Torque Converter Replacement Time!

RadJeeper · **Joined:** Fri Oct 28, 2016 1:50 pm **Posts:** 5

Hey ya'll,
Yesterday the stock torque converter finally went out on my 05 Jeep Liberty CRD and I've got my finger on the trigger of a Suncoast replacement. Anything else I should have my mechanic take care of while he's swapping them out? I'm going to have him replace one of the glow plugs (I've already had all 4 changed out from the MoPar) and check for leaks in my turbo.

WWDiesel · **Posted:** Thu Jan 30, 2020 3:34 pm

RadJeeper wrote:

Hey ya'll,
Yesterday the stock torque converter finally went out on my 05 Jeep Liberty CRD and I've got my finger on the trigger of a Suncoast replacement. Anything else I should have my mechanic take care of while he's swapping them out? I'm going to have him replace one of the glow plugs (I've already had all 4 changed out from the MoPar) and check for leaks in my turbo.

SunCoast is a wise choice and you will be pleased with it's performance. They are not cheap, but a top of line TC for our little diesels!
For sure have him replace the front pump assembly in the transmission while you have the transmission out. There are some plungers and bores that wear out with age in these transmissions and can cause problems. The new replacement pumps are of an improved updated design. See info below:

Most also install a TransGo Kit when installing a new heavy duty torque converter. The TransGo kit increases line pressure resulting in a little crisper shifts and helps reduce wear on the clutches and bands in the transmission along with increasing holding power of the lockup up clutches in the torque converter.
http://www.transgo.com/products.php?prd ... ntview=Yes

Mopar wrote:

Transmission front pump 68009879AB (RL009879AE)
Severe wear of the TC limit valve bore in the front pump housing results in loss of converter release oil pressure. Reduced release pressure at low speed and idle can drag the converter linings, causing engine surge, pulsation or stall.
The torque converter limit valve spring in the 45RFE, 545RFE front pump can often break. This valve limits converter release pressure. A broken spring can cause the valve to become stuck and result in converter clutch release issues including engine stalls at low speeds.
Chrysler vehicles equipped with 45RFE, 545RFE and 68RFE transmissions often experience TCC related troubles. These may or may not include trouble codes accompanied by TC clutch slip, no lockup, overheating and / or loss of fuel economy. In some cases, the TC clutches may be unable to release TC lockup, resulting in improper lockup functions and / or complete engine stalling. Problems such as these can be caused by excess wear in the TCC switch valve bore, which allows vital control pressure to escape the circuit. Replacing the complete transmission oil pump assembly with a new updated assembly can restore crucial clearances for renewed TCC control and operation.

IDParts.com wrote:

https://www.idparts.com/transmission-oi ... -7534.html
Transmission Oil Pump [New Version] (Liberty CRD)
OEM Mopar
OEM Part Number: RL009879AE
Manufacturer Number: 68009879AB
Updated design front oil pump for the 545RFE automatic transmission used in the 2005-2006 Jeep Liberty CRD. The original oil pump was failure prone, resulting in low transmission oil pressure which led to torque converter problems and shifting problems. This version was released in 2013 and so far has not suffered the same problems the OE transmission oil pump had.

TransGo Kit:

Front Pump Assembly:

weeks101 · **Joined:** Mon Jul 30, 2012 3:29 pm **Posts:** 747

https://shop.sasquatchparts.com/product ... -2-8l-crd/

https://shop.sasquatchparts.com/product ... 45rfe-hd2/

TKB4 · **Posted:** Fri Jan 31, 2020 8:22 am

The sun coast is definitely the top of the line torque converter and if I was paying someone else to do it thats what I would get. If you need to be more economical there are other choices but I would stay away from the Hemi torque converter and there are much better less expensive options than the Euro version Chrysler would recommend. I would definitely replace the front pump also.

thesameguy · **Joined:** Sat Oct 01, 2016 8:24 pm **Posts:** 652

Why no-no on the hemi part? Mostly just curious...

