AndrewCRD wrote:
Under the trasfer case is not too bad. How did you install the fittings in the metal pipe ? do you just put a rubber hose on top of the metal one and clamp it ?
Yes, and I double clamped on the fuel line, just in case.
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| Author: | AndrewCRD [ Thu Apr 07, 2016 3:14 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Fuel Rail pressure sensor |
Since im having issues with the car starting in cold weather. I was wondering if there is already a rail pressure sensor and if there is a way to read it before starting the car up ( or attempting). Id be curious to see what the pressure is like in the rail during normal operation vs when its been sitting for a while and its cold. |
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| Author: | flash7210 [ Thu Apr 07, 2016 3:38 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Fuel Rail pressure sensor |
There is a fuel rail pressure sensor, about mid way on the rail. With key-on engine-off, the pressure reading is going to be zero or almost zero. You can use the TorquePro app to get an idea of what rail pressure is, but its not a direct reading from the sensor. Its what the ECM is demanding rail pressure to be through the rail pressure solenoid. I installed a AutoMeter electronic fuel rail pressure gauge. It ties directly into the rail pressure sensor and gives a direct reading from the sensor. But it only shows pressure when the engine is running. It works pretty good and has been a valuable diagnostic tool for me. I cant say whether or not its specifically calibrated for the sensor on the CRD but its close enough. For problems starting in cold weather, I'd first look at the glow plugs. |
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| Author: | papaindigo [ Thu Apr 07, 2016 3:43 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Fuel Rail pressure sensor |
Absent a location or what you mean by cold or whether you are using the block heater or some hint as to the symptoms of your issues with starting it's kind of hard to offer an informed opinion. Yes as posted there is a pressure sensor but cold (say below 20 or 15F) start issues can be caused by several things including something as simple as a weak battery. |
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| Author: | AndrewCRD [ Thu Apr 07, 2016 5:24 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Fuel Rail pressure sensor |
This is exactly what happens to mine https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mWtsMls--bI difference is in cold weather, i can go through two battery charges. I changed the fuel pump housing with the new style ones, i just recently changed the starter(ofcourse the weather is nice now). The block heater works great, but im not always in a position to have somewhere to plug in. My location is about 2 hours north of Buffalo NY in canada. Sometimes when its -3F or more i cant even start it with the block heater in. Took it to the dealer and they installed a new fuse for the fuel pump that is in the tank ... which i thought doesnt exist on these cars, also had the cam position sensor replaced. |
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| Author: | rankom [ Thu Apr 07, 2016 7:25 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Fuel Rail pressure sensor |
ok dealer replaced bad fuse for lift pump , did they confirm that the fuse is powering in- tank pump ? or is just dummy fuse. I'm sure they most be joking because dealer techs should know how to test fuses . anyhow it is a good joke |
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| Author: | flash7210 [ Thu Apr 07, 2016 8:02 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Fuel Rail pressure sensor |
AndrewCRD wrote: This is exactly what happens to mine https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mWtsMls--bI difference is in cold weather, i can go through two battery charges. I changed the fuel pump housing with the new style ones, i just recently changed the starter(ofcourse the weather is nice now). The block heater works great, but im not always in a position to have somewhere to plug in. My location is about 2 hours north of Buffalo NY in canada. Sometimes when its -3F or more i cant even start it with the block heater in. Took it to the dealer and they installed a new fuse for the fuel pump that is in the tank ... which i thought doesnt exist on these cars, also had the cam position sensor replaced. Have the glow plugs ever been replaced? Are your glow plugs 7 volt or 5 volt? No, your CRD did not orginally have a electric fuel pump in the tank. Unless the previous owner had one installed. Have you checked for air-in-fuel? That can cause hard starting problems. |
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| Author: | papaindigo [ Fri Apr 08, 2016 9:43 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Fuel Rail pressure sensor |
I see you have a 2n gen fuel filter head but that won't prevent air in the filter head problems; it only prevents them if the air is coming from a burned filter head heater element. If the air is due to leak(s) at the 2 supply line disconnect fittings back by the fuel tank a 2n gen filter head won't solve the problem; only replacing those fittings with marine grade diesel rated fuel line and/or an intank pump will cure that problem. So bleed the filter head (pump primer until hard, crack bleeder, close bleed but not godzilla, repeat till air is gone). With block heater plugged in -3F starts should not be a problem. As noted the CRD does not have an in tank fuel pump unless one has been added by an owner. "New fuse" by dealer suggests they are clueless - fuses are good or bad there is no in between and as noted you probably have no in tank pump. In addition to bleeding I'd have your battery load tested. Cold weather is really tough on batteries and can significantly reduce CCA on an older one. |
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| Author: | AndrewCRD [ Fri Apr 08, 2016 11:45 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Fuel Rail pressure sensor |
papaindigo wrote: I see you have a 2n gen fuel filter head but that won't prevent air in the filter head problems; it only prevents them if the air is coming from a burned filter head heater element. If the air is due to leak(s) at the 2 supply line disconnect fittings back by the fuel tank a 2n gen filter head won't solve the problem; only replacing those fittings with marine grade diesel rated fuel line and/or an intank pump will cure that problem. So bleed the filter head (pump primer until hard, crack bleeder, close bleed but not godzilla, repeat till air is gone). With block heater plugged in -3F starts should not be a problem. As noted the CRD does not have an in tank fuel pump unless one has been added by an owner. "New fuse" by dealer suggests they are clueless - fuses are good or bad there is no in between and as noted you probably have no in tank pump. In addition to bleeding I'd have your battery load tested. Cold weather is really tough on batteries and can significantly reduce CCA on an older one. The dealer IS clueless, they had my car for 7 whole days until they figured out how to start it. Long story with dealer but you are 100% correct, they are clueless and thats not even 99% but a full 100% clueless. I do bleed the filter head every now and again, problem is as soon as the car runs it needs it done again and again endlessly. So i just chuck this to a SNAFU condition. As for the fittings in by the fuel tank i cant say ive ever considered them. Ive worked on some gas tanks in the past and its a big PIA as i recall. Would a fuel air separator setup help ? Could install one before the fuel filter. |
