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Won't start. Won't crank.
http://www.lostjeeps.com/forum/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=79638		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  Rbhrft [ Thu Jul 17, 2014 11:32 am ]
Post subject:  Won't start. Won't crank.
2006
The car ran fine on Saturday. Tuesday it won't start. I can turn the key, all the lights, bells and whistles go. Turn to start and it goes "gunk". The engine won't crank over.

Background:
- I know I'm losing a small amount of coolant somewhere but haven't located that yet. I just keep it full.
- replaced the starter earlier this year
- just had the timing belt (and all that that entails) replaced two months ago
- tried jump starting, nothing.
- tried swapping the battery for one that was tried and true out of our other CRD, same story.

It seems the engine is seized.
All the electrical is firing off and meters well.
Any ideas please?
Author:  kissfan79 [ Thu Jul 17, 2014 12:50 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Won't start. Won't crank.
Hello....
First off...welcome to LOSTJeeps. The first thing that comes to my mind being as you have tried a known battery in it is the actuator pin in the ignition switch. Evidently....they are prone to breaking and won't start the vehicle if it breaks. Here is a link to a topic that tells you how to jumper the relay to bypass the actuator pin in the switch: viewtopic.php?f=5&t=61233&p=678574&hilit=+brother#p678574 Hope it helps and good luck.

Jim
Author:  thermorex [ Thu Jul 17, 2014 12:54 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Won't start. Won't crank.
Rbhrft wrote:
2006
The car ran fine on Saturday. Tuesday it won't start. I can turn the key, all the lights, bells and whistles go. Turn to start and it goes "gunk". The engine won't crank over.

Background:
- I know I'm losing a small amount of coolant somewhere but haven't located that yet. I just keep it full.
- replaced the starter earlier this year
- just had the timing belt (and all that that entails) replaced two months ago
- tried jump starting, nothing.
- tried swapping the battery for one that was tried and true out of our other CRD, same story.

It seems the engine is seized.
All the electrical is firing off and meters well.
Any ideas please?


Try turning the engine by hand couple turns adn see if it's smooth. If yes, then power up the starter manually and see if it turns the engine. If yes I'd try reading for some CEL codes, there may be an electrical issue that prevents the engine from starting, not sure what, but I'd try those things before anything else.
Author:  Rbhrft [ Thu Jul 17, 2014 1:02 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Won't start. Won't crank.
The other CRD we have did have the pin problem and we replaced it. The symptoms of this are different. When that happened, there was not tension on the starter, the key just turned without hitting any points. It this instance, the key turns, hits points, you can hear power going to the engine but then no turn over. Continued efforts only drain the battery.

Thank you for the welcome. You should know that I love my Jeep but I am only the driver. My husband is the mechanic so I relay this info to him to help him trouble shoot.

Also, I do have a check engine light. The code is 1263, #2 glow plug. We just replaced the glow plugs when we did the timing belt so we assume that one must have been bad. The engine should still turn over. It's 90 degrees out so cold is not an issue.
Author:  Rbhrft [ Thu Jul 17, 2014 1:53 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Won't start. Won't crank.
"Try turning the engine by hand couple turns adn see if it's smooth. If yes, then power up the starter manually and see if it turns the engine. If yes I'd try reading for some CEL codes, there may be an electrical issue that prevents the engine from starting, not sure what, but I'd try those things before anything else."

Is there a one way that is easier than another way to turn the engine by hand?
Author:  Rbhrft [ Thu Jul 17, 2014 8:32 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Won't start. Won't crank.
Just to rule it out, I did go short the relay. No go.
Author:  The Scott McLean [ Thu Jul 17, 2014 8:48 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Won't start. Won't crank.
You need to turn engine over by hand, also check your coolant did it drop quickly, are you low now. Does the starter click when turning over. Does the engine even try to move?

If the starter clicks, and the engine only moves a little. I would suggest pulling glow plugs, or injectors. You could have a hydro lock. Cylinder full with coolant.
Author:  Rbhrft [ Fri Jul 18, 2014 10:18 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Won't start. Won't crank.
Scott McLean is probably right. Hydro lock. Blown head gasket. Gah! I really wanted it to be the pin.
Author:  The Scott McLean [ Fri Jul 18, 2014 9:18 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Won't start. Won't crank.
Don't panic could be worse. Your in for a head gasket replace, but it's not dead it can be fixed. Do it as fast as you can, so coolant does not pit cylinder walls. My suggestion is to start by confirming first, pull glow plugs, or injectors and have a peek.
Author:  geordi [ Sat Jul 19, 2014 4:57 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Won't start. Won't crank.
Where are you located? Head gasket replacements aren't much fun, but they can be done in a couple days of work. I'd be surprised if the engine was full of water this fast however. When you try rotating the engine by hand, it will be CLOCKWISE and only in that direction, and rotate it from the crankshaft (21mm bolt) using a big socket wrench. You may have to remove the fan and shroud for access, or at least the bottom knock-out of the shroud.

It will be a lot easier if the fan isn't in there to try rotating the engine. You should feel the compression, but nothing mechanical impeding the rotation and certainly not a full-stop at any point.

Have you considered that maybe your starter has just given up the ghost? They don't warn you when they die, and it has been under your CRD for 8 years now... I'm hearing hoofbeats and thinking horses, the bigger failures DO happen, but much less often than simple stuff like the keyswitch pin or a starter's bendix or windings dying.
Author:  Rbhrft [ Sun Jul 20, 2014 11:48 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Won't start. Won't crank.
The starter was resently replaced. Pulled the #2 glow plug, turned the key, water spurts! So at least I have a good diagnosis now! Thank you! On IDParts now and ordering parts.
Author:  geordi [ Mon Jul 21, 2014 12:37 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Won't start. Won't crank.
Ooh, that isn't good, and certainly is conclusive. Sorry for that.

While ordering your parts, I would strongly suggest ordering the ARP stud kits (IDparts has them) because the factory bolts are questionable and I would expect that loose bolt torque is the reason for your head gasket problems. You may or may not elect to also replace the rockers since you are this deep in the motor anyway, but there is also the possibility that one or more of the rockers will need replacement due to age. Just be ready for that delay if you don't order the rockers now.

If you are handy with a borescope, the protruding tab of the head gasket underneath the #2 and #3 cylinders (of course under the intake elbow! :banghead: ) can be seen and that will tell you which gasket you may have from the factory - no hole, 1 or 2 holes. You will want to get the same one that you have now. Since you will be playing with the intake elbow (and you will HATE the way that reattaches to the intake) I would also strongly suggest the Weeks101 Elbow Kit (search on the big thread) as that will make your life suck a LOT less in rebuilding that side of the engine.

As a bonus it also makes replacing the glow plugs at some future date a 1-2 hour job instead of 3-4 hours of cussing at the designer of that setup.
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