My66dodge · **Posted:** Sat Feb 01, 2020 9:53 am

Wrong stall speed

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TKB4 · **Posted:** Sat Feb 01, 2020 11:15 am

thesameguy wrote:

Why no-no on the hemi part? Mostly just curious...

I have them in 2 CRD s and one of them with the GDE turbo still slips on rare occasions and I do not believe it is the front pump. The other one just feels like it is fixing to slip when towing about 3,000 lbs.

Also when others talked to GDE in the past they did not recommend it.

TKB4 · **Posted:** Sat Feb 01, 2020 11:18 am

My66dodge wrote:

Wrong stall speed

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He has a recommendation in other threads and from what I understand the Florida converter has had decent results and is fairly inexpensive.

My66dodge · **Posted:** Sat Feb 01, 2020 12:02 pm

Same with the precision converters of New Hampshire, they make the majority of the converters for the mfgs, If you buy a new trans from ford or gm it usually has one... the one you want from them is the 5450lsrv, it is lower stall than stock like the Florida and suncoast and ATS but for about 1/2 price cause they make soo many... these guys are the ones most transmission shops buy from

http://www.gopnh.com

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flash7210 · **Posted:** Sat Feb 01, 2020 12:10 pm

The Hemi TC is the wrong stall speed?
What, too low?

I’m still running the stock TC as installed back during the F37 recall. If anything, it’s stall speed is too high.
I’m currently running the stage 4 Yeti tune.

High input torque will cause TC lockup clutch shudder in even the toughest of torque converters. The pump alone won’t fix that. Higher line pressure needed. The Hemi TCM will help with that and and so can the Sonnax line pressure booster.

Even with the Hemi TCM and line booster, I occasionally get brief shudder. Mostly when applying heavy throttle in 5th gear.
The solution is to gently apply the throttle and to push OD-off when at lower speeds. Especially when towing.
If you can make the TC shudder with OD-off, you’re either pulling a heavy load or have a really HOT tune.

I typically drive with OD-off when at speeds below 50mph. Then accelerate up to 55 and turn OD-on.

WWDiesel · **Posted:** Sat Feb 01, 2020 3:02 pm

With a SunCoast installed, Yeti's Stage IV Hot tune, Diablo Power Puck, GDE transmission TCM tune, and 245x75x16 tires, I have never been able to force or experience ANY torque converter shudder or slip even while pulling a 4k load in 100+ degree ambient temperatures. This while getting down to around 50 mph in 5th lockup going up inclines.
I do have the upgraded style front pump and a TransGo kit installed.
SunCoast TC's are certainly one of the best available if you don't mind spending the funds.
But as always, you kinda get what you pay for.... :juggle:

PZKW108 · **Joined:** Sun Apr 06, 2014 5:23 pm **Posts:** 461

flash7210 wrote:

The Hemi TC is the wrong stall speed?
What, too low?

I’m still running the stock TC as installed back during the F37 recall. If anything, it’s stall speed is too high.
I’m currently running the stage 4 Yeti tune.

High input torque will cause TC lockup clutch shudder in even the toughest of torque converters. The pump alone won’t fix that. Higher line pressure needed. The Hemi TCM will help with that and and so can the Sonnax line pressure booster.

Even with the Hemi TCM and line booster, I occasionally get brief shudder. Mostly when applying heavy throttle in 5th gear.
The solution is to gently apply the throttle and to push OD-off when at lower speeds. Especially when towing.
If you can make the TC shudder with OD-off, you’re either pulling a heavy load or have a really HOT tune.

I typically drive with OD-off when at speeds below 50mph. Then accelerate up to 55 and turn OD-on.

The shudder problem we experience with the VM r-428 is not just cause of the amount of torque, but the driveline pulse the 4 cylinder create. It is cause by cylinder overlapping, or not enough of it in the 4 cylinder case.

Also the stall speed of a Hemi TC will be different in the CRD than in a Ram 1500.