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| Author: | flash7210 [ Fri Apr 08, 2016 12:01 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Fuel Rail pressure sensor |
A FASS would work but IMO is a bit overkill for the CRD. Back at the tank there is a coupling that can leak air into the system. Its where the hard plastic line from the tank meets the hard metal line. You only need to worry about the 3/8 inch supply line. The smaller return line can be left alone. What I did was cut out that coupling and replace it with regular 3/8 fuel line and some clamps. A lift pump will go a long way in keeping the entire fuel system pressurized and happy. A in-tank lift pump is the best, but I just used a Facet type pump mounted in the engine bay ahead of the fuel filter. Been working great for me for several years. |
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| Author: | mass-hole [ Fri Apr 08, 2016 12:05 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Fuel Rail pressure sensor |
The in tank lift pump really was not that hard to install. The wiring was honestly the most time consuming part for me since you have to pull up the interior, but dropping the tank and installing the pump itself was pretty quick. maybe an hour. |
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| Author: | AndrewCRD [ Fri Apr 08, 2016 12:10 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Fuel Rail pressure sensor |
I have a lift pump i bought a while back. I think i red somewhere here about it. The problem i thought was the post suggested installing it under the car and imo its too big to be there ... too many chances of getting smashed by stuff. I did think about installing next to the fuel filter under the hood, but the post also suggested it works best being closer to the fuel tank. Since i bought the darn thing i might as well use it, i like the idea of having that pump in. |
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| Author: | flash7210 [ Fri Apr 08, 2016 12:13 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Fuel Rail pressure sensor |
What kind of pump is it? Yes, back at the tank is best, but there are probably a dozen different ways of doing it. |
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| Author: | AndrewCRD [ Fri Apr 08, 2016 12:16 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Fuel Rail pressure sensor |
Its a Kennedy pump, i googled this guy had a racor filter and this pump installed. http://liberty.eurekaboy.com/kennedy.htm ... i mean if im going to cut into the fuel lines ... i could install it inside the car say under the rear bench |
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| Author: | thermorex [ Fri Apr 08, 2016 12:19 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Fuel Rail pressure sensor |
AndrewCRD wrote: Its a Kennedy pump, i googled this guy had a racor filter and this pump installed. http://liberty.eurekaboy.com/kennedy.htm ... i mean if im going to cut into the fuel lines ... i could install it inside the car say under the rear bench I installed mine under the transfer case shield. No filter though. But you could also install it where eureka boy did. |
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| Author: | papaindigo [ Fri Apr 08, 2016 12:22 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Fuel Rail pressure sensor |
If you have a 2n gen fuel filter head and are constantly bleeding air out of it then you need to address the source of the air. The CRD uses the same fuel lines as the gasser but and it's a big but the gasser has a fuel pump in the tank that keeps the fuel line pressurized while the CRD has a puller pump on the front of the engine that sucks fuel from the tank. Nothing wrong with a puller pump as they have been around forever. However, the quick disconnect fittings that keep fuel under pressure from leaking out don't always do a good job of keep air from being pulled in given the use of a puller pump. If you have a bad air leak at those fittings I'm not sure an inline fuel pump will help. Alternatives included: 1. BlackLibertyCRD's automatic bleeder - involves messing with the somewhat fragile plastic fuel return block 2. in tank pump - $s and requires dropping the fuel tank. 3. replacing the quick disconnects with marine diesel rated fuel line - not much $s but does require dropping tank. I'd recommend the latter. See http://www.auerbach.ca/kj/lift_pump/ for instructions on installing an in tank pump that include how to drop the fuel tank. Just a note only the quick disconnects on the fuel supply line need to be replaced; those on the return line can be left alone. PS some have installed a lift pump in the engine bay on a bracket by the battery. I would not recommend putting one inside the cabin for obvious reasons. |
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| Author: | AndrewCRD [ Fri Apr 08, 2016 12:58 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Fuel Rail pressure sensor |
Under the trasfer case is not too bad. How did you install the fittings in the metal pipe ? do you just put a rubber hose on top of the metal one and clamp it ? |
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| Author: | thermorex [ Fri Apr 08, 2016 1:24 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Fuel Rail pressure sensor |
AndrewCRD wrote: Under the trasfer case is not too bad. How did you install the fittings in the metal pipe ? do you just put a rubber hose on top of the metal one and clamp it ? Yes, and I double clamped on the fuel line, just in case.
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| Author: | AndrewCRD [ Fri Apr 08, 2016 1:59 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Fuel Rail pressure sensor |
Ok i see that part, but my question is on the other side, where those lines are coming from. I assume at one point you had to cut the old metal pipe and splice this one into it. Im curious how you connected those lines to the rubber hose in your picture. |
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| Author: | thermorex [ Fri Apr 08, 2016 2:29 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Fuel Rail pressure sensor |
It's just pushed over the metal line. You need to cut few good inches of fuel line, and in between you install the pump with hoses. So you take one end of the hose and push it over the cut fuel line end, and the other end of the hose goes in the pump barb fitting. Same for the other side. I used a bracket I made to mount it on the side of the frame and the pump goes on the bracket. Do I make sense now? |
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| Author: | AndrewCRD [ Fri Apr 08, 2016 2:42 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Fuel Rail pressure sensor |
Yes, thats what i was wondering about. I assume you also clamp them on the metal pipe side. |
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