "kit"

Im interested in finding the cheaper way but still doing it correctly.
Author:  hucorey [ Mon Sep 30, 2013 11:08 am ]
Post subject:  Re: OK about to tear out trans but have some Q's...
If you really want to do it right and for close to the same money call these two companies.

For you trans valve body and pump
http://www.sharadon.com/sdtestparts.htm

For your TC. Just be sure to specify your jeep is a diesel as they will custom build it for lower stall.

http://www.edgeracingconverters.com/ind ... cPath=7_20

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk 2
Author:  SargeIndustries [ Mon Sep 30, 2013 3:53 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: OK about to tear out trans but have some Q's...
Be sure to Loctite the flex plate to torque converter bolts upon reassembly. They backed out on my suncoast torque converter after 25,000 miles.
Author:  rwppowerful [ Mon Sep 30, 2013 8:19 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: OK about to tear out trans but have some Q's...
^ duly noted! That torque converter company... anyone on here ever used them? I may get one if they have good reviews from guys with crd's
Author:  hucorey [ Mon Sep 30, 2013 8:53 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: OK about to tear out trans but have some Q's...
This is what I was going to put in mine back in July but funding had to get used elsewhere. I'm still limping along on OEM. That will be whats going in mine. Just don't know when since I have my F350 P-stroke torn down. :-(

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk 2
Author:  rwppowerful [ Wed Oct 02, 2013 9:00 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: OK about to tear out trans but have some Q's...
Ok guys I got my trans cooler! It has a lifetime warranty, and takes 3/8" hose on the fittings. It is a "Mishimoto Heavy Duty Transmission Cooler w/ Electric Fan (part number MMOC-F)"

It came packed really well as you can see from the pics.

Image

Image

Image

Mounting Hardware included

Image

Image

Image

This is the height of the core and the fan combined. Measurement was taken with back of fan shroud sitting on table.

Image


I figured since I found different measurements online I would show what mine were so you guys could see for yourselves. It looks like it will work just as I planned to where it will barely fit in the space on the drivers side of the electric fan.

I will take as many pics as I can and post them of all installs done. I also learned some info about the "input" clutch removal and finagling when people were getting the installs done, and I will cover this in detail for everyone on here.
Author:  rwppowerful [ Wed Oct 02, 2013 9:04 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: OK about to tear out trans but have some Q's...
hucorey wrote:
If you really want to do it right and for close to the same money call these two companies.

For you trans valve body and pump
http://www.sharadon.com/sdtestparts.htm

For your TC. Just be sure to specify your jeep is a diesel as they will custom build it for lower stall.

http://www.edgeracingconverters.com/ind ... cPath=7_20

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk 2


I emailed this company and actually got a chance to speak with the owner personally. He really knows his stuff when it comes to dodge transmissions. I did a little research on his company and there are tons of dodge ram guys who swear by his product. (the one im ordering from him is a billet converter with a 2 yr warranty) I will be giving him my business, and documenting his product and procedures for install here on this board for the rest of you guys
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