My66dodge · **Posted:** Sat Feb 01, 2020 5:52 pm

The Hemi makes max tq at 4000rpm and the r428 makes max tq at 1800 so yea it’s too high of stall speed. The problem with a high stall speed is it makes for more heat in the transmission and takes the engine out of its working range so to speak. With a low stall converter the engine does more of the work sooner, so the vehicle starts moving with less throttle, thus more power is transmitted.

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PZKW108 · **Joined:** Sun Apr 06, 2014 5:23 pm **Posts:** 461

My66dodge wrote:

The Hemi makes max tq at 4000rpm and the r428 makes max tq at 1800 so yea it’s too high of stall speed. The problem with a high stall speed is it makes for more heat in the transmission and takes the engine out of its working range so to speak. With a low stall converter the engine does more of the work sooner, so the vehicle starts moving with less throttle, thus more power is transmitted.

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The Hemi tc will have a different stall when installed in the CRD.

From the report of lost forum member using Hemi tc, the stall rpm is lower than the original CRD TC !!!!!

flash7210 · **Posted:** Sat Feb 01, 2020 10:46 pm

Quote:

From the report of lost forum member using Hemi tc, the stall rpm is lower than the original CRD TC

Which is the whole point for using the Hemi TC.

PZKW108 · **Joined:** Sun Apr 06, 2014 5:23 pm **Posts:** 461

flash7210 wrote:

Quote:

From the report of lost forum member using Hemi tc, the stall rpm is lower than the original CRD TC

Which is the whole point for using the Hemi TC.

So would you recommend the hemi tc in the CRD !

flash7210 · **Posted:** Sun Feb 02, 2020 2:15 pm

PZKW108 wrote:

flash7210 wrote:

Quote:

From the report of lost forum member using Hemi tc, the stall rpm is lower than the original CRD TC

Which is the whole point for using the Hemi TC.

So would you recommend the hemi tc in the CRD !

I have a Hemi TC sitting on the bench waiting to be installed. Just haven't mustered up the courage to drop the transmission and install it.
So I cant speak from experience in actually using the Hemi TC.

But I would recommend it.
Or go with the Suncoast.

My66dodge · **Posted:** Sun Feb 02, 2020 10:36 pm

The Hemi converter has a stall speed of 2000-2300 and the stock kJ crd converter is below that as confirmed by many vendors (just call and ask). For instance the Hemi converter from PNH is #5450, and the crd uses 5450LS indicating a lower stall, the one I use is 5450LSRV with is even lower stall, so the only advantage of the Hemi converter is it allows the transmission to be loose enough that the turbo can spool up more before the vehicle moves but on the other hand the lower than stock will transmit the power better as anyone with a low stall in a diesel can tell you

If you don’t believe me or have more questions why done you call them for yourself. Here is the number for PNH 1-800-654-1220 they make the majority of the OEM converters and have lots of knowledge on the subject (more than any of us)

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WWDiesel · **Posted:** Sun Feb 02, 2020 11:36 pm

My66dodge wrote:

The Hemi converter has a stall speed of 2000-2300 and the stock kJ crd converter is below that as confirmed by many vendors (just call and ask). For instance the Hemi converter from PNH is #5450, and the crd uses 5450LS indicating a lower stall, the one I use is 5450LSRV with is even lower stall, so the only advantage of the Hemi converter is it allows the transmission to be loose enough that the turbo can spool up more before the vehicle moves but on the other hand the lower than stock will transmit the power better as anyone with a low stall in a diesel can tell you
If you don’t believe me or have more questions why done you call them for yourself. Here is the number for PNH 1-800-654-1220 they make the majority of the OEM converters and have lots of knowledge on the subject (more than any of us)
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You are correct, diesel engines require very low stall speed TC's since they are low RPM engines that hit their peak torque below 2000 RPM.
Gassers require a lot more RPM to get to their peak torque speed.
The quicker you can get a torque converter to transfer power to the transmission right off idle the better on a diesel.

Torque Converter Replacement Time!

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